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Bereavement

Controlling daughter in law regarding the death of her father

(239 Posts)
Mal2 Sun 04-Sept-22 23:26:43

am a 66 year old single woman. I have 1 married son and 2 grandchildren.

I am writing this to try and understand why my daughter in law (DIL) is bitterly angry with me regarding the passing of her father.

I want to make this as brief as possible but it is a very sad and convoluted story…

I went to see father of my DIL who has been battling cancer after a bone marrow transplant.

I have 35 years of medical experience and upon seeing his condition I knew he needed to be in the hospital. I told his wife what I thought and also called my DIL to suggest admitting him, as I felt he was very sick.
5 days later he falls at home and both his wife and DIL are able to lift him up and drive to the hospital.
Once there, he was immediately admitted into ICU. His confirmed diagnosis was Sepsis.
From that point on, his condition deteriorated. He was intubated, given several antibiotics was in Septic Shock and finally passed away 19 days later.

This man was a wonderful human being and good friend to me.

4 days prior to his death, his family decided to have him extubated and placed in Comfort Care where he would die comfortably.
On this day the family said their goodbyes, fully expecting him to pass away within hours.
Because they all assumed that he would pass away quickly, my son and DIL told their children 6&8 years old that their grandfather had passed away.
The family was awaiting a call from from the hospital telling them he had passed. No call came. He was still alive and breathing on his own.

The prior evening I talked to my son who was tearful and told me they had said their goodbyes.
I was grieving as well and called the following day to see if I could join them as I wanted to see my son and comfort him. I was told no. My DIL and her mother were not wanting any visitors.

I had made plans to go and see this man on that Thursday. I work Monday thru Wednesday and Thursday was my first opportunity to do so.
I called the hospital to confirm that he was allowed visitors and was told yes.

I was relieved he was still alive as I needed to see him to say my goodbyes to help with my grieving and to gain closure.

While in his room a nurse came in and told me they were moving him out of ICU.
Thinking I was being helpful, I texted my son and let him know.
The following is the text I received. I have omitted titled all names with * symbol

“I am utterly shocked. I am asking that you never, ever tell ***that you visited him today. *** and * explicitly planned to be the last ones to be with him. *** is now not only painfully grieving, but now extremely angry. I am asking that you please do not contact either of them, and please leave now. **** already called the hospital and is taking ****back now. Again, * is not aware that anyone visited today and *** and I are asking that it must remain that way.”
I received 2 more texts asking for confirmation that I had left the hospital and ordering me to not contact them as they needed time and space due to the difficult position I put them in.

I was in total shock…
This angry text from my son is when I learned of his wife and mother in law’s “plan” to be the last ones to be with him.

I left the hospital sobbing. I was so confused.
By the time I got home, my confusion had turned to anger. Number one I was shocked to receive such a hateful text from my son and number 2 had no reasonable reason why…

I honored his order of not contacting him but not because he ordered me to but because if I had spoken to him I would have cut him to shreds with my tongue and knew that doing so would only compound the stress he was under.

My DIL’s father lived 4 more days.

I waited 2 weeks to contact my son and asked him to make arrangements to come and talk to me. He came yesterday and I finally had the answers I was looking for…

He told me that he and my DIL think that I overstepped my bounds and deliberately “ inserted” myself in the dying process and grief of her father…
He then told me that my DIL accused me of being selfish, self absorbed and was only thinking about myself…
I told my son that I only agreed with her 3rd accusation because , yes, I did go to see him because I needed to see him to say my goodbyes ease my grieving heart and to have closure. I then asked my son if he believed that wrongly inserted myself in their situation and he said yes. I asked him if be believes that I am selfish and self absorbed and he said no.

He told me that I should have called him and inform him of my plan to see his FIL. At this point I knew exactly what they wanted from me. I again told him I didn’t understand( even though I did) and decided that he was going to have to look me in the eye and tell me exactly why… he told me that I should have “asked” them if I could visit him. I asked him if they actually believed that I needed their permission to see him and he said yes…

I told him that I do not need anyone’s permission to do anything, including this. I told him that my visit with his FIL was between he and I only.

