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AIBU

He was pulling up my pyracantha!

(70 Posts)
luzdoh Thu 23-Aug-18 21:08:53

I was in my house, at the computer. My dog started to bark by the patio doors. I looked and saw the 6ft+ pyracantha shaking vigorously back and forth. I could not see what animal was doing this. I lifted my gaze to the top and had a terrible fright. A big face of a man was staring straight into mine while his arm was reaching across the 6ft fence, which he had broken together with the trellis in front of it, and jerking the pyracantha sharply back and forth. I was dumb founded and frightened. This man had to be standing on something to reach over like this and I don't know how long he had been watching me. My other equally big pyracantha had died recently. I later found it had been sawn through. Neither plant goes over or through the fence. The fence is mine.
I was so shocked I handled it very badly, like the Inspector when offered the biscuits for cheese on Fawlty Towers and Manuel's rat was in the box, I just behaved normally and asked if he was ok. He is my neighbour's father. He does not live there.
It's not so much AIBU? as AIB STUPID? His daughter has behaved terribly badly towards me too.

FlexibleFriend Fri 24-Aug-18 11:59:58

He sounds crazy for several reasons tbh. even one thorn from a pyracantha can do some serious damage and is damn painful so grabbing the entire bush and yanking about requires full body protection for any normal person. Also you say he damaged the fence as well and yet I'm guessing he's never mentioned the shrub being a problem or you wouldn't have been so shocked by his actions. Yes we all know we need to try and live harmoniously with our neighbours but his way is not the way to go about it and surely he can't be expecting a cheery response to his actions. Is the shrub particularly large? I know I have one growing through two trees and it's as tall as the trees. Their are no height restrictions for trees and shrubs. I don't think you did handle it badly tbh although the best response would have been to grab your phone and record his actions. I do think you should contact the Police even if it's only to ask for advice. Although I think they should speak to him to see what his issue is.

Nitpick48 Fri 24-Aug-18 12:05:07

Sounds like he might have some sort of dementia. No-one in their right mind grabs hold of pyracantha!!!!

Nitpick48 Fri 24-Aug-18 12:06:12

Mind you it’s been a long time
since anyone pulled up my pyracantha LOL

David1968 Fri 24-Aug-18 12:22:55

Seriously, if this is an older man, thenhe may have dementia of some kind. We had a similar issue with an older neighbour.

Craftycat Fri 24-Aug-18 12:38:02

Speak to Citizen's Advice. I think a strongly worded letter from a solicitor might stop them. CAB can advise of a cheap solution.

Stansgran Fri 24-Aug-18 12:50:00

We had a neighbour who liked to keep a space in OUR hedge so they could see who was calling at our front door. I kept putting shrubs in and finding them dead or dug up and caught him in the act one day. He told me he liked to see who was visiting. They once moved a garden seat so they had a view of our garden from the slope above. Perfectly entitled to but I put in a trellis and a clematis montanagrin

Jalima1108 Fri 24-Aug-18 13:04:55

How frightening luzdoh

I am not sure that the police would do anything either - but you could try. At least take some photos of the damage.

I hope it scratched him, lethal stuff. We did plant some years ago in the back hedge because someone was taking a short cut through our garden! It proved so difficult to chop back and so prickly we got rid of it in the end.

Pat1949 Fri 24-Aug-18 13:19:08

Have a quiet word with the police. It's no use dismissing them out of hand, it all depends which police area you live in as to whether they come out or not. If you explain to them that it frightened you and you feel a bit threatened(which is a criminal offence) they should be able to have a word with your neighbours. At least if you report it, it will have to be logged.

luzdoh Fri 24-Aug-18 15:37:25

sarahellenwhitney and everybody You are all WONDERFUL! thank you so much.

I did report to the Police but that was after his second incident a few days later that week- breaking my gate, coming into my garden and shouting the odds, plus my going to his daughter and her intended who live in the house next door and the daughter proceeded to shout abuse at me with sarcasm and tell the most monstrous lies and make threats to make holes in my fence.

