Drag Queens

Blondiescot

fancythat

God

Whose god? Your god? What about those who have other gods - or those like me, who have none?

When I say God it is only ever the One true God.
The rest are gods. Entirely different.

I think most people, even though the country is moving away from God, do know when people say God, they mean the God of Heaven and earth.
But I will continue to explain if I need to.

God is the God of All. Regardless whether people sadly, may not know Him. Or know of Him. Yet.

VioletSky

Drag challenges the patriarchy the same way the first woman to put on a pair of trousers did. It banishes gender norms. Or at least that is the way many drag artists view the subject and the intention does matter

No, there are enormous differences. Drag exaggerates femininity with huge eyelashes, massive lips in garish colours, giant hairstyles, enormous breasts and skintight clothing. Only a patriarchy that fetishises women with those attributes whilst simultaneously disrespecting femininity as weak and subordinate can possibly see it as acceptable, and gender norms are far from banished when they are the whole point of drag and the butt of the 'jokes'.

Lily Savage and Dame Edna (amongst others) were different, in that their portrayal of women was affectionate and in many ways used the female personae to satirise men.

Mollygo

Smileless2012

Please don't suggest that I would be OK with you or anyone else being stalked or hounded across threads VS.

On some threads, when I post, I often feel stalked and harassed. The stalkers twist what I say to mean what they want it to mean even when they’ve vowed not to engage. And then they accuse others of stalking and harassing. It’s hard sometimes.

I hear you, Molly.

Just take it to PM or something

It's just unessesary

Doodledog

VioletSky

Drag challenges the patriarchy the same way the first woman to put on a pair of trousers did. It banishes gender norms. Or at least that is the way many drag artists view the subject and the intention does matter

No, there are enormous differences. Drag exaggerates femininity with huge eyelashes, massive lips in garish colours, giant hairstyles, enormous breasts and skintight clothing. Only a patriarchy that fetishises women with those attributes whilst simultaneously disrespecting femininity as weak and subordinate can possibly see it as acceptable, and gender norms are far from banished when they are the whole point of drag and the butt of the 'jokes'.

Lily Savage and Dame Edna (amongst others) were different, in that their portrayal of women was affectionate and in many ways used the female personae to satirise men.

Agree Doodledog

Oh VS, you do love to make a fuss

Drag Queens challenging the patriarchy is debatable, but foremost they parody women, I think you will find that a lot of women don't appreciate the exaggerated and very one dimensional female persona they project. it's often not a sympathetic image. Either a rather spiteful harridan, younger versions often projectjng a fatuous quasi Barbi Doll exterior. In any case I don't know how a disparaging image of women challenges any patriarchal hierarchy , to have such a structure in place already suggests that adherents regard women as unequal and Drag Queens do nothing to reinforce a positive image of women.

fancythat

Blondiescot

fancythat

God

Whose god? Your god? What about those who have other gods - or those like me, who have none?

When I say God it is only ever the One true God.
The rest are gods. Entirely different.

I think most people, even though the country is moving away from God, do know when people say God, they mean the God of Heaven and earth.
But I will continue to explain if I need to.

God is the God of All. Regardless whether people sadly, may not know Him. Or know of Him. Yet.

Why do you set yourself up as an authority on the one and only
One True God? Why do you use the adverb 'sadly' in referring to the fact other people may not know him? That has nothing to do with this post. What does God have to do with Drag Queen's reading stories to children in a library?

FannyCornforth

Oh VS, you do love to make a fuss

I'm fine

Drag challenges the patriarchy the same way the first woman to put on a pair of trousers did, no I don't agree with this at all because that's all she did.

She didn't turn herself into a parody of men, grossly exaggerating maleness she simply put on a pair trousers in a 'look I can wear these too' statement. The majority of drag queens don't just wear clothes and makeup the way women do, they dress and behave in a way the majority of women wouldn't do.

Drag Queens do nothing to reinforce a positive image of women indeed TerriBull in fact they do the polar opposite.

Mollygo

silverberryfern

The idea behind having drag queens read to children in libraries and schools is to promote inclusivity and celebrate diversity in a fun and engaging way.

I really can’t believe I’m reading that.
Where does your inclusivity stop?

Sorry I had to answer the door.
Where does your inclusivity stop? How far would your diversity go?
DQ’s, naturists, mankinis? thong bikinis, flashers in long raincoats? So much diversity out there.

