Mum won't pay for care.

* If things get bad Social Services will get involved and then she will have to pay.*

Social Services can’t force anyone into care, no matter how bad it gets. This was the case with our relative before they ended up in hospital after a couple of falls. The relative has stairs in their home and can’t get up them to the bathroom. Wouldn’t have a stairlift, got washed in the kitchen, slept in the living room and used a commode in a downstairs room. Not a thing could be done, because they were assessed as having the mental capacity to decide for themselves. We’re waiting for an assessment of capacity after a further fall which has resulted in brain injury. Only if they are diagnosed as lacking capacity can we intervene and get the various authorities involved. It’s really frustrating.

When MIL was in this situation the Hospital refused to let her go home, it was either stay on the ward or go into a Nursing home.
I suspect MIL enjoyed the attention in the hospital and would gladly have stayed there.

So sorry Pammiel, that's a similar story to mine. Exactly down to dismissing the care before the financial assessment!

Have you spoken to your relative about this? I know it's their choice, but it's so hard. My Mother has an LPA. I am not her attourney as she chose not to make me one. She seems to think it's fun to pressure, manipulation and guilt on me, who hasn't got the power.... rather than ask the ones who have the power to manage her finances for her, in the event of her mental incapacity.

OnwardandUpward

So sorry Pammiel, that's a similar story to mine. Exactly down to dismissing the care before the financial assessment!

Have you spoken to your relative about this? I know it's their choice, but it's so hard. My Mother has an LPA. I am not her attourney as she chose not to make me one. She seems to think it's fun to pressure, manipulation and guilt on me, who hasn't got the power.... rather than ask the ones who have the power to manage her finances for her, in the event of her mental incapacity.

Yes, we’ve tried but they wouldn’t allow a LPA either, which would have made things easier given that there is now a brain injury after the last fall. We can only wait and see whether they are assessed as having capacity to make decisions - if so we’ll have another go at persuasion. If not, it will be a court appointed guardian making the decisions, so a lot more complicated in terms of submitting accounts, etc, but at least they will have no choice but to accept and pay for care if it’s deemed necessary. It’s all so unnecessary isn’t it ? When I get to the age when I need care I hope to heaven I can be objective about it and not cause problems for my nearest and dearest.

Oh no, so sorry to hear of all the stress caused by your relative being so obstructive and awful, Pammiel. It really seems selfish to make it so hard to be cared for!

In the case of my relative, they don't go out, can't buy things by themselves , can't spend money on anything so their multiple pensions are just piling up, on top of their savings... and yet they are too worried about money to spend any on their own care????

What do they think they are going to be spending their money on, then???? It's so crazy and annoying/frustrating/upsetting isn't it. I haven't said any of this to them, but it is a relief to get it "out there". I hope I am never this difficult or downright impossible. I am sure you won't be Pammiel, not when you've had to deal with this and me too.

The next time your mother complains that you or your siblings are not doing enough to help her, be frank.

Tell her that seen from where you all are, she can afford to pay for the care she needs but will not do so.

She has the right to decide what she will or will not spend her money on, but be quite plain with her that she has no right to assume or demand that you or anyone else in the family will either offer her a home, or drop everything to look after her.

You are still working and paying money towards your own pension, so you cannot afford to stop working.

And honestly, if you ever had had the desire to care for the elderly, you would have trained to do so.

Tell her this, and stop feeling guilty - your brothers and sisters have obviously tried telling and got nowhere, Do the same as they have done, otherwise you will most likely end up on bad terms with them over the problem of your mother.

She is only a problem because you feel you should accede to her unreasonable demands.

Who has the lasting power of Attorney?
They must deal with the situation.

@*grandtanteJE65 * thanks for the clarity. You're right, I am still paying towards my own pension. She knows that, but doesn't appear to care- and quite honestly I'm hurt by that.

True, I am not trained in care because I have never had a desire to do it and also have never felt able. I admire carers and it probably takes a very special person.

She is making unreasonable demands, true. I will not give in to them, but I am feeling uncomfortable with her decisions (that I don't consider wise) and her expectations of me (that I don't consider loving).

I don't have POA and those that do say she has capacity to make her own decisions. She does- and she's allowed to make bad ones. So sad, but I can't change anything.