My son told me that he and my DIL assumed I had enough common sense to realize that when he told me over the phone that they said their goodbyes I was to understand that they were to be the last ones to see him…

I was dumbfounded and asked my son to explain to me just how I was to figure that out after only being told they had said their goodbyes…

He immediately admitted that it was wrong of him to assume I would figure it out.

I told him that his wife and MIL should have planned their “plan” a little more thoughtfully and made sure that anyone who wanted to say goodbye would not be able to. A sign on his door stating the family wanted no visitors…informing the hospital phone operators that for anyone who called was to be told that he was not taking visitors. I did call the hospital to make sure he was allowed visitors and I was told yes.

My son responded with this”. With all the stress they were under how can you possibly think that they would even think of doing that”
I told him that if their “plan” was that important to them, they should have thought it thru and took the proper steps to insure the plan remained uninterrupted.

My son then tells me that his wife and her mother decided ahead of time who they would or would not allow to see their dad and husband..
I told him that obviously I was one of the not allowed persons. He immediately regretted what came out of his mouth…
I laughed a little and told him that after learning this I am even happier that I went to see him and that I will NEVER regret my decision.

I was told that his wife does not want me to come to there house as her anger toward me is palatable. I told him I was just fine with that as I had no desire at all to see her but that I wanted and needed to see my grandchildren an he agreed to bring them to me.

I told my son to make sure his wife understands that I will NEVER compromise who I am and what my beliefs are to make her feel better. I told him the burden is on her to contact me.
I told him this will remain a situation where she and I will have to agree to disagree. I told him I have moved on and that If she wants to live in anger she owns the problem, not me.

I asked him if his wife is actively trying to ban me from their lives and he said no. That she told him she wants me in their lives and wants me to be a grandmother to their kids….
Not too sure I believe her though…

My son told me it is very hard being in the “ middle”. I went to him and hugged him and told him I loved him and he broke down and cried.

I posted this looking for answers as I truly believe I was within my rights whereas my DIL believes I was not…

Smileless2012 Mon 05-Sept-22 11:36:53

If I had been going to ring anyone to check if it was OK to visit my son's dying f.i.l., who had been a good friend to me, I would have asked his wife, not his D.

The whole thing seems very strange TBH. Presumably your d.i.l. knew her dad had been a good friend to you Mal. You'd visited him in his home, so it wasn't unlikely that you'd visit him in hospital, and if his wife and D didn't want him to have any visitors other than themselves, why didn't they so?

Were you the last person to see him before he died? There would have been no way of knowing when he would so I'd have thought that his wife and/or D would have continued to go until that happened.

I agree that an apology is needed, from both 'sides'. You hadn't intended to intrude on their grief and had you known they didn't want anyone else to see him, which in itself is rather odd, they should have made that clear by telling you themselves or instructing the hospital staff not to allow anyone to go.

You checked with the hospital before going which appears to have been overlooked by your son, d.i.l. and her mother.

Elizabeth27 Mon 05-Sept-22 12:05:07

I feel sorry for your son who is in the middle of this, you will have to tread very carefully if you do not want this to develop into a huge rift where you do not see the family at all.

Your feelings are not more important than the feelings of others.

Has there been a funeral yet? If not and you attend remember it is not about you.

Jaylou Mon 05-Sept-22 12:26:23

The OP is quite a lengthy post to what amounts to a friend visiting a dying friend in hospital.
The "plan" (horrible choice of word) by the family sounds very clinical, and to me it sounds like a competition as to who would be the last to see him. As someone else mentioned, if he was that frail then someone from the family should have been with him all the time.
I do think some of the posts here are quite harsh towards the OP, she just wanted to say good by to a friend, not realising the rules the family had put in place. If they had rules, they should have let people know.

Hopefully time will heal this family rift, and everyone can move on. Maybe just stay quiet, and wait for them to contact you.

welbeck Mon 05-Sept-22 12:38:42

must be a spoof.
dang !
caught again.

Callistemon21 Mon 05-Sept-22 12:45:36

I honored his order of not contacting him but not because he ordered me to but because if I had spoken to him I would have cut him to shreds with my tongue and knew that doing so would only compound the stress he was under

Quite shocking that you even thought of doing that.

