Secular pastors

I think you have grasped the nub of my idea Joan - that is exactly what I have in mind.

I too love church architecture - they are places with beauty and a certain gravitas which is needed for ceremonies that are important to us - I cannot bear the tacky nature of so many registry offices.

I love your idea, Mishap. I am quite sure many people continue to go to church for the social/caring aspect, long after losing any belief in a mythical, supernatural, all-knowing figure.

I think the humanists would be a good organisation to work on such an idea, and clearly under-used churches would be an ideal location. I love church architecture, stained glass windows and the lovely atmosphere.

Christmas and Easter festivities, plus hatches matches and dispatches could be performed there. After all, the Christmas date was chosen because it was the same time as pagan yuletide or midwinter festivals, Easter is springtime and a celebration of nature's re-birth, and a harvest festival is another pagan rite made religious to keep it in the church. I see no conflict with religion anywhere.

Pastors could be trained in aspects of different religious beliefs, as well as social work so that they understood the people they ministered. Many atheists come from a religious background and this continues to have bearing on them, either negatively or positively, so a secular pastor would have to be educated in these matters.

Hmm - I can foresee massive resistance....it would only work in small, friendly communities.

I guess it would be like Homestart, but for the whole population rather than only parents and children.

Maybe..........

I guess to some people visits from the vicar when one is sick feel a bit like busybodying - so no change there really. But most of us accept the visit in the spirit of kindness in which it is meant, even though we might be happier to do without the religious strings attached.

I would presume that visits from a secular pastor would be viewed in the same light - might indeed feel more comfortable to some people.

Indeed there would need to be practical financial arrangements and an acceptance by the community to support this role because it was of value. In the same way that churchgoers support their vicars through collections and fundraising.

Truly Elegran, social workers do not do this job - they really are simply local authority minions. They used to represent the caring face of the state, but no longer. They are simply making sure that local authorities stay within the law and within budget.

I don't think people would accept it. Sounds like busy-bodying to me. I think it would do to a lot of people.

Social workers are supposed to do this kind of job, but when it becomes a career all kinds of influences come into play. The secular pastors would need to be financed somehow. How?

It sounds like a good idea but being somewhat religious myself, I feel priests, rabbis, ministers (insert equivalent from religion of your choice) offer some kind of authority because of their position. The shepherd is in charge of his flock and has accepted responsibility for them. (His flock being anyone who puts themselves under his/her care). Someone acting as a pastor on his/her own authority is either potentially very dangerous if they try to make a career of it or is,er, just a friend if they look after you.

Thanks !

Local Authority Nonu

L A > Mishap what do you mean ?

Social workers are now financial gatekeepers for the LA - not what I have in mind at all!

Family doctors have 7 minutes for each patient and do virtually no home visiting now - that is covered by out-of-hours deputising services - again not quite what I have in mind!

The word pastor comes from Latin and means shepherd - a good description I think for someone who would have responsibilities to care for the local people in many different ways. A shepherd cares for his/her flock - the fact that Christianity has used this term doesn't detract from its real meaning.

They would just be social workers, wouldn't they? Or the CAB?

You say they would be "pastors". Don't pastors care for people's souls? According to the non-Christian way of thinking, surely people don't have souls.

Aren't family doctors supposed to fulfill this role?

That sounds good PoppaRob - but I would also like to see them being lodged in their communities with a similar supportive role to vicars.

It's ok Mishap, I was being cheeky. I was raise C of E here in Australia and went to a church school, so of course by the time i was 18 or so I was agnostic and sometime in my 20's I decided atheism was the path for me. Here in Australia registered marriage celebrants also do naming ceremonies, funerals, renewal of vows etc. Seems a sensible approach to me.

Yes - those are what CofE stands for I guess. But I was thinking about a secular approach to pastoral care and the celebration of the seasons, family events and community gatherings. I am sure that my local vicar would be hugely sympathetic to the idea - and what Christian would not, I ask myself, since concern for others is apparently central to the doctrine?

Christmas and Easter. Isn't that what CE stands for?

Nonu.

I think it is an interesting idea Mishap - but might have to start as voluntary thing. I met an ex teacher who was a "celebrant" not a humanist I think. Variant on the theme of public speaking.

Harvest festival. Today I picked a cucumber, some tomatoes, a white onion (well, lifted), and basil for lunch. I thanked the earth for the nutrients, the rain for watering, and my hard work. Simple.
It was a delicious lunch and I thorough enjoyed it.

Well I"m sorry , we Don"t attend church on a weekly basis , but we do try to get there at Easter and for SURE ON cHRISTMAS MORNING , 8AM MASS , IT does not impinge in any way shape or form for the rest of the day , it"s just want we want to do . However , I certainly wouldn"t impose my views on anyone else . I enjoy a good laugh , sometimes I go OTT, but what the heck , this is not a rehearsal . ENJOY.

Yes, but most of us still know what the meaning of Christmas is, even if we don't go to Church on Christmas Day. Just because commercialism has taken over doesn't mean we've lost sight of the religious aspect. Inviting a secular pastor to celebrate some sort of Winterval festival in the local Church at Christmas is probably asking for trouble, locally!

Nonu - I think Mishap is right. I tried to think of anybody of my acquaintance who has a 'religious' Christmas and could not think of anyone. Even my nominally Christian relatives and friends no longer go to Church at Christmas (well maybe for Coffee and Carols a week before) preferring to be at home with family, presents, food and drink. Indeed the Wee Kirk almost next door to us does not open at all on Christmas Eve or Day. They share the Watchnight service with the Big Kirk further up the road in order to keep up the numbers. In this village, with a population of approx 2,500, around 60 people will attend church on Christmas day. I think this is about the norm nowadays?

Seriously , I googled , and dropped on a site that did text speak , of course quite a lot is American and also a bit saucy , maybe too much for our English \Rose ears , but on the other hand !!! but I am afraid YOYO , I am a sausage me , think I might have that libation now to celebrate WIGO AND FRANKEL

No TINKER, SUCH A Laugh , I am practising my text speak on u guys so that that I can cofuse DD"S and friends, is it working I ponder , I lay awake all night worrying. {you know thats a big fat lie ] I sleep for England , giggle giggle