American Evangelical Christians

I wonder how many realise that Evangelical American churches are moving into Britain.. I attended a lovely carol service in 2019 held in a lovely old church which has been rescued from ruin and restored. Much of the restoration was done by American volunteers and the money came from America. The men leading the service were American, The congregation were lovely friendly people with families with young children. Apparently a few members of the church move into areas which have under used places of worship, set up a church and recruit local people, when the congregation is large enough some of them move on to a new area. The restored church was the third one they had started and they were already starting a fourth. I do wonder what effect the introduction of these churches will have on British politics.

@welbeck, my sister who’s lived in the US since her early 20s (now late 60s) and is a staunch Democrat, couldn’t stand Hillary Clinton and I gather that many of her Democrat friends felt exactly the same. It was felt that she was just a Republican-lite, who’d be in thrall to big business, and nothing much would change.

She also seemed to have a sense of entitlement to the Presidency, and that was another factor.
They wanted Bernie Sanders, but he was evidently too Left for your average Democrat.

She doesn’t care for Biden either, and voted for an independent this time - knowing that the Democrats were in any case safe in her area - Massachusetts.

can anyone who understands USA explain why Hillary Clinton is such a hated figure.
i can see why some might not like her husband, but why does she stir such animosity, and knowing that wasn't it stupid for the Democrats to put her up against DT. just think if the last four years had never been...

Me too. Makes me sick.

Witzend I am inclined to agree. I once got trapped on a plane (internal UK) stuck next to an evangelical Christian business man who put all his success down to his belief in Jesus Christ and being given the reward for his faithfulness.

I could have taken him on and pointed out that the biblical Jesus' misssion was to the poor, but I decided it wasn't worth the effort.

I too find the link between eveangelical Christianity and the pursuit of money very odd.

Back in what was probably the early 80s, we were stuck between flights in an American hotel room, when our ongoing flight had been badly delayed.

Having switched the TV on we happened to hit first on an evangelical Christian TV show. Whoever was the front man, he was constantly saying that such and such a person had been cured of cancer, etc. - and implying that it was down to his followers (aka donors’) prayers - and along the bottom of the screen was one of those constantly moving bands telling you where to phone and donate, and also IIRC who else had just done so.

Having never seen, heard, or even imagined anything like it, I was both shocked and appalled - as well as being grimly fascinated. The not-so-hidden agenda of getting $$$$$ rolling in was plain enough.

Ever since then, the mere words ‘evangelical Christian’ make me shudder. This may well be unfair in some cases, but it’s still the visceral reaction to what we saw - which I later gathered was nothing especially unusual across the pond.

Well said Luckygirl ?
FWIW I’m a Humanist.

BeverleyJB I really couldn’t say but his remark sounds contemptuous to me. There is so much about face in politics. Politicians do things to get votes. Having got the votes they then need to keep them so maybe that was why. I remember the chant during the Vietnam War “How many have you killed today LBJ?” So not as popular a President as you might think.

M0nica

The core sentence in the article Varian posted a link to, and which narrowly answers the question in the OP is the following:

Many evangelicals have followed Trump: because he has implemented pro-life policies during his presidency. He also endorsed support for Israel, religious liberty and conservative judges.

The USA, from the start was a place of refuge for those whose religious beliefs were unacceptable in their home societies, whether you were a protestant radical or had an entirely new religion of their own devising (Christian Scientist, Church of the latterday Saints and some of the larger groups. Many cults that followed. Religon is part of the foundation of the country.

The USA is a large country with wildernesses and backwoods we cannot even imagine, so if people do not like what you believe or teach, there is also somewhere else to go. The less these conservative groups have to live close to non-members, societies, the more set in their ways they become.

Why do God and Guns go together because many of these groups live in these far west wildernesses and vast empty spaces, where, in the past guns were essential to eat and to stay alive when bad men arive, there are no police or the nearest policeman is 100 miles away.