The wishes of the next-of-kin are paramount.

It's unbelievable that the OP is making it all about her at this difficult time for the man's family.

You could be right, welbeck.
It stretches credulity.

Namsnanny Mon 05-Sept-22 13:00:48

I'm sorry for your loss, and the blow up with your son.

I think your response to ask the family to take him to hospital, (which they ignored), is a big part of the problem.
Plus, you had the kindness to make an extra effort to see him.
Which it would appear they didn't.

You may well have compounded it by not asking his wife if you could visit him.
Although I really dont see that is ignoring the feelings of the family. How could you know what they required if they didnt make it clear?
You did afterall, ask the hospital.

I think it's such a shame that a dying person can be controlled in such a way.

Yes the family are grieving, but so are you.

In short, I think their grief has been turned into anger against you
A) because you were right about his poor health, which they didnt respond to.
B) it's easier to be angry at someone rather than look to ones own failings.

BUT, please please think of the bigger picture and eating humble pie.
Apologise to all of them, so your son can find some relief from the intolerable situation he finds himself in, I feel through no fault of his own.

icanhandthemback Mon 05-Sept-22 13:10:48

I don't think this is straight forward but I do think you have overstepped the mark in this instance. You had been told not to visit but you decided you would anyway. That is a big no-no.
I think it is sad that this gentleman was left to die alone. When a relative is in Comfort Care, there is normally a way that someone close to the person can stay for the entire time.
The man who brought me up for the longest time out of all my "fathers" and who I thought of as my Dad died back in March. He had gone on to marry another woman who had 2 fatherless children of her own. When I heard he was in "Comfort Care" I immediately asked if I could see him. They said, "No." I was heart broken so do you know what I did? I howled my eyes out and respected their wishes. Did I think they were unreasonable? Yes, but she was his wife and I had to take that into account whether I wanted to or not. That is what you do if you have empathy.

grumppa Mon 05-Sept-22 13:13:09

Apart from anything else, it would have been a matter of courtesy to contact his wife or daughter, or your son, to check when you could make your visit without overlapping with any visits they might have planned.

ExDancer Mon 05-Sept-22 13:23:55

Poor Mal2, she's not likely to be posting on here again after all that vileness.
All she did was visit a dying man in hospital. A man who had been written off by his family 4 days before he died, and who's grandchildren had been told he was already dead.

LovelyCuppa Mon 05-Sept-22 13:28:34

If the OP is always this wilful her son and DIL will have stopped giving her much information a long time ago so I doubt her account of FIL's last few days are all that accurate tbh.

LondonMzFitz Mon 05-Sept-22 13:29:08

I'm firmly on the side of those who think OP has overstepped the boundaries here -

Whatever the choices the DiL and her mother - the wife of the deceased - in not being by the bedside, it strikes me as incredibly rude, indeed, incredibly thoughtless, for the OP to put herself in the position of one giving out the details of him being moved out of ICU. In a text! Can you imagine being the direct family expecting news of the death and getting that text from a member of extended family?

Worse still - quoting from the OP :
*I was told that his wife does not want me to come to there house as her anger toward me is palatable.
I told him I was just fine with that as I had no desire at all to see her but that I wanted and needed to see my grandchildren an he agreed to bring them to me.
I told my son to make sure his wife understands that I will NEVER compromise who I am and what my beliefs are to make her feel better.
I told him the burden is on her to contact me.
I told him this will remain a situation where she and I will have to agree to disagree.
I told him I have moved on and that If she wants to live in anger she owns the problem, not me*.

Good God! This is their bereavement and OP is laying down all sorts of laws, dictating terms, demanding to see the grandchildren.

Someone needs a good dose of cold hard fact that the World does not revolve around her, and it isn't the DiL or her bereaved Mother!

Extraordinary post, OP.

pensionpat Mon 05-Sept-22 13:30:12

I can’t see from the OP that the wife and daughter did not visit the dying man during his last 4 Days. In fact, the sons angry Text indicated that the two women were going back to see him. Hardly “writing him off”

Smileless2012 Mon 05-Sept-22 13:38:44

confused the OP wasn't told she couldn't visit him icanhandthemback.

