Inappropriate touching by grandson

It just seems to be almost absent-minded curiosity and no intent to hurt or initiate anything sexual

I don't agree at all. He is 9 - not 3 . He is touching other children inappropriately , which to me indicates that he has possibly been sexually molested by somebody. Minimising it isn't helpful at all. He needs to be counselled by a professional to find out what is behind this . Glossing it over as "curiosity" is not going to help him ( or the kids he is touching - this must be horrible for them ).

A child of 9 would not normally be touching other children in inappropriate places unless they have some learning difficulties or have been watching or had inappropriate things in their own life especially once it has been pointed out to them that it is taboo
The worrying part is it seems it was going on with his younger sibling years ago and has leaked out to school colleagues
It would be useful to know what his reaction has been when asked why he does it I presume he has been asked this ?

particularly because it's still happening occasionally, despite all the interventions and careful explanations he has had this to me is the worrying part most children would shrink from even touching an arm once it had been pointed out to them that it was unacceptable. This indicates he can’t stop himself

I truly feel for you outcast I don’t think it would be at all useful to tell your daughter the item you heard on the radio

I have been wondering if the mum perhaps hasn't been sharing all the facts with the gran and if any, what interventions are taking place.

Drawing on from my own experience, it doesn't sit right with me, that the school haven't been more proactive. Either the mum is not being honest and covering up things or the school is failing the child.

How many on here offering advice, have experience of dealing with situations like this? I would be genuinely interested to know.

I think possibly the question of whether OP should share what she heard on the radio with her family is a red herring. My feeling is that the child would probably be on some type of "behavior plan" at school and there would have been more intensive intervention than has been mentioned here. If not I believe there should be

I commented earlier that the OP hadn’t outlined the interventions she said had occurred. It’s unlikely this behaviour hasn’t been discussed with the safeguarding team in Children’s services. It should trigger an thorough investigation , including in depth interviews with parents and separately with the child. The specialist police team should have been consulted.
In the past a child protection conference would have taken place as that’s where police can provide details of relevant convictions.
We don’t have enough information to reach conclusions. It’s possible the OP doesn’t either

Outcast52 - I can understand why you are so concerned about this. It sounds as though you DD is doing all the right things and that school are on board. They will have protocols for these situations which will include discussing with all the relevant agencies, who will be fully aware of the possibility of sexual abuse or exposure to inappropriate material.

It must have been very disturbing for you to hear the radio programme - but I would not discuss it with DD. I have no doubt that such possibilities will have occurred to her too. It must be a dreadful worry for her and her OH.

I am sorry you are burdened with these worries.

This is SO hard for you Outcast

I have experience of dealing with situations like this.

Don’t read anything into it. He’s probably at that curious age. And it will pass

He is 9 years old. This is NOT idle curiosity! This is highly inappropriate and needs action

From the information you have been given Outcast it appears action is being taken. However it is unclear who is involved in advising/ supporting your grandson and his parents

Things NOT to be considered are random articles/interviews etc about future rapist possibilities

Things to be considered are:
*your grandson specifically!
*family set up/relationships
*events prior to inappropriate touching
*variations in types of touching
*possibility of sexual abuse
*possibility of inappropriate online viewing
*any other behavioural differences
*autism/ADHD spectrum
* emotional difficulties related to any specific events

I think it likely that this is all part of any work with your son and woukd have expected him to have been seen by an educational psychologist and/or CAMHS for assessment.

I would also expect the school to have clear plans in place to ensure that your grandson does not have access to opportunities for inappropriate touching. There is likely to be support for other children too.

I would advise that you gently try to find out a little more about the specifics of what is happening from your daughter, encourage her to express her obvious worries about her son, and then be there to advise, support, encourage action as appropriate. Support her talking to school or anyone else if she wants it.

Be aware that if another incident occurs it will be doing your loved grandson no favours to hide it. If out of school it has to be reported.

My sympathies at facing such a difficult situation.

Madgran77

This is SO hard for you Outcast

I have experience of dealing with situations like this.