I keep my deeds at my Solicitor's so I phoned and asked her to read them out. She advised I reported it to the Police who should log it. It is my fence and it is very old. The father has pulled ivy off it which grows from their side and has killed trees, and in so doing has damaged the fence. I'm not that fazed about that as the fence is old, but I have told them I can't replace it this year and it is still serviceable. My pyracantha does not block their light, the light comes from their side anyway. It does not overhang their garden, unlike about four ugly weed-like plants that come into my garden from theirs.

The problem is, the father has been treated for cancer in 2 places and the daughter told me, some months ago (February?) he had stopped treatment because the 2 Consultants "could not decide who was going to operate first". I am a retired Neuropsychologist. I had a colleague who had a case where a man stopped his treatment and stopped scans, developed a secondary brain tumour and killed another young man in a car crash. The other possibility for brain-behaviour involvement in cancer could be use of steroids. With this in mind, I had not called the Police about the father.

I had gone to the neighbours that evening. He has a very adult daughter who is an Accountant at the large hospital nearby, and very self-confident. I went to ask, gently, if her dad was having check-ups. Her first words, because her Intended came to the door, shouted over his head and before I could begin, were, "I've dealt with that, it's all sorted. I've been on the phone to dad, that's all sorted. You can go." I did note she did not say "I'm sorry dad broke your gate." Her father said he'd mend the gate by putting a bit of extra wood on it behind where the bolt slides in, that wasn't there before, saying how badly made it was and being so rude about everything demanding a hammer etc.. I did not want her father on my premises or to do a shambolic job on my gate which was made by a qualified Carpenter. When talking to his daughter and her intended, I was extremely polite and tactful and played down her father's aggressive behaviour and his kicking the gate and shouting abuse. In fact I went into my old professional mode. I did not mention any possibilities of brain involvement until much later on when she was saying her father never shouts and was insisting he is gentle and peaceful. Actually I have heard him shouting twice before, over a year or more ago. She was furious with me for insisting on talking about the incidents and attacked me verbally saying horrendous and untruthful things about me. In fact, she flew into a rage just like her father. I would say, I have seen this in the clinic and more often we hear about it, as we say "from the victims of these people" who all share a cluster of personality disorders with overlapping symptoms and include aggressiveness, including passive aggression, bullying, lying, violent temper outbursts, sarcasm, belittling people, manipulativeness etc.
It was horrendous!
As people who worked with brain-injured people, we were told that, having the benefit of our knowledge, should we ever suspect a brain event underlying a person's behaviour, we have a duty to make that person safe and hence other people safe because that person might, like the person I mentioned before, drive a car, or hurt others somehow or be responsible for children etc. This duty doesn't stop because we retire. So my duty was to try and see that he went to a doctor and somehow was assessed, preferably with a brain scan. That would have been done anyway if he were going routinely to the hospital and I was praying that he was, yet under the impression that he had walked out.
Next, the Police. Yep, useless. Two turned up, detectives or else they can't afford uniforms. Didn't show me their ID! Listened but couldn't follow my explanation. My bit about fears about his brain and cancer threw them. Then the older one, who was minding the young girl said, "What would you like us to do?" They would have gone to see the neighbours but they were out at work. They said they would "Log it". He, older Plod, said I should write to neighbours explaining the facts since she had told a lot of lies especially about the fence. I said I'd done a preparatory letter. He read it and said it was good, very unprovocative, factual etc.
There is another instalment I will give later (can't keep writing...)
Thank you so much everyone!
P.S, My clinical feeling is that the cancer and brain involvement are less likely to have been the influence of his behaviour (he was so fit and well and energetic) and the cause for such aggression was most likely that he is an aggressive nasty man who thinks he can make people do whatever he says!

luzdoh Fri 24-Aug-18 15:48:16

Actually, I've been too dismissive re our Police, sorry! They are extremely over-worked in my area, and I hadn't been beaten up although I still feel intimidated, and they did come to me because I'm old and disabled. So I shouldn't be flippant about them. They have to do such horrendous things as I know, having been a victim twice. So I ought to respect them and really I do!

grannyqueenie Fri 24-Aug-18 15:50:07

What a horrible situation you’re in luzdoh all I can say is that, if you did not have the amount of professional know how and insight from your working life it would be even harder to manage it all.
You did the right thing contacting the police even although it sounds like they didn’t really understand the full impact of it all. I’m guessing that’s probably because it didn’t quite fit in any of the tidy tick boxes that everyone seems to use these days to assess a situation. Unfortunately where human beings are concerned, and particularly those displaying bizarre behaviour, one size certainly doesn’t fit all.
Sending you good wishes as you continue to manage this tricky situation.

luzdoh Fri 24-Aug-18 16:29:10

Elrel Thanks! Yes all the neighbours are really lovely. Some are not very well so I'm not bothering them.

