Impeachment(Spoilers )

Pepper59, you mention “Joanna”, do you mean Juanita?
I felt very sorry for Paula Jones, manipulated by everyone around her.

Did anyone see the Christine Keeler dramatisation on BBC? I saw her in a whole new light too - another vulnerable young girl, taken advantage of by powerful men.

I didn't miss that sparklefizz but saw nothing going on between them when they were together. No apparent sexual chemistry at all. Anything we heard was only reported. She was made out to be such a sweet innocent until it all came out.

You don’t believe there was a sexual relationship and Lewinsky made it up?

Oh no. My complaint is only about how it was presented in that drama. I'm quite sure there was a very sexual relationship but it was not shown like that in the programme - she was made out as a sweet little thing. Sweet little things don't generally do the sorts of things she did? Cigar anyone?!

Try not to get irritated as it a production for entertainment purposes. Everything is exaggerated in these matters. Hollywood does not make or produces films and tv productions for the purposes of telling the truth.
You should all know this to be the case.

Sadly, people very rarely care about the victims of crimes, irrespective of what the crime committed against them was, or whether they are men or women.

And of course any involvement in sexual misdemeanours is still regarded as far more damaging to women than to men.

If we are to change this, we need to complain to newspapers that print articles that damage women more than men.

We need also to teach our young women not to give interviews to the press, unless they do it by releasing carefully prepared statements from their legal advisors.

Some journalists still make a living by twisting statements made in person to make sensations that sell the paper. Nobody who gets involved in any form of publicity should be unaware of this.

I am NOT saying these young women were at fault, They made the sad, but common mistake of trusting men they should not have trusted.

The Clintons are sleaze personified. Both B & H are corrupt; but tell me a politician who isn't (from either side of the pond). The dramatisation captured the era and how women were treated and how if you're powerful you can and will win at all costs. The American Crime Story series are excellent. DH and I have enjoyed all 3

Monica paid the ultimate price. I've no sympathy for Linda Tripp.

Delila-Juanita, yes, Im sorry I think I did get the name wrong.

Crazygranny, I mixed in the same circles as Christine Keeler in London in the early 60's and met her and Mandy on several occasions. My impression of her was of an extremely naive, sweet girl with incredible sex appeal of which she was not aware. When she walked into a room all heads turned - she gave off powerful sexual vibes to all men in her presence. (I have read that her childhood was of poverty, deprivation and even malnourishment.) In my view this could well have invited a potential situation of powerful, wealthy men sexually using/abusing innocent souls from poorer backgrounds. I haven't seen the programme under discussion but wonder whether similarities may be drawn. It could even have an interesting bearing on the Epstein case too, maybe?

Excellent post Suzikyoo. How interesting that you knew Christine and Mandy.

I haven’t watched the series …. but I do remember somebody asking Monika Lewinsky why she didn’t feel she ought to ‘change her name’ , her reply was “why, will Clinton change his?” I was impressed by this answer. I had renewed respect for her after this.

I started watching this today, but I was dozing off and missing bits of it, so I have "parked" it to watch later. I only watched the first episode and about 15 minutes of the second.

However, I can't work out (remember) why Monika was brought into "it". Was the whole story her relationship with Clinton, or was she a witness against him, because of her relationship with him, either as an intern or the personal relationship. If it was the latter, then what was his "crime"? Neither my husband or I can remember.

I'm interested in other views upthread about her being naïve and innocent. I can't correlate that with the young woman who saved a dress with semen stains on it and didn't wash it. That seemed rather calculating to me - but maybe I will have a different view once I've watched the whole series .

I was surprised/very impressed to learn that our own (British) Clive Owen played Bill Clinton! I think they made his nose bigger (?) but his accent and acting skills were amazing.

I thought it must be an American Clive Owen as he didn't look much like the Clive Owen I know.

I think she was more calculating and sexually experienced than was portrayed in this drama - produced by Monica Lewinsky.

Aveline

I think she was more calculating and sexually experienced than was portrayed in this drama - produced by Monica Lewinsky.

Aveline she was a 21 year old girl ..he was 47.

It must have occurred to her that what they were doing was not appropriate to say the least!

Sparklefizz

^I was surprised/very impressed to learn that our own (British) Clive Owen played Bill Clinton! I think they made his nose bigger (?) but his accent and acting skills were amazing.^

I thought it must be an American Clive Owen as he didn't look much like the Clive Owen I know.

This article may be of interest. I also wondered if it was a different Clive Owen.

www.vulture.com/article/impeachment-how-clive-owen-became-bill-clinton.html

That's an interesting article Jane43 and makes you realise the effort that goes into creating a character, not only the hair and make-up but the accent, tone of voice and mannerisms. It's a huge task. I knew it was 'our' Clive Owen when I saw him, but he had certainly transformed into something quite different.

Aveline

It must have occurred to her that what they were doing was not appropriate to say the least!

She was well punished for her behaviour as was Linda Tripp for secretly recording their conversations. None of this is admirable. The point is that Clinton didn't hang his head in shame did he?

He must have been appalled inside. He lost the presidency which must have been a hard blow for a professional politician who must have worked for years to get there climbing over other aspiring politicians. He also has to live with knowing that everybody knows what he's like! What more do you want in the way of punishment? It was amazing that Hilary stayed with him. Imagine the shame of poor Chelsea finding out.

Absolutely! Appallingly crass and damning behaviour by Clinton's and their posse! These are screechingly ambitious people with humoungous egos, did we really think they were anything close to human(e). I watched part of a couple of episodes and the Clinton's came out smelling a bit Clampits/a bit like the lizards in "V" the miniseries! I could well imaging Hilary opening a disjointed gob and swallowing an ostrich whole!?

Jane43

Sparklefizz

I was surprised/very impressed to learn that our own (British) Clive Owen played Bill Clinton! I think they made his nose bigger (?) but his accent and acting skills were amazing.

I thought it must be an American Clive Owen as he didn't look much like the Clive Owen I know.

This article may be of interest. I also wondered if it was a different Clive Owen.

www.vulture.com/article/impeachment-how-clive-owen-became-bill-clinton.html

Wow! And again Wow! What a good actor he is! I'm very impressed.

I’m another who thinks Monica was just very young, naive and trusting, and besotted with Clinton.
As far as I can tell, at least from what we’ve seen so far, he is/was an exploitative, manipulative sleaze bag who then lied through his teeth and ultimately got away with it.
I hadn’t realised that the actor was a Brit! He ought to get an award - IMO a brilliant performance.

If the programme is true, Monica lied only because she didn’t want to get him into trouble.

Powerful men and sex, ‘twas ever thus. I’ve been reminded of Shakespeare’s Measure for Measure, but at least in that, the vile sleazy bastard does get his comeuppance.