That burkini!

The very word shouts out oppression, why call anything a Burkini. I have been on holiday and seen women clothed from head to toe, venturing into the sea,with enormous difficulty, it is totally ridiculous, whilst their scantily clad spouses merrily swim off. I wonder why the men are so insecure that they are afraid that anyone might see any part of their wives anatomy,even their hair. Whereas the world and his wife can see theirs. This is a democratic country, it is not what our grandmothers struggled for. I have visited many countries and accepted their customs out of respect, whilst not agreeing with them. So I think M and S have lost the plot. You know what they can donwith their Burkini.

Very well said Lucky

I am amazed that British people who can afford to holiday in such exotic places speak like that, perhaps even the canaries have cheap, tough and rough holiday areas .

Anniebach what people can afford is absolutely nothing to do with their behaviour at times. My D lived in Antigua for some years and the flight was such that it either landed in Barbados on the way out or picked up there on the way back. Some of the families who must have spent many thousands on their holidays were people you would not have wanted for neighbours. That is probably my unacceptable side coming out but very true.

So I googled "showering and Swimming Pools"
and I found this: (apologies for the link, I am emphatically NOT advertising!!
I just don't think we Brits need to beat ourselves up over IMHO a red herring an irrelevance to the discussion.
Showering
Swimming
The United States of America
Swimming: Why do people in America not shower before they get into the pool?
I've been noticing this for 8+ years now. Efforts to buck the habit have been unsuccessful
4 Answers
Clinton Combs Owner of www.TechnicalPoolRepair.com
2.3k Views • Clinton is a Most Viewed Writer in Swimming Pools.
Two reasons: First, Americans don't understand the reason to shower before entering a pool (and if they don't understand it, they won't do it), and second, Americans are increasingly reluctant to be naked in a locker room
etc etc etc

Anniebach. Reality alert!! People with money DO swear.

Yes I know people with money swear, but do wealthy people not own / rent holiday homes with swimming pool, I am sure there have been British people who have used abusive language in public swimming pools , but in every country?

Nankate no offence taken and no apology required- but thanks.

janeaw- in the past you have got at me for mentioning that the Deep South of the USA still has very racist undertones, with the KKK still very much there, barel hidden under the surface. Often thought about you during the Trump campaign, when much evidence to that came to light- But we digress, so back to this thread.

The Burkini is not an issue at all with hygiene, but not showering before the pool is, here, there or anywhere.

Of course showering will not get rid of all bacteria, and that is fine. But washing sweat mixed with suntan lotions really does help with pool hygiene. As far as piddling in the pool, that is the least of your worries- it is fecal matter that is the problem. Anyone who, say, cycles in the shorts they intend to wear in the pool, will sweat on the saddle and leak anal fluids. This is the main area that needs thorough showering before going into the pool.

Alea - many of us have handled several jobs and rôles in our lives- are you really doubting my word here (wouldn't be the first time sadly).

Wouldn't dream of arousing anybody's fury

Annie- perhaps some people are less prone to swear at staff reminding them of the rules (reasons were well explained again and again in newsletter) - if they have been brought up with clear scientific evidence about how showering is essential and how to do it (a quick sprinkle from top for 3 seconds won't do much)- and the risks if you don't (eg risk of breathing difficulties, skin rashes, etc, from staff having to increase cleaning products, chlorine or other to keep within safety rules and the law), but also gastroenteritis and worse.

The % of people in anyone country accepting proper showering as the norm, eg automatic, depends very much on the education given from a young age- as in skandinavian countries, Germany, etc. At our school education board, teachers at our local primary school say they do not mind if the kids only have a short time in the pool at the first visit- and that teaching them how to shower effectively (eg clean the back area) is more important the first time, and explaining the reasons why.

no fury Alea- I have learnt from the past. No-one, not even you and your constant personal attacks will do that. Try as you might. I wish you a great day.

janeaw- in the past you have got at me for mentioning that the Deep South of the USA still has very racist undertones, with the KKK still very much there, barel hidden under the surface. Often thought about you during the Trump campaign, when much evidence to that came to light- But we digress, so back to this thread.

