Religeous intolerance

Things aren’t fraught because of the pandemic - surely you remember the same scenes two years ago over same sex families being acknowledged? It’s about a relatively small group of male religious fundamentalists who thrive on sowing dissent and conflict and have no interest in any resolution just getting their own way.

Sorry just seen you said the same thing MOnica about the image of the prophet.

^that poor teacher ^ I really can't sympathise with him he must have known what sort of reaction showing the cartoon would elicit. Of course I don't agree with the protesters but with things being fraught over pandemic issues there was no need to light the blue touch paper. He has put his school, his family and himself in danger.
I thought the issue was around showing an image of the prophet, not sure if that's correct though.

Gill well to start with they are all men so very representative of the community. They are not imo interested in proper dialogue but just waiting for something to protest about . It would be interesting to know about the composition of the governing body and the parent governors.

Thank you for explaining Monica

The scenes of that ranting mob outside the school, refusing to even give the Police the courtesy of listening to the statement issued made me very angry. Religious tolerance is a mainstay of a civilised society, and from what I understand, the teacher concerned was leading a discussion on blasphemy and what it means to different religious groups. If the outcome wasn't so chilling, the irony would be laughable. As for the headteacher, I will give him the benefit of doubt by thinking that he was trying to defuse the situation, but in truth I thought him weak and mealy mouthed. These people, ignorant people, are trying to impose their own narrow minded opinions on others, are denying their own children the opportunity to discuss and understand what blasphemy means to different religions, I wonder why they have even bothered to allow their children to attend a grammar school when they obviously are not interested in the children having a broad based education. As for these 'community leaders' who the hell are they, and who appoints them to the position?

JaneJudge the representation of the human face in Islam is forbidden because they consider that it may lead to idol worship - worshipping the image and not the person behind it.

That is the first reason why this cartoon was offensive to Muslims in this classroom. Secondly reason it was offensive was because the Islamic fath has very strong views on basphemy, far stronger than any other faith, so this cartoon is offensive on two grounds as it also represented Mohamed, and in an insulting way..

This is not an event where there are two sides right or wrong. This is an event where both sides are in the wrong. A teacher who shows a bit of paper in a class, where he knows it will outrage the religious beliefs of many of those present is in the wrong. I do not know what the topic under discussion in this classroom was, but tolerance is about respecting people's beliefs where they are not harmful and condemning them where they are.

For exaample, I would always respect a muslims desire not to see representations of their prophet's face in a drawing or cartoon, while condemning the persecution of Christians in Pakistan, a muslim counry, under their murderous blasphemy laws.

I think this teacher was stupid and disrespectful of his pupils. I think the demonstrations were completely unwarranted, and as always nowadays, within an hour or so, taken over by extremists with no involvement with this school.

A delegation of the parents, as there were so many, should have contacted the school and spoken to the Head teacher about this issue. There was no suggestion that the head Teacher was unsympathetic or did not take the subject seriously.

Suziewoozie, at age 14 the children are old enough to be taught that discretion is sometimes the better part of valour.

Rosie wrote:

"Alexa

Riverwalk, it's true there is no right to not be offended. However it is also well known that Islamic fundies are a bloody nuisance even dangerous in some cases, and it is politic for everyone's safety to tread lightly around know triggers of their emotional reactions

Once you give in to bullies, they don't go away, they tend to just increase their demands. At what point are you going to say, this far and no further?"(end of Rosie's comment).

As I was writing my reply to Riverwalk I thought of this objection.
There was a problem recently about Muslim father objecting to teaching about saying it is okay for a child to have same sex parents. In that case the primary school I know absolutely stuck to its guns, as the immediate inclusion and wellbeing of actual children was involved. In the case of the free speech debate the matter was not immediate but academic at the point of teaching it to a class.

Apparently this is a year 9 class so most pupils will be 14 - should we just leave them to not develop any critical thinking facilities re religious beliefs about freedom of speech? What a good idea. Sarcasm alert - then they can be radicalised outside of school and we can all tut tut and ask what on earth the schools are doing to prevent this.
Also one of the groups involved in the protest, Purpose of Life, a registered charity ( fwtw) deliberately tweeted the name of the teacher. Nice. What’s it called again, purpose of what?