Stansgran Crumbs! What a wierdo! A real example of someone to whom the kids would say; "Get a life!" Sad though.

You, however, are a very clever lady! And funnily enough, I have plans for that fence and garden area of mine which involve clematis montana! squeaking.

Guineagirl I totally agree:
"Some neighbours are pure controlling bullies" …I was so upset to read about the blackbirds. This aggressive man also cut out lots of birds' nests from the ivy on their side. He said he was doing it "Because they're getting married you know". Yet their garden is not in particularly good condition and they haven't a clue about gardening, not that they should, but it doesn't give them any right to dictate to me! I have a fortnightly gardener, as I'm disabled, mainly to cut the grass, and he keeps my garden beautifully tidy while I plant my flowers and odd bits of veg and salad.

My Pyracantha is quite spread out in its growth, more like a tree. We live on a hill. I am down hill from the evil neighbours. I didn't keep trimming the pyracantha like a hedge but let it grow upwards and spread sideways. It was easy for him to reach the trunk of the plant because it is not a tightly compact bush but more tree-like. It is approx. 15 years old though! I wanted it for the colour and to feed the birds.

grannyqueenie Thank you! That is so kind of you. I fear my greatest problem is the mad woman next door. I am unashamedly letting off steam and not using professional language here! She has behaved despicably! It really is amazing how dreadful some people are! I suppose for me it's the shock of being personally attacked in y own home and her being permanently near, her lies! Oh how wicked and cruel! But then the second instalment I haven't yet narrated, which was Psychiatric text-book manipulative behaviour!

I'm very lucky in some ways. I had a desperately unhappy marriage throughout which I used my Teaching qualification as best I could. Then I did the Psychology degree expecting to become an Educational Psych. But I went into the Biological bases of behaviour side of Psychology. I studied and did research at the Institute of Psychiatry, on Autism and had to learn to observe and recognise many disorders. Then I studied at the Institute of Neurology. So I was really lucky to have this all-round view of behaviour, Psychiatric and Neurological. However, someone drove at 120 mph into the back of my car when I had slowed down to 50mph and the impact messed up my spine. Since then I've had a lot of pain and limited walking and unable to do a lot of things. I can't work in a hospital as they are so big to get around and I have too much pain anyway. I try to help charities in the academic way when they do research or need info. I'm not reliable enough to give regular help as I get really bad days and many migraines. But I am so grateful to the learning I had from the two Institutes.

luzdoh Fri 24-Aug-18 16:41:11

Stansgran I know why it says squeaking but I don't know how to tell you! I wrote it in the everyday agism forum. It doesn't belong here but, well.. here it is;
My little 7 yr old neighbour has guinea-pigs. I adore guinea pigs. A few days ago, a very loud guinea-pig speaking noise was coming apparently from under my kitchen sink cupboards. I made the dogs go out of the room and got down on my stomach on the floor - very awkward as I am disabled - and squeaked back and called and looked....
Then I remembered. I changed my mobile's ring-tone. I changed my ring-tone to that of a guinea-pig squeaking.

GabriellaG Fri 24-Aug-18 16:48:51

Those GNers who advocate calling the police are timewasters. Fgs, calling police over a plant and fence? Whatever next. Are you regularly up in arms about knife crime, moped robberies, unsolved or improperly investigated murders? Which is more important?
I suggest sending your neighbour a 'signed for' letter detailing your complaint and requesting the fence be mended. Give a set time frame for a response, say...7 working days.
Take photos of the damage and note the time and day it happened.
It would, no doubt, be a civil case.

Jalima1108 Fri 24-Aug-18 16:53:25

GabriellaG I think this is not a single incident so those advocating calling the police are not necessarily, as you call it, timewasters.

