Dialects and lazy speech - there is a difference

I moved from N.Ireland as I married an English man and lived there for nearly 10 years. We moved around a bit and I loved all the different accents and words used, although some found mine a bit hard to understand at times and I had to slow my speech down quite a lot. I don't think it's lazy speech at all and I much prefer it to 'la de da' any day. When my mum used to visit us she took great delight in being called 'me duck'.

I do think some of the new presenters on the Beeb ( and elsewhere ) are slovenly in their speech - - the ends of words are missing - letters are blurred into each other and grammar is often bad too. If you are in a position whereby people can imitate you and you are in the public eye or a role model for youngsters speaking in your own dialect is lovely - but bad pronunciation and english grammar isn't.!

Franbern, you are a woman after my own heart. I miss the good old letter T in the middle of words.
Those that claim it's not lazy speech, please explain why my stepdaughter and her peers use it when it's never been used ny her parents or their peers?
I also mutter darkly at the tv when I hear would of/could of/should of.
And don't get me started on the mispronunciation of the word 'sixth'.

It's got nothing to do with being"snobish".
It's about being able to UNDERSTAND what's being said easily I'm rapidly giving up on listening to the BBC.

I can't understand how anyone can literally not understand what someone is saying.
It's totally beyond me that it should be so difficult.

kevincharley

Franbern, you are a woman after my own heart. I miss the good old letter T in the middle of words.
Those that claim it's not lazy speech, please explain why my stepdaughter and her peers use it when it's never been used ny her parents or their peers?
I also mutter darkly at the tv when I hear would of/could of/should of.
And don't get me started on the mispronunciation of the word 'sixth'.

Your stepdaughter and her peers are lazy? Stupid?

It’s also about the presenter’s accent being so overwhelming or grating that even though you understand what’s being said it ruins your enjoyment of the programme.

I think there is a difference between accents and what the op calls lazy speech. Dropping letters and mispronouncing words as in haitch instead of aitch and the strange made up accent which some young people use is irritating. I quite like most local accents and don't mind hearing them on TV.

I used to have a strong Liverpool accent which gradually wore away when I went to work in a profession. When I was teaching groups of students at uni the international ones simply would not have understood me if I had a strong regional accent. I learned to slow down and speak recieved English for that reason.

I can still slip back into broad scouse if I need to and invariablly do when I visit family. I still miss the people and the humour.

I don't have a problem with pronunciation. It would be dull if we all spoke the same way. Having lived in Scotland, Wales and England I'm familiar with many different pronunciations, accents and dialect words. DD and grandchildren live in Dundee and have strong local accents and dialect speech. They greet me "How are youse?" It's what makes them who they are.
I do however get very upset at falling standards in written English and spelling, to the point where the meaning is ambiguous and sometimes lost altogether. Don't get me started...

We are all different , It would be boring if We were all the same ..Innit ?

I think this thread proves how boring it would be.

It is Lazy speech. You have to use your tongue to pronounce T and other letters. Now we are losing L - hospiaw, medaw etc How can children learn to spell correctly when words are not pronounced properly? BBC announcers and presenters should use RP so that standardised pronunciation is available to be heard.
Dialect is a different matter and can be delightful. It has been around for a long time and is part of the variety of the country "Estuary english" is recent. I never heard it when I was young.

Grantanow

People do speak in different registers depending on where they are or who they are with. At grammar school I learnt to speak in one register and spoke in another at home. Richard Hoggart mentions this in 'The Uses of Literacy' which I read as a working class pupil.

i think this is called code switching in modern parlance.
well known among urban youth/yoof who drop their jafaikan when trying to get a job.
you get me bro ?

I am from the East End Of London but did my best to smooth it out because it was a place to be ashamed of back in the 60's.

I cannot watch any program with Stacy Dooley in because I find her accent ugly to listen to.
She was born and grew up in Luton so I am a bit surprised that her accent is that strong.
I watched a lot of a program called "Police Custody 24 hours" on Channel 4. This was set in Luton yet I never heard Police or the people they arrested speaking that way.
So I wonder if she puts it on a bit?

One of my granddaughters insists on dropping T's in her speech. I find it jars on my me. So far the younger DGC don't drop T's I hope it stays that way.

My snobby Spanish teacher in Leeds 'accused' me of pronouncing a spanish word like a Londoner and told the class that as we all had flat northern accents we should be able to pronounce spanish words correctly. She then asked me where I came from 'London, Miss P'. Got a good laugh from the class but she never forgave me for making her look silly. Only spent the first 2 years of my life in London but with a N London mother & N Yorkshire father I grew up 'bilingual'

Germanshepherdsmum

It’s also about the presenter’s accent being so overwhelming or grating that even though you understand what’s being said it ruins your enjoyment of the programme.

That is more about the viewer than the presenter. What if your doctor talked in that accent. Would you change doctors?

pat9

It is Lazy speech. You have to use your tongue to pronounce T and other letters. Now we are losing L - hospiaw, medaw etc How can children learn to spell correctly when words are not pronounced properly? BBC announcers and presenters should use RP so that standardised pronunciation is available to be heard.
Dialect is a different matter and can be delightful. It has been around for a long time and is part of the variety of the country "Estuary english" is recent. I never heard it when I was young.

I'm 59 and have always spoken the same, having been bought up in the Thames estuary area.
I haven't invented it all by myself; all of my family and everyone I've met here speak the same.
Originally people were from London, so parts of the speech is cockney.

When I heard a someone with an accent I couldn't place, and asked where the woman came from, she told me she had a proper essex accent.

It is code switching welbeck. Dave Omorgie (rapper) does this in his songs. He uses Jamaican, British, US and Nigerian slang. Fascinating to analyse. Clever bloke.

I appreciate clear speech, preferably with a not too strong dialect. Thick, heavy accents can make words undecipherable to those of us who come from a different area This not "snobbish" just common sense. Sir David Attenborough for example is so easy to understand whereas Paddy McGuinness mangles his words and makes life difficult for many.

I agree about Stacey Dooley and her exaggerated accent really grates. However I do think that Estuary English has been adopted by some people who are desperate to sound 'cool' and encouraged by the BBC who have their own agenda.

people tend to end up with the accent that is dominant around them when they are aged about 15.
i remember reading that by researchers.
so how their parents speak is not the main influence. esp as at age 15 children are moving away from their parents. they'd rather be with friends. that is their social world; not their parents'.
i hate people saying haitch is incorrect. it is not.
i never heard aitch at all until i was in my 20s.
was everyone around me lazy or stupid. they were not. haitch is probably said by more people in the british isles than aitch.
is curry nicer than chilli. you can argue, assert as much as you like for your preference, but to state it as fact just sounds silly, or insecure/immature.
like the child who stamped her foot and declared, no granny, no ! it's not a looking-glass, it's a mirror.

I can understand paddy mcwhatsit perfectly.
When I used to visit the highlands regularly, I soon became accustomed to their accent, and they to mine.
They couldn't copy me though, nor me them.

It just doesnt come naturally.

There seems to be one particular presenter on BBC at the moment who doesn’t enunciate his words properly. I get the feeling that it’s the Beeb trying to be diverse and keeping in touch with ‘the working class’ and ethnic groups. I just find his sloppy speech annoying.
Accents are fine (mine’s Lancashire), but poor grammar and lazy speech aren’t.

It's all to do with sociolinguistics.