Well thank you for that gj. As I remember the exchange, it was another sweeping generalisation on your part, on that occasion anti-American rather than anti-British.

Or even of arousing anybody's furry

What was truly disgusting was the other guests, mainly Brits and some Germans, who would cover themselves with loads of suntan oil, sweat for a couple of hours, jump in the pool (without using the showers which were at each end of the pool and the many signs present saysing showing was compusory) and then start all over again- several times a day! Now THAT is disgusting and unhygienic

The % of people in anyone country accepting proper showering as the norm, eg automatic, depends very much on the education given from a young age- as in skandinavian countries, Germany, etc.

So: My conclusion from those two statements is that the British are not taught how to be clean, but the Germans are and ignore the lessons they have learnt.

I do hope that is not a racist comment about the Germans, there seem to be enough racist comments on this thread already (and by 'racist' I do not mean anti-Muslim as one cannot be racist about the religion of many different peoples around the world).

If there are signs saying showering before entering the pool is compulsory why do the pool attendants not have the guilty removed from the premises

That would be interesting

Jalima, of course it is not a racist statement, and I am sure you know that. I should have said 'a few' instead fo some. Perhaps they felt as so many didn't bother, why them?

Jalima, doing this means abuse to staff, and letters 10 pages long (I know!) ... and of course very different in a public or private pool.

Jalima, doing this means abuse to staff, and letters 10 pages long (I know!) ... and of course very different in a public or private pool.
I have no idea what that second paragraph means.

Well, my conclusion is (for what it is worth) we should all wear M&S rather unflattering burkinis if we wish to swim in a pool (men included). Then we will all be nice and hygienic and any lingering fecal matter presumably contained.

I have never worn a bikini anyway (too much exposed flesh to get burnt).

Given that this started by being an ostensibly lighthearted thread about beachwear and the freedom for women of religious groups who might otherwise not be able, to enjoy the seaside it has been well and truly railroaded in directions few of us might have expected including UK and German showering habits, or not as the case may be. Why that particular red herring was introduced is still a mystery unless it was just an opportunity to say how much worse our habits are than those in other European countries. Easy to criticise and maybe hard to provide evidence to the contrary , for those of us who have not experienced the charms of Sharm. I would hesitate to judge the behaviour of Brits/Americans, French or indeed the Germans. However I still remember swimming in a lake in France and seeing a dog poo floating in the water inches from my face . "C'est une crotte, Madame" shrugged the attendant , the "eh, alors?" left unspoken.
The fine detail of budgie smugglers v. letting it all hang out, faecal matter (eugh!!) was enough to put a person off their Easter eggs, so the less said the better.
So Burkini -liberating or oppressive?
Hygienic or not?
Money-maker for Marksies? - the jury's definitely out!!

PS I fully expect to be shot down in flames as this is bound to be construed as a "personal attack" on someone or other

Message deleted by Gransnet for breaking our forum guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

jalima, I don't get that you don't (get it)- it is as clear as a bell. If attendants remind people and attempt to stop them entering the pool unless they shower, the staff get insulted. At the private pool where I worked as a volunteer Director (unpaid)- I'll always remember one member who had been reminded time and time again, to shower and his children too- he gave the 'finger' to the member of stuff, put one foot under the shower and one hand from each 3 kids (he had just come from work and kids from school) and jumped in (which was not allowed either).

He did get a letter from the Committee threatening to be removed from the onwers' and members' list - and calmed down and showered, reluctantly and not properly (eg 10 seconds quick through- better than nothing) after that. Is that a bit clearer?

violently? no-one has been violent as far as I can see.

Who are your buddies Alea? Can I be one please (feeling left out, didn't realise that people had groups on here).

I'm a sole trader.

it was important to state that hygiene issues are not linked to the burkini, at all (or is it ok to cal people dirty, etc- as long as they are 'different'?)
No-one has called anyone dirty apart from you saying that about the British and some Germans granjura

I cannot follow any of the twisted logic in the previous post.

Yes, it is clearer about the pool attendant granjura, I thought you meant the one in Sharm el wherever.

Still interested why all these people in all these countries were allowed to ignore rules and use foul language to the staff