Sadly not a lot you can do op she sounds very self centred and selfish! Seems to put money above everything! You have done your best nothing else you can do love, don’t feel guilty,

Yes , she loves money before people, I'm sad to say. She would happily let me spend all mine on her and still not spend any of hers to help herself because she feels entitled to mine, perhaps?

OandU Your mother is acting like she is because she knows she can and that you will always respond and she can feel powerful and feel she still has agency.

In a way you are the origin of your own dilemma. I am willing to bet that your mother has always been emotionally manipulative and selfish, in which case it is foolish to expect her to change. She is what she is, and you just have to accept it and not expect her to care whether you need to work or make sure you have a reasonable pension. She never has and never will.

You need to accept her for what she is and either continue to be at her beck and call, despite it ruining your life, or tell her firmly as grandetante recommends that she is what she is and as that is the case, you will no longer co-operate. She is the cause of her own dilemma and must be left to sort it out.

You are doing what so many people do in similar and dissimilar situations, keep believing that one day a life-long selfish and self-centred person, will suddenly see the light and be grateful for all your efforts. It is an illusion. limited to works of fiction, where such a person, suddenly sees the light, and thanks their domestic drudge for all their efforts. Your mother will be selfish to the end, and never be grateful for your devotion, so stop looking for the approbabtion she will never give and act like she does and put your own life first.

eazybee

Who has the lasting power of Attorney?
They must deal with the situation.

Not sure if there is an LPA in place in the OP’s case, easybee. But sadly, even if there were, it’s useless, as LPA’s can be registered ready for use, but can’t be activated while the donor (in this case the OP’s mum) is still judged to have the capacity to make their own decisions - even if they’re bad ones !! As an example, I have LPA for my mum who is 91 and has dementia. As it’s progressing she does have short periods of confusion but is mostly lucid, so she is judged as still having capacity at various times. If I need a decision on any aspect of her care or daily life I have to ensure that I discuss it with her and that at the time the decision is made, she is fully capable of understanding the implications of that decision and agrees that it’s in her best interests. Obviously as the disease progresses there will come a stage when the responsibility will be fully on me.

SueDonim

Assuming she doesn’t have dementia or any other cognitive issues, I’d leave her to stew in it. It’s her life and her choice.

Perfect answer.

M0nica, I do accept that she won't change. I'm dismayed and hurt by all the time she's wasted (under the pretext of needing help) but all the while she's been back stabbing every effort I've made and undoing all my good work. Despite the fact that she doesn't live locally anymore , I feel satisfied with my intentions, the help I offered and my conscience is completely clear.

No doubt, she will do nothing to help her situation so that she can continue to act like the victim in the situation she created. (((sigh)))

I have made her choices clear to her and made it clear that I will not be back in her neck of the woods in the foreseeable future, due to our holidays and work commitments. As she did not see fit to make me POA, I am going to neatly side step all of it. If she had stayed living down the road and had seen fit to treat me as a competent adult, things would be quite different.

She can stew.

Meanwhile, many of her barbed comments have left me emotionally crippled and needing counselling.

Pammiel, its hard isn't it. Been there with my lovely in-laws, who were impeccably behaved , always grateful and respectful, kind and polite - even when cognition had gone. They wouldn't have dreamed of backstabbing anyone, or saying anything designed to cause harm.

I hope your Mother doesn't make any bad decisions. It's their choice, yes. I hope your Mother isn't too far away for you to keep a good eye on her as the dementia progresses. Such a cruel disease, I know.

Thank you for your answer, Pammiel. I had PoA for my father, but not until he had to live in a care home, against his wishes.
Very painful, but I had to stand back because nothing I said or did made any difference. I lived a long way away with a full time job, mortgage and dependent children.
OnwardandUpward has to accept this, stand back and let nature take its course.

OnwardandUpward, we had power of attorney set up for mum. She believed, right up until her dying day, that her wonderful children paid for all the luxury care homes. She had no idea that her savings were dwindling - or her house was sold!

Meanwhile - my friend's mum expects all the help from her daughter, wants to stay in her home, refuses to let 'strangers' in, won't have her bathroom adapted etc.

It's pretty much a hoarder's house, she can barely move, is very demanding, expects constant attention - yet refuses any medical or outside help. My friend is exhausted and has no life of her own.

It's just complete madness, so I wait to see what happens next - she'll have a nasty fall or my friend will have a breakdown (sorry - but know which I'd prefer).