Don’t read anything into it. He’s probably at that curious age. And it will pass

He is 9 years old. This is NOT idle curiosity! This is highly inappropriate and needs action

From the information you have been given Outcast it appears action is being taken. However it is unclear who is involved in advising/ supporting your grandson and his parents

Things NOT to be considered are random articles/interviews etc about future rapist possibilities

Things to be considered are:
*your grandson specifically!
*family set up/relationships
*events prior to inappropriate touching
*variations in types of touching
*possibility of sexual abuse
*possibility of inappropriate online viewing
*any other behavioural differences
*autism/ADHD spectrum
* emotional difficulties related to any specific events

I think it likely that this is all part of any work with your son and woukd have expected him to have been seen by an educational psychologist and/or CAMHS for assessment.

I would also expect the school to have clear plans in place to ensure that your grandson does not have access to opportunities for inappropriate touching. There is likely to be support for other children too.

I would advise that you gently try to find out a little more about the specifics of what is happening from your daughter, encourage her to express her obvious worries about her son, and then be there to advise, support, encourage action as appropriate. Support her talking to school or anyone else if she wants it.

Be aware that if another incident occurs it will be doing your loved grandson no favours to hide it. If out of school it has to be reported.

My sympathies at facing such a difficult situation.

What a good, supportive, helpful post. GN at its best.

Outcast52, I can only imagine the great anxiety you must be feeling, I am not qualified to comment on the situation with your GS. Your daughter will be dealing with this and there may well be interventions happening that you are unaware of. It is difficult to raise the problem with your daughter, perhaps if you keep asking about his welfare she will open up - although she will be very upset about what is happening will also be trying to protect you. I don't know what to say to comfort you , but please know I can well imagine your pain . My GS is 10 years old and in your position I would be beside my self with worry. I am thinking about you. Lots of speculation going on , please don't torment yourself ! The school will have guidelines in place for this and no doubt they are being followed. Try and save your emotional energy for your GSs parents. I send you empathy and ' hugs'

Thank you to those kind compassionate voices sprinkled through this conversation. Those of you talking about "minimising" and "abuse" come across as critical and snarling - these are exactly the kind of comments I didn't need. You must think I'm completely dense not to have considered this possibility. I wish I had never shared my concerns.

Madgran 77 and Shelflife: I had posted my response before seeing your comments. Thank you both

I’m so sorry you are having to go through this, and glad to hear it isn’t being swept under the carpet for things to take their natural cause. I’m sure the school have dealt with incidents like this plenty of times, and are on it. As are the parents.

I have no experience of anything like this, but am inclined instinctively, to think along the same lines as those wary posters. Nine does seem a little old for it to be a mistake. My granddaughter is nine, and very well versed, if you understand me.

My advice would be to let the professionals do their job, and try not to worry. Hopefully...it can be nipped in the bud before he gets much older.

Outcast52
I do think the possibility of online abuse should be investigated - he may have been targeted/groomed and be reporting back to an abuser.

Sorry to worry you but it happens more frequently now. It is something you could suggest to your DD.

Good luck.

Outcast52

Thank you to those kind compassionate voices sprinkled through this conversation. Those of you talking about "minimising" and "abuse" come across as critical and snarling - these are exactly the kind of comments I didn't need. You must think I'm completely dense not to have considered this possibility. I wish I had never shared my concerns.

I agree with you, it’s a shame about the tone of those posts.

outcast, if you don’t say that sexual abuse has crossed your mind posters don’t know that. I’m afraid your post came across to me as rather downplaying your grandson’s actions when you suggested ‘absent minded curiosity’. It’s unkind to say posters who are trying to help are being ‘critical’ and ‘snarley’.

I was the ‘ dedicated CP officer’ at my Primary school. This situation would have been passed to the relevant SS department , pretty early on as a ‘what if’. And would I think have been investigated quickly.

Outcast52 I can understand your anxiety and feel for you in this difficult situation. I have little experience of this but there organisations that do and who you might like to contact or at least look at their web pages on this subject. I think you may find some reassurance. Look at www.stopitnow.org.uk or www.nspcc.org.uk. It doesn’t seem there should be red lights for gs’s behaviour.

