Son in law's temper

You can't get in the middle of their marriage. EVER. A parent should never get in the middle of an AC's relationship and an AC should never ask a parent to get in the middle. A parent's instinct is to protect a child, which means a parent is not an objective mediator.

I'm not saying it's right for your SIL to lose his temper. It's not. But your daughter has to make a decision about what she can and can't live with. Be mindful that it's often very difficult for a woman to leave an emotionally or physically abusive relationship for many reasons.

If you're seriously concerned you need to contact Social Services. Unfortunately emotional abuse is very hard to prove and that could backfire. While I recognize it's a difficult situation, there's not really a good option for you.

I would have to say something, depending on what you mean by 'taking it out' on the children.
I really couldn't sit back and say nothing.

He shouts at them, really loudly.

Ah, that's horrible.
No doubt if you say anything he'll shout loudly at you, too?
Its really down to your daughter to put a stop to it; does she think its ok to behave how he does, do you think? Or is she browbeaten by him?

She says she stands up to him when I'm not there but she's not always there when I am to see how he behaves with the children. I have to say the children love him and he adores them, but one is quite anxious and this behaviour doesn't help or set a good example.

Stay out of it,many years ago when my OH was going through a very stressful time he had a temper issue.He would never have harmed any of us ,but cups hit walls frequently and doors banged and we walked on tip toes around him.
There were very good reasons why he was so stressed so I knew he would likely come out the other side of it.Hopefully your SIL is the same .As long as the kids are still happy around him then there isn't likely to be lasting damage ...in my experience.My daughter was 7 when we went through this and she adores her dad and did back then too .Give him space and dont criticise him to your daughter ,remember she knows him far better than you do.

If you're seriously concerned you need to contact Social Services

Please don't keep imploring people to contact Social Services agnurse, they would be most unlikely to get involved in this.

If it was me.
I would not interfere because I would become a target and my daughter would defend me and make the situation worse.
I would also quietly prepare myself for a separation, cash is always useful and emergency accommodation if possible

I agree Chewbacca
I think it’s hard but you need to step back as both have asked you to It sounds as if your daughter has a handle on it and as you say he has improved maybe it’s something he’s trying to work on himself
You say the children love him and he adores them so it maybe affects them less than it effects you
If his best friend was really upset is this out of character for him as surely a best friend would know his mate was a shouty, jump up and down person
Does the marriage and fatherhood seem good other than him shouting ?

Can you talk to your daughter in private about it when he's not there? This emotional abuse and will take its toll on the children over time. I feel forever guilty that Indidnt leave my husband before my girls were adult. They still remember how awful their father was, .they were often frightened of him as children.

I would not do anything at this point confused you say the children love him etc so just be there for them if needed and asked. I agree with twiceasnice have a word with your daughter on her own but don't criticise, offer support and let them work it out.
It's difficult to stand back in these situations I know, but you can give the children a calm loving environment when they visit you.

Twiceasnice there is a big difference between an awful father and a adoring but shouty father Shouting isn’t necessarily emotional abuse if he’s shouting at his own stupidity or frustration it isn’t, obviously if he’s shouting to frightened the wife or critising and belittling her and/or the children then it is emotional abuse
I think the poster has spoken to the daughter and was told it’s not her business The daughter doesn’t sound afraid of him
I would suggest if you are in the home and he starts ranting you think of a reason to take the boys to play in the garden or ask them to show you something in their room while he boils
I m guessing and it is only guessing that he is over it quickly and everything’s back to normal Also Confused is quoting a situation that happened a few weeks ago So we have no idea if these are daily occurrences or just occasionally

I'm with diana.
DD's escape fund was put in place and we found a house for her to rent so she could walk away (with 4 children) from emotional and mental abuse and bullying.
He still sees his children but seems to cope better when he doesn't have to shoulder any family responsibilities other than having them most weekends and organising a monthly standing order.
Not an ideal father, but with his influence limited the children are coping. DGS however is now showing some of his traits re
temper and sulking.

It is alarming that the son-in-law has so little control over his temper that he loses it publicly, in front of his mother- in-law, friend and young children. Bad manners, apart from anything else.
All she can do is remove the children from a potentially frightening situation by going elsewhere in the house. She can't interfere unless he starts taking his bad temper on her.
But this sort of behaviour is not good, does damage children, and the fact that they adore him does not mean they have escaped unscathed. I had a father in law like this who gave free rein to his (frightening) temper whenever he felt like it, and his son, my ex-husband, imitated it.

He and my daughter say it is none of my business .

If your daughter is on her husband's side in this matter, it's time to keep out of it. He is shouting, not hitting anyone. His children adore him and his wife supports him. Stay out of it.

I DO worry about the children imitating his behaviour.

You could always get a leaflet on anger management courses and leave it at your daughters house. My eldest Son had an anger issue and found the courses he took really helpful. Of course the person concerned needs to acknowledge they have a problem and seek help but it's worth a try.

If he has always behaved this way it probably does not affect the children, shouting will seem the norm to them.

If your daughter was unhappy she would ask for help.
Awful to have to listen to, maybe have your daughter and grandchildren to visit you without the son in law then you will not have to witness it.

Thank you everyone for your posts. My thinking is a bit clearer now.

The reason I always say contact Social Services is because it isn't another person's place to criticize someone else's parenting. If you think the children are at serious risk then the authorities need to be notified. If they aren't, then you need to leave it.

Let's try replacing the word "grandparent" with "friend". Would you consider it appropriate for a friend to criticize your parenting? What about a stranger?

Point is, if there's no actual abuse occurring, it's not on to criticize someone else's parenting.

Now, that said, I do think it's reasonable to have rules in your home that are to be followed. For example, if the GC are at yours and you don't allow eating outside the kitchen, you're well within your rights to remind them of that rule. But you can't say to your AC "I think you're wrong in yelling at your children" or "You ought to parent them this way". In my house that would be an instant case of until you apologize you won't be seeing me or my kids again.

Is shouting at a 3 year old abusive?
I think its worse than breaking an Ipad, and a lot of people were incensed at that.

agnurse there is a subtle difference between criticising and advice given with tea love and care which can be a normal part of relationships! I remember gently advising my mum about some things she needed to consider as she got older ...it was a reality check for her! I remember her advising me about a couple of parenting things with my kids - I valued her experience and wisdom, despite it being criticism(given with love!). Now I know son don't take it/hear it Ike that but that doesn't mean loving constructive criticism does not exist!
The OP was asking if anyone thought she should raise the issue...she is entitled to ask that...and only she knows whether she can give it and have it received as loving constructive advice

"...true love..." ..."some don't hear ..."

Sorry Bluebelle I disagree . Constant shouting around and at children is emotional abuse. I have worked in child protection and safeguarding all my life. An angry father shouting at small children looks like a giant and is very frightening. The OP says he "takes it out on the children" that could mean many things but it doesn't sound good to me. His wife may not be afraid of him or she may be justifying that he is not too bad and be unaware or in denial of how it affects the children. Children in an abusive situation do sometimes still " adore" their father again for complicated reasons, that does not make the fathers actions ok and it will affect them in time, I've seen the results in my own and other children