My friend's mother was very similar; lived to 104, refused to adapt in any way and conducted a battle of wills against her daughter and the medical staff until her dying day. She was compelled to enter a nursing home by her doctor only after she took an overdose in an attempt to prevent a family weekend away and her daughter was recalled from her first break for months; he refused to certify her as capable of independent living and she was thwarted, probably for the first time in her life.

OandU, you have made the right decision.

I had a loving mother but she had large areas of incomprehension in her make up, and I wasted lot of time trying to explain to her how I thought and why I did things. Some time in my mid-forties, I realised that I was wasting my time. She had these blanks in her mental make-up and if I tried to explain for 50 years she would still not understand.

So I stopped, just accepted that she never would understand and I just didn't tell her about things I knew she wouldn't be interested in. My sisters did the same - and yes, of course it affected our relationship, you cannot be really close to someone, however much you love each other, if one person, just never talks about some of the things that really interest them because the other person is incapable of understanding.

Eazybee yes I do accept it. Nature will take it's course. I'm not happy about it, but my hands are tied.

Hetty58 wow, that's nice for your Mum to have been able to believe so.

That's really nasty for your friend. My Mother was doing that to my sibling who lives near her, but they had a breakdown already. It's so selfish! I went to try and give them a break- but all the things I solved are now a mess again. At least they know I tried- and I was happy to spend some time with my Mum... it's just that my overall feelings are hurt and frustrated.

Wow Eazybee about your friend's Mum. How utterly selfish to cause so much stress. Definitely not a loving Mother to do that. How her daughter must have needed that holiday!

M0nica that's understandable. My Mother and I had some good times, but overall we are quite incompatible in some areas. I stopped telling her things years ago too because I knew she wouldn't understand. It's not like I am looking for approval. I get it elsewhere.

It's sad though. In an ideal world, parents would accept help and want the best for themselves (and us) as long as we all live.

@Onward having read your comments, it seems as though your mother is trying everything she can to gain control over you.

Her attempts to ruin your marriage, the fit when you renewed your vows, moving away, canceling all the arrangements you made for her, even down to demanding you pay when she’s more than able.

While I’m sure her striving for control over those around her isn’t news to you, I wanted to validate how you’re feeling, and remind you that there’s literally nothing you can do. Even if you gave up everything in your life to cater to her every whim, she STILL wouldn’t be happy. Those who demand control over others never are.

Take care of yourself. You deserve it.

MercuryQueen, thanks, I think you're accurate and I appreciate your validation. When you add up the evidence, it certainly paints a desperate picture of a controlling person.

I think you're right. If she had complete control of me, she would reduce me to nothing-and still not be happy. I came close to suicide when my marriage broke down- and at my lowest, it seemed as though she revelled in my pain- and even added to it by bullying. When I realised she was contacting my husband behind my back, I was suspicious about her motives and decided to work on the relationship with my husband. That's when she cut me off and moved away.

I used to wish I had a Mother who wanted me to thrive in every way and who just wanted the best for me, but I accept that I'll never have that. I wanted the best for her, but she doesn't want the best for her- or for me. Thanks for the and the validation. I appreciate it. Even though I'll not have a mother who wants the best for me, just to be validated is more than I've ever had.

I know I'm not the only one. [Flowers] to everyone who had to parent the parent and appease or be cut off.

What makes you feel you still have to appease her? When you say cut off, do you mean in her will? - by the way, I ask that with no value judgement at all.

All you can do is to say that she needs care and that she is a grown intelligent adult and can set this up. Offer her help to do it, and if she refuses you can only walk away.

It makes me so cross when I hear of parents who want to stay in control of their children's lives right to the bitter end.

Honestly, I would love my DDs to be with me more as I am in eye-watering pain and every tiny thing I do is agony - but I know they have their own lives to lead and I take delight in all the lovely things they do.

I mean she cut off contact with me a while ago when she didn't like my choice to attend counselling with my husband. I didn't know it at the time , but she had decided to end the relationship she was in and had probably earmarked me to be single too, as her companion.

It isn't fair to wreck things for your kids or to withdraw love just because they want to do things that are right for them. As a parent, I know that I want what's best for my kids even when that's not me.

So sorry to hear of your eye watering pain Luckygirl3. I hope you can take some pain relief or find ways of coping that bring you relief.