I agree white rabbit.
So it's ok for my flat earther to be offended because that's not true but not ok for other people to be offended because the teacher told the truth.

Alexa

Riverwalk, it's true there is no right to not be offended. However it is also well known that Islamic fundies are a bloody nuisance even dangerous in some cases, and it is politic for everyone's safety to tread lightly around know triggers of their emotional reactions

Once you give in to bullies, they don't go away, they tend to just increase their demands. At what point are you going to say, this far and no further?

Correction "can be a bloody nuisance".

Riverwalk, it's true there is no right to not be offended. However it is also well known that Islamic fundies are a bloody nuisance even dangerous in some cases, and it is politic for everyone's safety to tread lightly around know triggers of their emotional reactions

Christianity is not as important in Britain as it once was, but other faiths can be immensely important to their members, witness all the trouble this recent incident has caused.

It's true Christianity isn't as widespread in Britain as it was, but it is important to its adherents, just they tend not to murder blasphemers having been exposed to such ad infinitum.

For those criticising the headteacher - to be honest I think he was thinking of the safety of his pupils and staff. He shouldn't have to think along those lines but the reality is he has to.

I can only assume the young RE teacher was naive in introducing the cartoon to his class - based on the fate of the French teacher Samuel Paty.

If any of the protestors make threats or overstep the law in a serious way they should be dealt with - there is no right to not be offended.

The poor man. We are supposed to live a country which educates its children. Part of that education is understanding religions and that entails learning their history and also why they are criticised.

Indeed, all religions should be open to criticism, if they are so fragile that they have to have mob rule to defend them it's a pretty poor belief system in the first place.

This, at the end of the day, is a free country. Whether people should or should not be allowed to mock others for their politics or beliefs is for debate, but it should never be censored.

Religious Education used to be the one subject that was compulsory in England; this came to light at the time of the development of the National Curriculum, in the 1990s.
Christianity is not as important in Britain as it once was, but other faiths can be immensely important to their members, witness all the trouble this recent incident has caused.
I do think it is important that pupils are given some knowledge of comparative religions, in order to understand the importance of customs and practices that people of different ethnicity follow.
The trouble with teaching it as a subject is that most teachers have only a limited knowledge of different religions, and some of the teaching materials available are banal and can lead to misunderstanding.
Respect and tolerance for other faiths are essential aspects of teaching comparative religions, and this needs to be understood by all faith communities.

The family member who believes the earth is flat was deeply upset by the teachers scientific explanation. Good. They deserve to be upset because they are teaching that child things that aren't true.

As I said, none of us have a right not to be offended. But if you had something whose very existence you knew had caused murder to be committed in the last few months, would you use it again? Something that has been in the news? Would you show it to children? Or would you have a discussion with pupils about toleration and why some people are offended by pictures?

On line there is plenty on this as we might expect. Apparently the depiction/cartoon/drawing of Muhammad (take your pick) was shown during a lesson discussing blasphemy and what constitutes said subject?

As a person of Christian Faith, i understand the pain caused by
the people who are angered by the display of the cartoon.

Christians are use to having their faith mocked, we have to accept it.

I find it terrifying that because some people are prepared to murder another person for offending their sensibilities, then everyone has to avoid causing that offence. So law abiding people can be offended as much as you like, just extremists must be pandered to.

The teacher was giving a lesson on blasphemy, which was decriminalised in this Country in 2008. He showed one of the Charlie Hebdo cartoons of the prophet Mohammad with a bomb in his turban. A very strange decision in a school with so many Muslim pupils, but not illegal. But he has been suspended, both the head and the teacher have apologised, an investigation set up, any further action at the present time by parents and community leaders is not justifiable.

The family member who believes the earth is flat was deeply upset by the teachers scientific explanation.
As suzie said the depiction of same sex couples caused some community unrest, I am afraid not teaching things because they may upset people is not acceptable to me.
The school has gone to online teaching today from what I understand.

I also think perspective should be introduced.