I think if you watch some of the many programmes about drag, you'd realise that not all drag queens are the same. Many speak about the women in their lives as being real role models and cite many famous women as their inspiration. Many have suffered horrendous bullying throughout their childhoods and credit finding their place within the drag community as literally saving their lives. As I've emphasised several times on this thread, you can't tar them all with the same brush. The drag community is just as varied as we all are on here. Some are great, some are lovely people, others - not so much.

I think it's a deliberate attempt to distract and derail the whole discussion FannyCornforth. If it continues, I'll ask gnhq if they can assist because it's becoming quite disruptive now.

Lily Savage, Danny La Rue and Dame Edna were predominantly aimed at an adult audience, never children and, I think that that's what makes the difference in drag queen acts. Plus, whilst there costumes, hairstyles and make up were exaggerated, they were never crude or offensive. I just feel hugely uneasy with enabling a man to parody the female body in front of children. I really don't want little boys to grow up viewing women in that way or thinking that it's amusing and acceptable to laugh at them. Nor do I want little girls to grow up knowing that a section of society can ridicule and parody them just for laughs. Girls grow up with quite enough pressure on them to conform to specific body types without the additional knowledge that they'll be laughed at if they're big busted or heavy hipped. I'm so astounded that anyone would be comfortable with that.

Another good post, BJ.

Blondiescot, I take your point that not all drag queens are the same, but what is the point of having them read to children? Not the people under the drag, but as men in women's clothing, wigs and make-up. What does that add to a story, and what advantage is there to it all?

The drag community is just as varied as we all are on here. Some are great, some are lovely people, others - not so much.

100% agree with this. Now, all we need to do is weed out the risqué and more adult suitable drag queens from appearing in children’s libraries.

It's not about "conditions" or specific identities, but about teaching kids that everyone should be respected and embraced for who they are

But this just isn’t true this isn’t teaching children accepting of anyone because these people aren’t real (perhaps some didn’t realise this! ) , and THEY are certainly teaching NO respect for women with their massive overplay of make up sexual dressing etc, so are they the role models we want for our next generation
No in my opinion they definitely are not

It was on the news the other day about the alarming increase in the number of girls with eating disorders since Covid, but how much of this increase is due to not being happy/satisfied with their body type, or indeed having the 'wrong' one?

I think I can see why a larger than life fictional character, such as a clown or a fairy or a cowboy etc might be used to attract children to a library. Their colourful costumes, funny makeup and props would be seen as huge fun to children and it sparks their imagination to explore further. Which I suppose is why I'm struggling with drag queens exhorting children to wink, wiggle their bottoms and sway their hips.

Posted too soon! I just feel that wiggling one's bottom, winking and swaying their hips, to a malajusted nursery rhyme, is encouraging sexualised behaviour to children too young to know or understand what's being done to them.

I'm going to keep having my own opinions. If I break guidelines please do report me

Never has there been more pressure on girls to conform to an ideal, it doesn't help when actual women, Katie Price, Kim Kardashian, Kylie Jenner present an unrealistic porn star image of the female form via surgical procedures, now we have drag queens in other words men, copying the very worst of that crop of women who not only damage their own bodies but plant the idea in the susceptible that their own natural body isn't good enough.

Beetlejuice

^The drag community is just as varied as we all are on here. Some are great, some are lovely people, others - not so much.^

100% agree with this. Now, all we need to do is weed out the risqué and more adult suitable drag queens from appearing in children’s libraries.

The quoted material is exactly what is used when talking about TW and I agree 100%.

I still don’t get why men feel they need to dress as their idea of ‘women’, whether a parody or not, in order to read to young children. Seems more focussed on their own needs than the needs of children.

Katie Price no longer looks like Katie Price.

VioletSky

I'm going to keep having my own opinions. If I break guidelines please do report me

Hurray! At last! Something I can agree with you about VS.

I am also going to keep having my own opinions.
Have a nice day.

LRavenscroft

fancythat

Blondiescot

fancythat

God

Whose god? Your god? What about those who have other gods - or those like me, who have none?

When I say God it is only ever the One true God.
The rest are gods. Entirely different.

I think most people, even though the country is moving away from God, do know when people say God, they mean the God of Heaven and earth.
But I will continue to explain if I need to.

God is the God of All. Regardless whether people sadly, may not know Him. Or know of Him. Yet.

Why do you set yourself up as an authority on the one and only
One True God? Why do you use the adverb 'sadly' in referring to the fact other people may not know him? That has nothing to do with this post. What does God have to do with Drag Queen's reading stories to children in a library?

I did not want to further explain, but Blondiescot asked me questions.

I most certainly do not set myself up. Far from it!

I mentioned about Drag Queens in a previous post on here.
I have not posted much on this thread.
Did not want to.