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LucyGransnet (GNHQ) Thu 17-Nov-16 10:42:52

The wrong kind of refugee?

In recent years, the world has witnessed a refugee crisis that has forced more than a million men, women and children to flee the brutal violence in their own countries. Yet despite the life-threatening situations they face, these refugees (including children) have often been met with a degree of suspicion and fear in the nations they have escaped to.

Author Barbara Fox, whose own mother was evacuated from inner-city Newcastle as a child, wonders what the difference between Britain's long-ago children and today's refugees is?

Barbara Fox

The wrong kind of refugee?

Posted on: Thu 17-Nov-16 10:42:52

(999 comments )

Lead photo

Are today's refugees really any different?

When I read a headline recently about the outrage of a 'picturesque' village to which 70 'child migrants' were to be sent, I was reminded of another time in our history when places in the countryside were obliged to welcome strangers into their midst.

Back in 1940 when she was six years old, my mother, Gwenda, and her older brother, Doug, were among the hundreds of thousands of children who left their inner-city homes and were evacuated to the countryside to escape the German bombs.

Gwenda's main memory of her journey from Newcastle to the Lake District centres round the banana she was given to eat by her mother – the last she was to see for several years. A teacher ordered the children to sit on their bags, and consequently, when Gwenda came to unpack later, she found squashed banana over all her belongings.

On arrival in the pretty village of Bampton they were lined up in the church hall while the villagers came to choose who they wanted. Yes, it does seem unbelievable that that was how the evacuees were billeted to their families! You might imagine that Gwenda and Doug – clean, nicely dressed children - would have been snapped up first (they would surely be the refugees that no one would protest about today!). But actually, that was not the case. Gwenda was the youngest child there as she was tagging along with Doug and his class of nine-year-olds - their mother had insisted that the pair should not be separated. Consequently, the locals were expecting older children, and someone of Gwenda's size probably didn't look very useful in this farming community.

Were these home-grown children that our rural communities welcomed back then really so different from the oft-maligned refugee children today?


Gwenda and Doug were the only children left when the wife of the village headmaster arrived. As the mother of two sons, she had to be persuaded to take a girl. However, she relented, and so the children went home with her. They would spend three happy years living in the schoolhouse and Gwenda would keep in touch with the couple she called 'Aunty' and 'Uncle' for the rest of their lives.

The following year, in more desperate circumstances, Bampton opened its doors to another influx of children, this time from the shipbuilding town of Barrow-in-Furness.

Undoubtedly thousands of lives were saved by this evacuation of the nation's children, and indeed, Gwenda and Doug's own street in Newcastle was bombed.

Britain also welcomed refugees from Europe, including thousands of Jewish children who might otherwise have perished.

Were these home-grown children that our rural communities welcomed back then really so different from the oft-maligned refugee children today? I would go so far as to say that the inner-city children who turned up in Bampton were often just as alien to their rural hosts as the foreign newcomers seem to be to the 'picturesque' village dwellers. But equally, both could teach something to the other.

Those harking back to 'when Britain was great' perhaps forget that it was also characterised by our opening our doors to those in need.

When the War Is Over by Barbara Fox, the story of Gwenda’s wartime evacuation, is published by Sphere and is available from Amazon.

By Barbara Fox

Twitter: @Gransnet

durhamjen Mon 16-Jan-17 00:37:36

They ARE actually just passing through Croydon, not staying there. It IS the government's main immigration centre, after all. You'd be complaining like mad if they hadn't been vetted there.
Like I've said before, you're all heart, Mair.

Maggie725 Wed 18-Jan-17 10:25:16

I read just now about the homeless.
It is expensive for many pensioners to send £22 for a homeless person to have a Christmas dinner and home for the night and new clothes.But you can give what you like into a collecting tin for this or any other charity.
Or send £3 by text.