Jalima1108 Fri 24-Aug-18 16:56:45

I would have thought they could have sent a PCSO rather than two detectives.

muffinthemoo Fri 24-Aug-18 17:15:53

Gabriella, if I thought I might need to pursue any sort of civil action for damages, I would find my case strengthened by having reported it to the local community policing team.

I would absolutely not advise anyone make an urgent or emergency call for property damage unless their own safety was being threatened.

In the unlikely and unfortunate circumstance that there is a course of conduct here which amounts to harassment of luzdoh, reporting each incident to the community team is pretty much essential to be able to proceed seriously in law.

The community teams exist for exactly this kind of difficult but non urgent dispute.

jaclovesdogs Fri 24-Aug-18 19:43:18

If he does anything else film him with your phone. The police should be able to act as you witnessed the damage yourself. If the neighbours live in a council property report them to the council also.

Jalima1108 Fri 24-Aug-18 20:07:55

Reporting it to the police gives you a crime reference number and a log of the crime.
It may or may not necessitate police action.

Lyndiloo Sat 25-Aug-18 02:45:46

You've already reported your complaint to the police - they will have given you a 'crime number'. If I were you, I would leave it now. These disputes with neighbours can escalate alarmingly - and they sound like a mad bunch of people! By all means, get proof of any other damage/interference with your property, but don't confront them again. You won't win, because they are not the sort of people who will listen, fairly, to your complaints. They will just up the ante, to cause you even more distress.

Sadly, you're just going to have to live with it!

luzdoh Sat 25-Aug-18 12:18:43

GabriellaG Thanks. I agree about the Police. My Solicitor said I should tell them so they "log" it in case there is more trouble.
That is a good idea about the letter. Thank you.

luzdoh Sat 25-Aug-18 12:27:11

muffinthemoo You are right. I went to the Police station, following my Solicitor's advice. Btw I had phoned Solic to have her read out my deeds as I keep them with the there. She had gone on to say what you said, this needs logging because harassment needs a history of events.
When I arrived at the Police Station a PCO took details and she made the decision to send out the two Officers. Well, she said she would put it on their desk and they would contact me, which they did and duly came to my house. I feel guilty about my first comment about them because I really do appreciate their coming and supporting me.

The daughter's threats, and she lives next door, were frightening. The Officers wanted to speak to her but she was out. Another incident makes me wonder if they did go and speak to her. But she is still behaving in a passive aggressive way and being extremely threatening and telling lies. My response is to avoid her.

Elrel Sat 25-Aug-18 12:27:30

Luzdoh - I kept not answering my phone (assuming it wasn't mine) and needed an unusual ring tone. I went for ducks and catch myself looking for them when I hear them.
I think the protagonist of 'Keeping Faith' on tv uses it too.

luzdoh Sat 25-Aug-18 12:39:47

Lyndiloo I agree. I am avoiding the woman. She is the problem in the neighbour issue as she lives next door.

Unfortunately in our road our gable wall can only be accessed by going onto our neighbour's property. Their side path runs between their house and mine. In the deeds it stipulates that they must give reasonable access and not do anything to the wall, not growing anything on it for example. There was ivy grow on it. It may be that the gully beside my wall may have been filled and may have blocked the air brick. Or the damp course may have been covered, because I have wet rot in my joists. So I have to get access to my wall which involves going through their gate with their permission. I am trying to organise a camera to record any interactions.

I would like to get a camera to keep surveillance on my property because the huge thumps, knocks and bangs against my wall are terrifying, plus she has made threats to damage the fence and let my dogs escape. I really need help to get this in place.

luzdoh Sat 25-Aug-18 13:47:41

Can anyone advise me please? I have just received the following email message from my daughter"

"I've just looked up gransnet and seen all your posts.
Do you realise it's public?"

Should I be worried?

I replied; "Of course. Your point being?"

But as I reach out to my Gnetters for support, I can honestly tell you my legs are shaking and my heart thumping. Obviously DD will read this, and I am not trying to hurt her. I just feel so upset. I get such curt messages. But I do not understand why, whenever something awful happens to me I get such cold reactions from family and such warm and useful support from strangers. Is it because we are of the Granny generation?
Please help.