I’m quite disturbed about this, is it acceptable?

A good care home should have a clear policy regarding gifts. Usually all gifts are recorded with a description of item, approximate value, donor and recipient. Gifts should be under a certain value. Gifts over that amount should be declined.
There are usually stringent rules regarding mobile phones ie they should not be used during work hours.
Do query this situation.

Thank you lucky X posts due to slow typing on my part!

Nannee49

Maybe your mum just likes buying things maddyone? It's a care home she's in not a jail. If she's got it into her head she wants a Pot Noodle, for whatever reason, it's her money to do with as she likes.

Her carer might have said quite innocently and in normal conversation, "I was out for a meal the other night and we had Disaronno with our coffee, have you ever tried it?" like you would to anyone you were chatting with and your mum might have thought "Ooh that sounds lovely, I don't drink but why not at my age, I'll give it a go". Disarronno is lovely, I'm quite a fan of it myself.

Why should she not give something new a try without the sinister thought that some poor carer doing a difficult job, that very few people want to do, is on the make?

It would drive me nuts if my purchases - most of them modestly priced it seems - were being vetted. She might just be wanting to feel part of general life again, to feel a bit of autonomy, instead of yet another control however well intentioned.

I agree with this. I'm not yet in a care home, (and hope never to be) but I like buying things. I would be fuming if anyone told me that I couldn't buy what I wanted, and should have 'small amounts of money' available to me, like a child being doled out pocket money.

I'm not sure about the alcohol either. I can see that residents giving presents might lead to abuse of vulnerable people, but as long as gifts are logged, what's the harm?

And if the alcohol was for herself, are residents not allowed to drink? It sounds more like a detention centre than a care home.

Nannee and Luckygirl

I posted our actual experience of one carer as an example of what can happen in some rare circumstances.

^MIL had a carer at her own home who was doing this.
Food from the freezer, taking her bedlinen home to wash which was never returned, selling her fake goods etc.^

I am not saying this is usual or normal but it can happen and did. This was a home carer from Age Concern and was dealt with when we found it.

Of course most carers are not like this and we can all be more than grateful for the work they do and I think they should be better rewarded for their work.

However, it was offered as an example of what can happen.

I didn't like to suggest memory loss to maddyone at first but that could be a possibility because these items seem random..

Squash, biscuits, sweets seem quite reasonable but tins of soup or Pot Noodles? Has she ever eaten Pot Noodles, maddyone?
If she wants these as gifts to give to a carer they are very odd items indeed!

Some sensible posts above from MissAdventure who knows what she is talking about.

And if the alcohol was for herself, are residents not allowed to drink? It sounds more like a detention centre than a care home.

The care home where my relative is serves wine with dinner but I'm sure it's not a great idea for residents to be allowed to keep spirits in their rooms.
Firstly, the staff will know which residents are allowed alcohol as some may be on medication which reacts adversely to alcohol.
Secondly, how would staff deal with a resident who has over-imbibed and is drunk and disorderly? They need to have some checks and controls for health and safety reasons.

It's reasonable of this lady to want o give a present or reasonable presents to a nice carer. Of course the lady wnt to retain some control over her own life! Sadly, the carer should not accept it and should be told how to refuse it politely.

To avoid harming the carer who is probably badly paid you might first try speaking to the carer privately and without animosity.

The care home where my relative is serves wine with dinner but I'm sure it's not a great idea for residents to be allowed to keep spirits in their rooms.
Firstly, the staff will know which residents are allowed alcohol as some may be on medication which reacts adversely to alcohol.

Secondly, how would staff deal with a resident who has over-imbibed and is drunk and disorderly? They need to have some checks and controls for health and safety reasons.

I'm sure that's true, but to me it's another example of the loss of independence which is inherent in going into a care home.
I hope I never finish up in one as I'm sure I would be perceived as a very difficult resident.

I think the situation with the carer is a distraction if I’m honest Maddyone.

I know it’s possibly contentious....but I just have to ask. Why do you carry on seeing her? I know she’s your mum, and I do get it. My husband was drawn to his very difficult mother, despite the fact she caused so many problems. She was never cruel though. We did finally estrange 20 years ago. They’re all dead now.

Your mum is in a home...and safe. Isn’t it time to draw a line, and live for yourself?

I’m about to go to the hairdressers so will reply more fully whilst waiting for my colour to ‘take.’
However I must put one theory to bed. My mother never drinks alcohol. Never. She made it clear to me that the drink was to be given as a gift. Plus this care home is absolutely gorgeous, we trawled the homes in our area and this one is lovely. Expensive, but lovely. It is NOT like a detention centre to whoever it was who suggested it is. Residents are of course allowed alcohol. The lovely Tom who lives down the corridor has a glass of red with his meals. Sometimes alcohol is served by the home eg sparkling wine with the beautiful afternoon tea they did one day. Mum didn’t have any and she refused to eat the food asking instead for a ‘jam buttie.’ That was her choice, but there was gorgeous food on offer. I know because I was there.

