Marie antonette on bbc2

Caleo

What is the point of a play unless there is some truth in it?

Entertainment?

volver

Caleo

What is the point of a play unless there is some truth in it?

Entertainment?

Seriously Caleo ? Are we to take Shakespeare's plays (for example) as being truthful then?

No, they were often plain propaganda, bought with heavy silver.

volver

Caleo

What is the point of a play unless there is some truth in it?

Entertainment?

Fair enough- but then why make it about a real historical figure. Just write a story, make it up, get the great locations, costumes and actors, and make it fun and entertaining.

I agree with Judy Dench.

Fleurpepper

volver

Caleo

What is the point of a play unless there is some truth in it?

Entertainment?

Fair enough- but then why make it about a real historical figure. Just write a story, make it up, get the great locations, costumes and actors, and make it fun and entertaining.

I agree with Judy Dench.

Like that terrible example of how not to write a play, Macbeth?

Is that Judi Dench, well known for playing Lady Macbeth? The one who played Elizabeth I in Shakespeare in Love?

People have been entertaining other people since time began. From time to time real people are taken as jumping off points for stories and plays. Entertainment is an important part of human experience.
Don't forget that history is written by the victors. It's not necessarily accurate either.
Now. Back to Versailles...

Fleurpepper wrote:
"volver

((Caleo

What is the point of a play unless there is some truth in it?)

Entertainment?

confused)

Fair enough- but then why make it about a real historical figure. Just write a story, make it up, get the great locations, costumes and actors, and make it fun and entertaining.

I agree with Judy Dench."

Sheer entertainment is perfectly okay I agree. I think you can make entertainment about a real historical figure AS Long As you make it fully clear it's not historically true. For instance Rowan Atkinson playing the character of Shakespeare.

The character of Lady Macbeth in the famous play is not historically true but is true as aspects of the human psyche.

Sorry I confused the quotations from several grans. Gransnet is not geared up with quotation boxes for comparing of ideas.

I have watched 3 episodes and it seems about as close to history as "the Great" was to the rise to power of Catherine the Great.

Just for starters, Countess du Barry was never a friend who attemtpted to initiate Marie Antoinette into the art of seduction. MA barely spoke to her and then only under protest. According to etiquette du Barry could not speak in the presence and was a "non person" until MA acknowedged her. Under great protest and pressure from her mother the empress and the king MA uttered one impersonal phrase which translates as "There are many people at Versailles today". They were never friends.

Also the king (Louis XV) already had a wife. He was married to Marie Leszczyńska, daughter of the dethroned king Stanisław I of Poland. So he would never have offered to marry Mme du Barry even if he had been free to do so. Kings of France did not publicly marry their mistresses (although Louis XIV is reputed to have married Mme de Maitenon in secret when near the end of his life).

Tonight's episode was much better, and I really enjoyed it. I am wondering when her love affair with Count Fernsen of Sweden will come about in the series.

Tosh is too kind a word for it.
Bridgerton, eat your heart out!

It's not tosh at all.

I believe they call it "historical fiction".

Well at least with this story- no surprise about how it all ends for all of them ;) we know that.

Apart from her lover Count Fernsen, who does escape in time back to Sweden.

I thoroughly enjoyed it. It was a beautifully presented drama. I expect there'll be another series as this one ended quite well.

Aveline, I only watch as episodes are shown on TV. So only seen two episodes so far.

volver

It's not tosh at all.

I believe they call it "historical fiction".

You can have your opinion and I shall have mine.

In response to an earlier posting which speculated that she would not have travelled all the way from Vienna to Paris alone. Of course she was accompanied by female servants and outriders. However at the border to France a pavillion had been etected and she was obliged to strip naked and dress in French clothes. All her Austrian possessions and attendants were sent away and she was allowed only French ladies to attend her. That must have been quite traumatic for a girl of 14.

The next series will, of course, be much darker! I

It will no doubt include the affair of the famous diamond (and very ugly) necklace which Marie Antoinette was accused of ordering at a time of great hardship and famine for the French people. This was one of the incidents which turned the ordinary people against her with such venom. In fact it was stolen from the maker by a gang of fraudsters, one of whom impersonated the queen. She was completely innocent, having already refused to purchase the necklace because it was too expensive.

Had you said "I think its tosh" that would have been an opinion, and I could not have argued with you about your opinion. Although I disagree with it.

However "Its tosh" is a comment on the actual program, and implies that anyone who likes it enjoys watching tosh. So that's me, Aveline, Fleurpepper and all the others dismissed by you. Which isn't on really, is it?

Tosh or not, I am thoroughly enjoying it. I'm on "light duties" as I have flu, so watching a couple of episodes in a comfy chair with the dog on my lap is a pleasant diversion from boredom. The costumes, locations etc are beautiful. I am not a historian but it has made me do a bit of research tbh I don't expect it be accurate, entertaining is enough.

volver

Had you said "I think its tosh" that would have been an opinion, and I could not have argued with you about your opinion. Although I disagree with it.

However "Its tosh" is a comment on the actual program, and implies that anyone who likes it enjoys watching tosh. So that's me, Aveline, Fleurpepper and all the others dismissed by you. Which isn't on really, is it?

You may think that, I couldn’t possibly comment.

Call me old fashioned , but I still like to refer to TV programmes

In American English, program is the correct spelling. In Australian and Canadian English, program is the more common spelling. In British English, programme is the preferred spelling, although program is often used in computing contexts.

Feeling supercilious Maw? How disappointing.

Many years ago my MiL told me that a particular film she had seen was rubbish. It had won critical acclaim, and Oscars. Its wasn't rubbish of course. She just didn't like it. She hadn't understood it, as I remember.

Aveline

Feeling supercilious Maw? How disappointing.

But at least not patronising