Welshwife Wed 18-Jan-17 11:35:16

Some of the young children in Calais started out with parents or much older siblings but in some cases have been separated en route or had their parent die - so many being drowned apart from the hazards of walking great distances in the cold. I know someone who actually works in the camps from time to time and there are these young children - many are looked after by other families.
I have no solution to this dreadful mess we, as the human race, find ourselves in and the fact that these people think it necessary to travel these huge distances to find a safe haven is very sad. Many of them are in camps much nearer to their home areas but many of them choose to travel for whatever reason. Lots of them have a bit of English rather than other European languages - this makes them head for the UK.
The U.K. Govt keep telling everyone how well Britain is doing on the job front whereas there are more people out of work in other countries - what would you go for- a place where there are no jobs or one which boasts they have plenty?
I saw a report this morning how a baby has been found frozen to death in a car in I think Greece - not sure about the mother - but that is an awful state of affairs.
The state of Syria looks really bad from the news reports - nowhere for these people to go back to - I find it completely mystifying why anyone would totally ruin their country and make it virtually uninhabitable. Does anyone have a contact who has actually been to any of those places recently and can tell us if it is all as bad as it appears or are we just seeing selected areas?

Mair Wed 18-Jan-17 11:53:31

"Some of the young children in Calais started out with parents or much older siblings but in some cases have been separated en route or had their parent die - so many being drowned apart from the hazards of walking great distances in the cold."

I haven't seen a single definitive case like this in the media. It is extremely unlikely in the event of a boat sinking that the parents would drown and a young child survive.

Its also extremely unlikely that rare cases such as this wouldnt
have been brought to the attention of the strongly pro migrant broadcasting media. The BBC was constantly propagandizing for admission of the so called 'unaccompanied children' at Calais.

" I know someone who actually works in the camps from time to time and there are these young children - many are looked after by other families."

Nobody doubts there are/were young children in Calais but they are with their parents, or possibly in some cases their Guardians, aunts or uncles. The charity workers who go to the camps are almost universally of the 'believe every word they say (no matter how implausible) and let them all in' outlook! I doubt your friends impressions on her visits have been checked out or are reliable I am afraid.

Why do you think the Charity workers didnt get any of these alleged lone little orphans to the front of the queue when May allowed a number of them in? Pushy as the adult men they let in may have been, I cannot believe the authority of the charity workers on the ground was entirely ignored.

Welshwife Wed 18-Jan-17 12:46:28

There have been reports about these young children on the news and also in European newspapers - maybe you have just not been seeing them. It is quite possible for a few people to fall in the water and drown from these small boats or for some people to be rescued and others not.

If you do not want to believe there are children in these dire circumstances that is your prerogative but I know it is true - her happiness when she returns to the camp and finds again a child she was worried about is immense - and she will tell about how they are doing etc.

Mair Wed 18-Jan-17 13:13:46

"There have been reports about these young children on the news and also in European newspapers - maybe you have just not been seeing them"eeeee

Many but only hearsay, no solid evidence, even though such evidence would have done a great deal to counterbalance the negative public opinion which has arisen as a result of growing awareness of adult men lying and posing as minors, and charities colluding with them to cover up.

I am sure your friend finds her charitable work most heartwarming but it doesn't mean her superficial perceptions are accurate.
Does she still go, as new camps are apparently regathering at Calais? What a mess!

whitewave Wed 18-Jan-17 13:42:17

So in your world * mair* what would you like to happen?

rosesarered Wed 18-Jan-17 13:48:15

It hardly matters what Mair or any of us would like to happen, it only matters what does happen.
On the subject of children being home alone in Calais camps I think it's quite obvious that they were not the 'children' we expected to see at all.

Mair Wed 18-Jan-17 13:57:02

There aren't simple answers to that very broad question, but perhaps you can be more specific?
The alleged 'children' at Calais?

Well firstly they were the responsibility of the French and I believe the charity workers and pro migrant campaigners should have been lambasting the French government not ours for failing to deal with them.

Any we took should have been subject to a medical and dental examination to establish their age and only those confirmed as under eighteen and whose relatives in Britain presented an application to the home office, paid for DNA tests to confirm relationship and showed that they have the means to support their relative without becoming a burden on the state, should be accepted.

Now your turn. What would you do? Let in anyone who wants to come or do you have a better option?

Mair Wed 18-Jan-17 14:04:06

On the subject of children being home alone in Calais camps I think it's quite obvious that they were not the 'children' we expected to see at all.

TBH Roses I never expected to see children. It was quite obvious that tots wouldn't be determindly legging it to Calais, paying smugglers and jumping onto lorries. Were such little ones alone even the French authorities would have picked them up and they would have welcomed a warm French bed an a hot French dinner!

