losing faith in a loving god

I think you are entirely right that you cannot explain faith to someone who has never experienced it. It is clearly something that is very important in your life and I am glad for you. It clearly feels right for you. Just don't expect me to understand it!!

Just out of interest, were you brought up in a Christian family?

For context, I had a mixed upbringing. My father was what I would call a raving atheist - he was very damaged by and bitter about the war - it turned him from a practising Christian (although I only know that because his mother told me - he said nothing about it) to someone who felt that goodness had left the world. My mother was brought up a Catholic and had a deep hatred of that religion - her father was brought up in a Catholic children's home, where unspeakable cruelties and indignities were perpetrated on him. During her adult life she vaguely sought to find some sort of faith and we children were dragged around various different churches for a while, then she gave it all up.

My first 3 years of schooling were in a private C of E school run by nuns - I was sent there because the local primary was not thought to be good enough. I hated the place. I was terrified of the nuns and even more terrified of the utterly grim near-life size carvings of the stations of the cross and the crucifixion - truly truly grim. The stuff of nightmares to a child. I still cannot understand how people can stand up in church and sing happy hymns with images of blood and cruelty in front of them.

No wonder I have decided that just being as kind as I can has to be the way forward.

Luckygirl3, I see the common belief in religion as easily explained by animistic thinking. It's just the way our minds tend to work. I had interesting conversations with a teacher of Psychology and RE - who was an atheist but found world religions a fascinating subject.

Hi Luckygirl no, my father had no beliefs that I am aware of and although my mother said she was Chapel she made no mention of religion. None of my family are religious including DH. It is only me.
I did go to Sunday school and was confirmed but I think my faith grew stronger later in life. I always felt there was something I believed in.
I don’t blame you for not understanding, I can hardly do so myself. If I’d had the same upbringing as you perhaps I would think differently too. It’s not like I’ve lived a life without problems or troubles.
Many of those on this thread and others say they were raised Catholic. I’m not sure I would feel as I do if I had been brought up with some of the things you had to go through.
I have never believed that only Christians can be good or kind.
Just like I don’t believe that all those who say they are humanists are all good and kind. We are all a mixture of things. Good people can do bad things and bad people can do good things. We all follow our own path.

Yes it is interesting Hetty and the fact that “spirituality” appears common to most humans to a greater or lesser degree.
The neuroscience in this respect is also interesting in that personality traits are heritable and there is a genetic link for how spiritual one is. Religion is different in that it seems to be culturally influenced, and the type of home you are raised in plays a part.
Of course nature and nurture are inextricably linked, but I do find it fascinating.

I agree Doodle. One’s life beliefs do not define whether someone is kind, compassionate, altruistic or not, but hopefully it should influence them.

Farzanah my faith does influence me. I’m not one of the ‘What would Jesus do’ people. I’m not naturally unkind I don’t think but I do have a very sarcastic wit. I am often tempted to come up with a comment that may make people laugh but try hard not to say it in case it hurts someone’s feelings (as is so easy to do)

It's true Luckygirl you cannot explain faith to someone who has never experienced it, like so many other things in life. You can't explain to someone who isn't a parent, what it's like to be one.

Like you Doodle I can't explain it. My parents didn't go to church but I would go to Mass with my maternal GM when ever I could from a very young age, too young to understand but something touched me very deeply and it's never left me.

My grandma was a non believer, which for someone born in 1902, was unusual. She had a great influence in my life, I adored her, so no doubt my lack of faith came from her.

I read an article David Attenborough had written. He is often castigated for not crediting any god for all the amazing things he films. He actually gets hate mail from believers. Which is baffling in itself.

“I don’t know [why we're here]. People sometimes say to me, ‘Why don’t you admit that the humming bird, the butterfly, the Bird of Paradise are proof of the wonderful things produced by Creation?’ And I always say, well, when you say that, you’ve also got to think of a little boy sitting on a river bank, like here, in West Africa, that’s got a little worm, a living organism, in his eye and boring through the eyeball and is slowly turning him blind. The Creator God that you believe in, presumably, also made that little worm. Now I personally find that difficult to accommodate…”

Each to his own of course.

