Everyday sexism

and the poor buggers are so under represented in society, it's only now after generations that we may finally have a male POTUS, crazy as they are 49% of the population...

JA sorry if I didn't make it clear but I was talking in the context of everyday sexism and my experiences. I think the MB etc examples you give are not everyday sexism but disgusting unacceptable sexism and misogyny.

LSP, you have a very biased opinion of men, or you have been very unlucky in the ones you meet. You appear to be looking for the worst in men and if you look hard enough you will find it.
You said the if a man calls you "Love" you consider it sexist, I get called "love" frequently, but never consider it sexist, it is friendly.
You appear to be familiar with pornography, I will bow to your expertise on that. I spent all this morning with a group on 10 women, oddly, pornography didn't cross my mind. But perhaps the one that touched my arm was making a move on me, I think not.
It is sad that you cannot accept friendly gestures without feeling offended.

And I can assure you, that having worked in a primarily female workplace, women can try to be sexist. Or don't you think that a statement like " I wouldn't go out with any man that has bigger tits than me" sexist, as I am over weight and have man boobs, that upset me, but I just ignored it as I had to work with the woman who said it to me, and I hadn't asked her for a date.

Wow! Have you got a chip on your shoulder lumpy!

Yes, much of what you say has an element of truth but no-one has done more to raise the status of womankind than our generation, and I have actively participated in that.

But what I refuse to do is see myself as a victim . I'm guessing your life has been somewhat different from mine and you have experienced more blatant sexism that I have. Fortunately I've been in a position to deal with the odd instance of sexism I've come across and bat it out of touch. I've never been paid less than a man doing the same job, I made sure my husband carried his equal share of child rearing, and household duties. I've raised two children, one a man who hasn't a sexist bone in his body and a feisty female who's not gong to take crap from any man be it in her personal life or her career.

We certainly don't 'suffer' sexism on a 'daily basis'.

What does horrify me are the girls and women who deliberately portray females as some dizzy individual who is only interested in their looks, publicity, taking continuous selfies of themselves to post on FB- the breed you find on The Only Way is Essex etc. But this is their choice, deliberate choice. I despair! .

PS I like men.

WB no I wouldn't ignore it and I wouldn't say I've never been guilty of it - that's what's so invidious about everyday sexism ( and the other isms) it's so easy to not even recognise. Give me some examples because I think it might be enlightening and chastening.

Sorry WB x posts - that's a horrible example you give. I certainly haven't been guilty of anything like that!

You said the if a man calls you "Love" you consider it sexist, I get called "love" frequently, but never consider it sexist, it is friendly.

I didn't say that at all, I said

The intent is the thing. When a man calls you love in a dismissive arrogant way that's not on, if they call everyone love that's not a problem.

and I don't hate men, that old chestnut that's pulled out when women dare to name the problem. I do hate sexism though, I hate male violence, I hate the casual sexism that my 11 year old daughter has already faced at school. Don't you hate that? Yes, not all men are like that but too many men are. Even if my experience was perfect I have eyes in my head and I can see the unequal way that women and girls are treated.

I want a better future for girls and women.

Anya - we all experience sexism differently as you imply.. If people like Lumpy have had more negative experiences, I wouldn't call that having a chip on your shoulder - it's devaluing and undermining IMO to post that. Do you really think that we( I've women in general not all) don't experience sexism on a daily basis?

Lumpy x posts.Great post

Phew, Ok, I accept all that, I was really getting wound up by what I thought you were saying. Pax. if flowers are sexist, tough, I don't give flowers to the men in my life.

I did ask, and I don't think that anyone answered me, if (as if they dare) a man , or woman for that matter, insisted in being arrogant how would you expect them to address you. As a man I would expect "sir" and I would have thought a woman "madam", but someone said the hated being called "madam"

Please don't assume I've had negative experiences because I'm a feminist. I'm a feminist because I have eyes in my head and can see how our society works and who it works for, which groups have power and which groups don't.

Wobbly - I don't give a monkeys how I'm addressed so long as the person addressing me is polite and friendly.

I like to be treated with respect and would prefer to be called madam or ma'am by someone who does not know what my name is. I do not make an issue out of it if people are both nice and friendly but if someone I do not know uses my first name from a form I have filled in or without my permission then I will pick them up on it. All of that might make me seem snobby to some but my upbringing was fairly formal and since that is what I know then that is what makes me comfortable.

As for the wine, I am not averse to Chardonnay and if a gentleman picked up the wine list and ordered for all then my instinct would be to openly thank him for his generosity. Unless he said otherwise the bill would automatically go in his direction!
In any case if that was not his intention and he thought it was going to be a shared bill then he would be swiftly corrected. There would not be anything that would stop me placing my own wine order if I so wished.

Syn we were all on expenses

Don't particularly need friendly Need polite and well-informed assistance. Why are so few people in the UK trained in the products in store and their functions? I gave up asking ( and also buying such stuff) when the very polite young people assumed I was illiterate and painstakingly and slowly read out the instruction labels to me. i had to point out that I could read.... Was there anyone instore who could answer the question? As the 'manager ' was of no help at all, either, I left

In that case* Rigby* if he was not paying he should have minded his own business and not been so rude.
This could have been the one occasion that he should have been taught the lesson that if you order something then you are the one who pays the bill. Experience is a good teacher and he may well not have done that again.

Wobbly I love so thank you - wherever they were directed. There seem to be various threads within this thread.

I do think he should have given you the chance to pick your own wine
Overbearing but perhaps he has a wife who always leaves the choosing to him because he is such a wine buff

I have to agree about first names, unless I have indicated so by telling a person " I am Wobblybits" I would expect either Mr Wobblybits or Sir, this assuming a professional situation, my check out lady can call me "darling" as can the check out man (if you saw him, you would realise why I wouldn't argue, he is big, very BIG, he has muscles on his muscles.) Luckily he calls me "mate".

I would point out that this our village Tesco, and we use it so frequently that we are on first name terms with many of the staff and have known some for years.

Today, because I was having to use crutches, two young ladies held doors open for me, that is all wrong, it should be me holding the doors for them, didn't feel right, but I was most appreciative.

I quite like being called love. A young double glazing salesman called me 'babes' not long ago. I was chuffed. What I don't like is when I get stopped in the street by someone trying to sell something and they say 'excuse me young lady' when it's obvious that I'm not young. Very patronising.

Jalima a very passable Chardonnay drunk this evening

Within the past week two enormous barmaids in two local pubs have called me 'darling'. I wasn't sure whether to be flattered or terrified, but I certainly didn't feel patronised.

Here in S,Ayrshire its Hen or Son

Cheers Rigby46

I am used to being called duck but I suppose some people may think that requires action.