Iam64 Mon 05-Sept-22 14:07:03

It really is an extraordinary post, as summarised by LondonMzFitz.
Initially my thought was what an angry, self righteous woman this is. The idea she would visit a dying man without communicating with his wife/daughter is hard to believe. Saying she had to do so to help her ‘grieve and have closure ‘ sounds like something out of one if those not very good US psychology mags

I’m joining the cynics here who think the
OP is a budding author

Callistemon21 Mon 05-Sept-22 14:07:16

ExDancer

Poor Mal2, she's not likely to be posting on here again after all that vileness.
All she did was visit a dying man in hospital. A man who had been written off by his family 4 days before he died, and who's grandchildren had been told he was already dead.

A man who had been written off by his family 4 days before he died
That is a very unfair thing to say, Ex-Dancer
He may well have been beyond knowing anyone and the family may have said their goodbyes to him when he may have understood. For reasons unknown to us they may have not wanted to see him in his death throes.

Callistemon21 Mon 05-Sept-22 14:11:47

When a relative is in Comfort Care, there is normally a way that someone close to the person can stay for the entire time.

Sorry, but our experience has been that you could sit with a loved one day and night, go home for something to eat, a shower then find that they had died when you were not there, as if they were holding on, not letting go whilst there was family there.
Sometimes a member of the medical staff will advise leaving because the patient needs and wants to go in private, even if they are in a coma.

Callistemon21 Mon 05-Sept-22 14:15:10

Extraordinary post, OP.
It is indeed, LondonMzFitz!
Well summed up.

Saying she had to do so to help her ‘grieve and have closure ‘ sounds like something out of one if those not very good US psychology mags

I’m joining the cynics here who think the OP is a budding author

If so, I think she will need a good editor, Iam64.

icanhandthemback Mon 05-Sept-22 15:39:01

Smileless2012

confused the OP wasn't told she couldn't visit him icanhandthemback.

I was grieving as well and called the following day to see if I could join them as I wanted to see my son and comfort him. I was told no. My DIL and her mother were not wanting any visitors.

I would have taken it that I wasn't to visit if I had been told that because I would have assumed the family would be there until he died.

Smileless2012 Mon 05-Sept-22 15:43:22

"My DIL and her mother were not wanting any visitors". That reads to me that the OP wanted to go to their home to see them, not to the hospital but of course without clarification from the OP it's open to interpretation.

icanhandthemback Mon 05-Sept-22 15:44:41

Callistemon21

^When a relative is in Comfort Care, there is normally a way that someone close to the person can stay for the entire time.^

Sorry, but our experience has been that you could sit with a loved one day and night, go home for something to eat, a shower then find that they had died when you were not there, as if they were holding on, not letting go whilst there was family there.
Sometimes a member of the medical staff will advise leaving because the patient needs and wants to go in private, even if they are in a coma.

Over the years my experience has been that I have been able to stay day and night. I've even been given my own room so I don't have to leave the hospital. When I was sleeping or showering, another member of the family took my place. This has happened on a number of occasions and never have we had a member of staff suggest we leave the patient on their own but I am sure that might happen.

imaround Mon 05-Sept-22 15:54:24

I can tell you that when ny father died in April, he did in fact wait until we all went home to do so. The hospice team told us that often happens.

I think there is more to this story, but to be honest it is what thebop said and did after the hospital that makes her unreasonable. The rest could be down to miscommunication or lack of communication.

imaround Mon 05-Sept-22 15:55:09

Oh lord ny typing. Sorry!

HousePlantQueen Mon 05-Sept-22 16:08:44

Am I the only one who is wondering why the 'loving' wife and daughter of the man didn't visit him themselves, but sat at home waiting for the poor man to die? Or did I read this wrong? Sorry, I have only quickly read the thread.

VioletSky Mon 05-Sept-22 16:12:19

I think that possibly they told the children early because many children went back to school today and they wanted to comfort them first

Might not make sense to everyone but may have been easier for them

tickingbird Mon 05-Sept-22 16:19:04

Apart from anything else they’re in the wrong for leaving this man to die alone. Who does that??