Spot on David - it is all part of this pattern of attributing to god those things that are good and pretending that those things that are bad are nothing to do with the deity, as I have said above.

He actually gets hate mail from believers - much as to be expected. The corrupting influence of religion is everywhere.

I have lots of Christian friends, including a couple of vicars, who would not dream of behaving in this way which shows how religion is open to individual interpretation. It can be used for good or for bad.

The number of replies that indicate loss of faith, and/or puzzlement shows me that many ministers of religion are doing a poor job of explaining the basics of Christianity to their flocks.

Some people suffer gravely through no fault of their own as are the ordinary people of Ukraine. Christianity does not adequately explain why a benevolent God permits this. I gave up religion when I was about 12 and have never looked back. It's basically a tool to keep the peasants happy (jam tomorrow) while the elite carry on stealing and partying.

Grantanow many of the ordinary people who suffer are people of faith. This peasant has had a degree of troubles too but I don’t blame God for it, I turn to my faith to help me in my troubles.

Same for this peasant

How about if a human being knew that there was something otherworldly within them, and when happy excited a feeling things were going right A light followed them How would you account for that?

Of course ther are doodle thats the whole point of religion /faith the folk at the bottom of the tree have something to focus on ,keep them in line .Its GODS will .Nothing to do with whatever political party thats keeping them poor or destroying the health service its not ever Bojo its all down to Gods plan

Your post @ 12.46 speaks for this peasant too Doodle and I'm not at the bottom of the tree paddyann so don't need something to focus on, to keep me in line.

Paddyann I wish no disrespect but I don’t think anyone knows what Gods plan is let alone those who don’t have faith.
You talk about those with faith as though we are all idiots allowing ourselves to be lulled into some sense of false security.
I find it very condescending of you and others who don’t believe telling those of faith their beliefs are wrong.
I don’t object to your opinion but please don’t presume to tell me what my faith is. Like Smileless I’m not at the bottom of any tree.

Paddyanne my g grandfather was an ordained minister, he
worked tirelessly for the soup kitchens , when he died the streets to the cemetery were lined.

He was a close friend of Keir Hardie, I have letters from Hardie
relating to his fight to become the first Labour MP, the letters
acknowledge the help and support my g grandfather gave him.

So faith and politics can work together

I do not have a faith, but have no problem with those who do - as long as their faith results in them acting for the good of those around them I do not see it as a problem. Sadly we all know of those whose response to their religion is not to the benefit of those around them, either locally or on a global scale.

Yes we do Luckygirl and we also know of those whose actions do not benefit "those around them, either locally or on a global scale", whose actions are not in response to their religion.

Doodle

Paddyann I wish no disrespect but I don’t think anyone knows what Gods plan is let alone those who don’t have faith.
You talk about those with faith as though we are all idiots allowing ourselves to be lulled into some sense of false security.
I find it very condescending of you and others who don’t believe telling those of faith their beliefs are wrong.
I don’t object to your opinion but please don’t presume to tell me what my faith is. Like Smileless I’m not at the bottom of any tree.

Very well said!

paddyann54

Of course ther are doodle thats the whole point of religion /faith the folk at the bottom of the tree have something to focus on ,keep them in line .Its GODS will .Nothing to do with whatever political party thats keeping them poor or destroying the health service its not ever Bojo its all down to Gods plan

Or having faith in the SNP which is keeping you in line.

Faith is a very personal thing, paddyanne.
Who is to say who is right and who are you to think you are superior to those who believe in a God?

(Apologies to Alegrias if she is reading this)

Who's Alegrias?

I'm sure she'd think that was a very silly opening line to the post.

I think she left GN.

A pity, she posted some good graphs.
I like a graph.

volver

Who's Alegrias?

I'm sure she'd think that was a very silly opening line to the post.

Oh...did you never ‘ meet ‘ her......????