Having read Nanee's post, I agree with Nanee, and I'd like to add that none of the gifts or the total gifts is excessive. Best do nothing about it unless the sum of money is more than your mother can afford.

That she was a bad mother to you is neither here not there.

No wonder people don't want to go into 'homes' when you are not allowed to get drunk or buy wee presents!

PS Maddyone. I note your disclaimer about that particular very nice 'home' and about how your mother doesnt like alcoholic drinks for herself.

Callistemon, I understand and accept others' experiences might not be as positive as ours, I acknowledged there are bad apples and, of course, checks and balances must be put in place and adhered to but it's just the whole tone of many posts being so controlling both of the interaction between carer and caree and, IMO, of how the parent should be 'managed'.

If dementia or illness is involved then it's a nursing home situation rather than a care home with more stringent safeguarding rules. No-one would deny the need for that but when the person being cared for is in fair control of their own mind then it seems so unnecessary to limit their choices to fit in with what the adult children deem appropriate.

It's an extremely difficult time of life, I understand the emotional upheaval having gone through it myself so I can't see the point of making life more difficult all round by denying them small things.

This is precisely why robust paperwork needs to be in place, so that people who live, and staff who work in homes can get on with making it as relaxed and pleasant as possible.
If someone doesnt want to eat a beautifully cooked dinner, and wants a pot noodle, of course its "allowed", as is getting pissed, if the fancy takes them, and there is no medical reason.

Even bad decisions are "allowed", because those too are peoples' to make, without being overruled.
Any and everything is, provided it doesn't pose a serious threat to anyone.

That's what the policies and procedures should cover; the rights of the residents.

It goes without saying, none of us want to lose independence. It’s also untrue to say maddyone’ s relationship with her mother is irrelevant. It’s relevant to maddyone and her mother for sure.
Loss of independence often goes hand in hand with loss of physical and mental competence. That’s why protocols exist to stop residents being exploited. Carers do a great job in the majority of cases but it’s naive to suggest that there are no unkind or exploitative people employed in the role.
In this situation, speaking to the manager relates to
maddyone’ s difficulty in understanding why her mother is requesting items, it isn’t about suggesting the Carer is up to no good. The establishment is well aware of the strained relationships. Manoevering and managing is part of their role.

Even if Maddy's mum buys tins of soup that never get eaten, if there is something written down to cover it, what's the harm?
If it gives her some autonomy, and nobody is under suspicion then it's a good thing.
Paperwork isn't just to be used to tell people what they cant do - it is freeing, because it lays out clearly what they can.

I had a client that I used to visit at her house.
She moved to a care home 25miles from me but still wanted me to visit her.
I said that I would go as a ‘friend’ but she insisted that she paid me so she paid me £10 a visit. In total it took me about 3 hours.
It was a power thing, she was a lovely woman but would ring me up and ask me to buy her cakes, soap and other little things.
It must be so hard not to have any say on your life anymore.
I’m not suggesting that maddyone the case is the same as yours, my client certainly wasn’t giving anything away.

I think it likely that the carer had just been chatting about things, about food and drink and mentioned this liquor as being a favourite, I would imagine her showing it to you at your Mother's request made her somewhat uncomfortable. the main problem here, as you know deep down, is your Mother manipulating you, having you run hither and thither with ever more weird requests, just because she can. I would suggest you mention these requests to the care home management for their own protection, because there is every possibility that your Mother's next tactic to get attention will be to accuse an innocent carer of theft. I know it is easy for us to say at a distance, but just say no to your Mother when she asks for something, visit her a bit less, she is exhausting you. Good luck

Houseplantqueen thank you so much for understanding and you have got it in one. I know full well that my mother is trying to manipulate me. She always has done and probably always will. From childhood she was controlling and very dominant with myself and my sister and she is probably the reason why my sister has such severe and long lasting mental health issues. Children who are controlled and have no autonomy grow up lacking in self esteem and often have mental health problems. However, she is my mother and I have strong family values and so I try to do everything I can to ensure she is well cared for. Posters who suggest I am the one trying to control are barking up the wrong tree, but if you haven’t experienced the lack of autonomy and sometimes cruelty that I experienced then it may be difficult to understand. It is very complex but I didn’t expect posters to say I was the problem when I and all my family know that’s simply not true.

The alcohol thing is separate. If mum wanted alcohol for her own consumption I would get it without question, but she doesn’t. I understand now that the carer may not have realised that the alcohol was for her. I assumed she knew, but as posters have said, it’s possible that she didn’t. Anyway I’m going to talk to the manager about gifts for carers and then I’ll know the situation.