Donald Trump is not immoral, he is amoral . He wouldn't recognise a moral if it picked up a stick and poked him in the eye.

Thank you M0nica this says everything I've ever thought (or known) about USA.

25Avalon

Well MaisieD it should do. It shows how the rights of black people have constantly been undermined in the USA and how appallingly they have been treated. It was the democrat Lyndon B Johnson who contemptuously referred to them as n*****s that he would get on board to vote Democrat for the next 200 years.

Avalon - If LBJ was so contemptuous about African Americans, can you explain why he carried on with the work done by JFK including getting the Civil Rights Act passed in 1964 - which outlawed segregation etc? I have been to the LBJ museum in Austin and one of the displays included a telegram that had been sent to him by a citizen, which had only two words - “N***er lover” - so some Americans obviously had the completely opposite opinion of him.

When I was a young parent we attended an evangelical church. At that time Dr James Dobson (look him up) was the guru of all things child rearing for Christian parents. Video showings of his teachings in church and popular books. Dare to discipline was one I recall.

This fits with the original sin idea, and children need to be tamed ie beaten into following the right path. Looking back this was the beginning of the unravelling of my faith, and subsequently leaving the church.

I have sinned and I really enjoyed it

Oh heavens no - not the "we have all sinned" guilt trip! - groan!

Religion has a lot to answer for.

Ditch the guilt and just do your best to be kind to all. That is the beginning and the end of life - nothing else to get your head around.

We believe that all have sinned, every one of us.

I think that many Baptist churches in the US have predominently black congregations who tend to vote for the Domocrats.

A very old (in both senses) American friend has always belonged to a Baptist Church that describes itself as 'evangelical' in the sense that that they reach out to people and 'show the love of God'. They are not at all right-wing, but espouse the causes that we would think of as liberal/left. They do a great deal of good work in their community.
They do not 'condemn the sinner' but make very clear that this brand of Christianity is not theirs.

Martin Griffiths writing in The San Francisco Chronicle says Trump evangelicals must repent after turning blind eye to evil these past 4 years.

"The truth is that evangelical leaders made a pact with the devil, winning hundreds of judges who oppose abortion and same-sex marriage in exchange for ignoring Trump’s constant lies and moral failings.

As a result, they hastened the national descent from strict, fact-based truth, and helped Trump warp the political system to the point that many of his supporters are calling the Capitol mob “patriots” and claim the election was stolen from him."

www.sfchronicle.com/opinion/openforum/article/Trump-evangelicals-must-repent-after-turning-15869051.php

Going slightly off tack: My cousin voted Republican last time because she absolutely loathed Hillary Clinton, and I suppose for her, and for many others, Trump was different, a change, not a politician. Politicians had let many people down and they saw Trump as something refreshingly different. This I can understand. However, what I do have a problem with is having endured the four years of his chaotic presidency, millions chose to vote for him again. I have not asked my cousin how she voted for it is not my business ( and I am not sure how I would feel if she said she had voted for him!).

Just watched that - very good illustration of how selectively the bible can be used!

An absolute classic, varian, and my favourite scene (of so many) from The West Wing. Thanks for the link.

In this scene from "The West Wing." President Bartlett.who has read the Bible, confronts a right wing evangelical radio host who says that homosexuality is an abomination.

youtu.be/S1-ip47WYWc

Luckygirl

It seems to me that Christianity means whatever a particular Christian wants it to mean.

With little of Jesus Christ's message left in much of what is spouted.

Thu 21-Jan-21 14:25:10 So they see self-reliance almost as an eleventh commandment - Thou shalt labour to look after thyself and thy family and those who cannot or will not, shall be cast out and perish.’
(Or something like that.).

We may not have an actual bible belt but we certainly have people in this country whose mantra is exactly that Witzend

If NannyC2 starts posting Roanoke we should all start worrying

(Joke, referencing a horror story)

It seems to me that Christianity means whatever a particular Christian wants it to mean.