If charity workers genuinely believed these myths it will be because the parents are lying in order to get their child into Britain first, knowing when they miraculously pitch up later, they will be allowed to join them.

JessM Wed 18-Jan-17 18:11:49

You've been there and met them yourselves then Mair and Roses - or are your relying on your favourite "post truth" newspapers for facts again?
The newspapers that have been criticised by the United Nations Commissioner for their racism
www.un.org/apps/news/story.asp?NewsID=50675#.WH-u_rGcau4

rosesarered Wed 18-Jan-17 18:16:24

They were not the children we expected to see arrive here, they were older teenagers at the very best and young men up to 30 at worst.
That is not the definition of children and not what we expected to see.

rosesarered Wed 18-Jan-17 18:20:18

Jess Keep your daft insults to yourself.... and you certainly love post truth yourself as you are forever quoting that phrase.

Mair Wed 18-Jan-17 18:34:20

Jess said

You've been there and met them yourselves then Mair and Roses - or are your relying on your favourite "post truth" newspapers for facts again?

Neither of those. I am using my life experience which tells me that children of primary school age do not cross continents alone, finding the money to pay smugglers, still less go off piste to make their way to Calais (not follow the flow to Germany) through countries where they do not speak the language because they have some alleged relatives in the UK, relatives who care do little for them they dont even bother to go to Calais to find them and help to bring them here.

IMO anyone would have to be extraordinarily gullible to swallow this.,

durhamjen Wed 18-Jan-17 19:11:20

What's your definition of children, mair?

A million people arrived in the EU by sea in 2015.
Only 3,800 of them drowned or went missing in the Mediterranean.
How remiss of the others. That would solve your problem.

Mair Wed 18-Jan-17 20:11:28

You see what I mean by sniping DJ.
Youre at it again.

Was there any need for those last two comments?
I dont think so.

JessM Wed 18-Jan-17 20:13:15

You know I think it's the first time I've used the expression on Gn, Perhaps you are getting me confused with someone else.
You seem to be implying that if children are over 11 then you are quite happy that they are wandering around Europe without anyone to look after them.
And before you start blaming their parents again - you can have no idea about the individual circumstances that have led to these vulnerable youngsters being in such a desperate situation.

durhamjen Wed 18-Jan-17 20:35:35

What is your definition of children, mair?
Do you have any?
I think in this country they are children until 18.
Why should it be any different for children from other countries who want to come and live here?

rosesarered Wed 18-Jan-17 20:48:07

Had there really been vulnerable youngsters then the French authorities would have stepped in.Simple as that. I remember quite a few posters wondering about that.
djen you really do say the most horrible things don't you? Post of 19.11.20

rosesarered Wed 18-Jan-17 20:53:09

Wandering about Europe? The migrants in the Calais camps were looked after by the French and charities topped up everything that they needed.Some of them lived there for ages, waiting to get on lorries / trains.They were in France. Perfectly safe, and yet they were all making a beeline for the UK.
The camps are not there now, and if more migrants arrive the French will not allow another Jungle to spring up.

durhamjen Wed 18-Jan-17 21:00:15

Roses, you really say the most naive things, don't you?
Three wise monkeys comes to mind.
The camps aren't in Calais now, so that's okay, is it?
The kids you refuse to acknowledge are kids are still there, though.
The French didn't allow the first Jungle to spring up.

rosesarered Wed 18-Jan-17 21:09:41

Me naive.....that is reserved for you djen and your misplaced sentiment for economic migrants.Anyone in France is in a safe country and a well off one, why on earth should they be allowed to come to the UK simply because they want to!

rosesarered Wed 18-Jan-17 21:12:36

Real refugees are one thing, economic migrants trying to get into the UK ( in lorries) are another matter.

whitewave Wed 18-Jan-17 21:15:30

My concern is that we are where we are. Silly decisions or probably no decision has been made by all governments which has resulted in the inhuman camps and suffering whether children, elderly young or old. If I had a say I would have a refugee budget paid into by all European countries in order to ensure that all refugees were adequately housed and fed whilst their cases were sorted.

durhamjen Wed 18-Jan-17 21:17:12

Do you never read or watch any real news, roses?
The last child to be killed falling off a lorry was a 14 year old trying to get to family here. They were his only family left in the world.
At least I do have feelings. I am not heartless like some on here.

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