Mum’s requests for food and other things are another thing altogether. I did point out earlier that the residents can have anything they want to eat, but there is also a lovely menu offered every day. Mum’s requests for me to bring different things are many and are to manipulate me into constantly running errands for her. I understand that people must feel a loss of independence when they move into a home, but getting me to be constantly shopping for her or going to the flat (which is on the market now) is about manipulating me. I know that. It’s wrong and totally unfair to accuse the manipulated daughter of doing the manipulating.

maddyone only you know your own mum and the dynamics of your relationship.

I'm sure you're doing your best but you did ask if you are being unreasonable in the OP and my opinion was that you are somewhat for assuming there was something dodgy going on with the carer rather than the possibility it's your mum up to old tricks to get your attention.

I thought it unfair that this person has possibly been dragged into a family situation not of their own making while just going about their (difficult) job.

I also think it's unreasonable, in the normal run of things, to control what someone wishes to buy with their own money.

We all have to manage as best we can.

If that means you asking for others' opinions on a vexing situation then they're just that - different opinions to maybe give you a different perspective.

It very much seems to me that you are the one being manipulated, Maddyone. By constantly asking for little bits and pieces your mother is dangling you like a puppet and she can make you dance to her tune.

I am making the assumption that she has all her faculties, in which case you can make a change to how her demands can be managed. Tell her to keep a shopping list (give her a nice pad and pen to write it on) and you’ll collect it once a week and get her requirements.

Alternatively - and again I’m assuming she can use a phone - some Coop stores now operate a phone ordering service. Your mother could call them and they will deliver to the home. She might even enjoy having someone else to chat to. They’ve been a lifeline to my 94yo mum, who is still in her own home without needing help.

Nannee you are mistaken, I didn’t at any point ask if I was being unreasonable. That’s because I know I’m not being unreasonable. I did say that some of the things mum asks for are perfectly reasonable such as talcum powder or cream (although she has skin cream from the doctor.) I also said some things are not so reasonable such as regular requests for food items, many of which are already provided by the home, which also provides two three course meals a day, and which always provides home made soup as a possible starter (there is always a choice for every course.)

It seems you’ve taken little notice of what I said about my mother having always being a controlling and dominant woman. I suppose if you had a very loving mother who was not controlling and manipulative you will have little understanding of living a lifetime of this, but some other posters seem to understand. It is not nice, it has probably been the cause of my loss of confidence as a young woman and of my reliance on antidepressants to keep myself okay. My sister fared less well and has suffered very poor mental health all her life, and a terrible loss of self esteem.

Anyway, back to the point, what I actually asked was,
Is it ethical? Is it allowed? and I was referring to the buying of gifts, alcoholic gifts, for members of staff.

I think you’re a very unsympathetic person to tell me it’s unreasonable to control what a person spends their money on. I’m not controlling her, she’s trying to control me, much as she always has done. Obviously you had a lovely mother, not all of us were that lucky.

Incidentally many people have told me over the years to walk away from her. I didn’t because she’s my mother and I have strong family values, in particular learnt from my husband’s lovely family.

The main thing is to get things chugging along smoothly again, Maddy.
You don't have to justify yourself - I've long read about your regular visits to your mum, and the fact that you want her to be comfortable and content. (As content as possible, anyway, given her circumstances and personality)
Once your sure all is well, it might be time to do a once weekly shop (and no extra running around)

SueDonim thank you so much for understanding. It is a difficult situation indeed. I have asked her to make a shopping list a few times before but she doesn’t do it. Her memory is gradually declining and it may be that she forgets. I gave her a nice notebook for Christmas but she prefers to write little notes to herself (like the carers names) on the back of an empty tissue box. Old habits die hard and she was always a great maker of lists about all kinds of things, but always written on odd bits of card or scraps of paper such as used envelopes. However she doesn’t make me a shopping list despite being asked so she either forgets or won’t comply. Instead she will ask me for things when I visit, three items yesterday, and then at ten o clock this morning I received a text asking me to take in a fourth item, sweets. She asked my husband for sweets too, he took them and she said they were horrible. She asked me for jelly babies because she said she likes them, so I took some in and she then ate one and said she didn’t like them. She asked my DiL for Bovril which DiL took in only for mum to say she doesn’t like it, bring Oxo instead.

Anyway, back to the point, what I actually asked was
Is it ethical? Is it allowed? and I was referring to the buying of gifts, alcoholic gifts, for members of staff.

I would think buying chocolates, biscuits occasionally as a thank you for the staff is fine but not for individual carers.
Nor tins of soup!

I did wonder about dementia and wondering if it could be the start, she might think she is buying food for herself.

Have a chat to the management about their rules.