Outcast52, Of course you have considered all the possibilities and most certainly do not need posters spelling them out. My thoughts are with you during this very stressful time. I have no doubt that you have put your own welfare on the back burner but please look after yourself! I hope I have been of some small comfort to you, hope you have a trusted close friend you can confide in . Easy to say I know ,but do get outside for a walk, sounds a minor thing to do but fresh air and a brisk walk may help to lift your anxiety just a little - ??

Thanks Shelflife:

"Easy to say I know ,but do get outside for a walk, sounds a minor thing to do but fresh air and a brisk walk may help to lift your anxiety just a little - ??"

I did that very thing this morning, as I often do first thing. Was feeling very smug at having beaten the rain, then saw some of the posts which upset me. On reflection, I think I'm also upset because others are thinking what I have already wondered and I feel so desperate for him (my GS).

I'm going to consider some of the suggested actions on this thread but think carefully before speaking to my daughter.

Thankyou Lizzie

Outcast Those of you talking about "minimising" and "abuse" come across as critical and snarling - these are exactly the kind of comments I didn't need. You must think I'm completely dense not to have considered this possibility. I wish I had never shared my concerns

The way something is said makes all the difference doesn't it! Being honest doesn't have to be unkind, judgemental etc! Outcast try to take from the suggestions what you can to find a way forward for yourself, your grandson and your family

I may have inadvertently upset some posters by my matter of fact posts, that was never my intention.

What I am trying to say is that in my opinion, talking of grooming and child abuse only serves to upset the OP further and those who may have been abused themselves.
We never know the full background of posters.

I have had extensive training in safeguarding issues and dealt with a fair number of cases and am still involved on a voluntary basis.
However, due to confidentiality issues, we will never know the full story nor whether the victims have been supported too.

I actually hope this thread is deleted, it has caused so much upset.

outcast, if you don’t say that sexual abuse has crossed your mind posters don’t know that. I’m afraid your post came across to me as rather downplaying your grandson’s actions when you suggested ‘absent minded curiosity’. It’s unkind to say posters who are trying to help are being ‘critical’ and ‘snarley’

The problem is when posters state things without consideration of the OP reading them whilst worried/upset/hurting/confused/scared etc!1 It is perfectly possible to raise very difficult issues and possibilities in such a way that the OP can "hear" them, consider them and take advice from them. Also, before assuming that someone is underplaying in actuality from their way of writing about a difficult subject it seems best probe a little further; when something is difficult to write about it can often inadvertently come over in a misleading way. Even more so on forums rather than face to face.

It’s so hard isn’t it Outcast (I even feel harsh using your given name) when you’re involved but not totally involved not sure what to say when and how to say it but going over and over it in your mind I bet most of us grans have all been there with some situation that goes round and round but obviously this is a huge worry
I m glad the parents are onboard with the school with this, it’s so important they all work together
One question…. as you say this has been going on for some years and previously with his younger brother how long have you all been concerned and at 9 would he have had access to online stuff for ‘several years’ for that to be an answer? Or can online grooming be knocked completely on the head ? It seems so if it’s been going on for years
You say it happens now and then does anyone know what is the trigger, has he ever said ?
I hope you can get to the bottom of it and get some rest I m sure he’s not going to grow up to be anything bad so throw that one out of your head and try to think of some nicer things
I m sure he gives you loads of joy

Outcast52 I can’t advise you and wouldn’t dream of doing so. What I can do is hope your whole family receive appropriate help. I can’t imagine your worry, we have an 8 year old GS, take care of yourself too. X

Marydoll

I may have inadvertently upset some posters by my matter of fact posts, that was never my intention.

What I am trying to say is that in my opinion, talking of grooming and child abuse only serves to upset the OP further and those who may have been abused themselves.
We never know the full background of posters.

I have had extensive training in safeguarding issues and dealt with a fair number of cases and am still involved on a voluntary basis.
However, due to confidentiality issues, we will never know the full story nor whether the victims have been supported too.

I actually hope this thread is deleted, it has caused so much upset.

Hoping the thread is deleted because you may have been too forthright is not very helpful for the OP, who posted on here for advice, support and help - not to point score.