What are older people's lives worth?

I think young people suffered far more during Covid and trust me I lost someone and my family had a truly harrowing time.

However, leaving my students who were sent home at a moments notice and told not to come back just weeks before their GCSEs was the worst day of my professional career.

They didn't just miss their education, they lost contact with friends and family, couldn't go to their clubs or after school activities etc.

Very young children didn't see people's faces, only masks. They were not cuddled, given treats or had birthday parties.

The long term effects of this are still being felt in my own grandchildren so no I don't think my life is worth more than theirs. It should not be a lottery. All lives are important and if only the government at the time had realised this!

AnotherBirdLady

www.theguardian.com/inequality/2026/mar/08/did-baby-boomers-eat-all-pies-john-lanchester-truth-generation-gap?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other

I read this article at the weekend and found it very interesting. However, it was a bit chilling near the end when he says that older people should thank the young for their sacrifices during Covid. No-one disputes that younger people were adversely affected by lockdowns and school closures, but older people actually died, often decades before their time. Are the lives of older people worth so little they should be grateful that younger people didn't kill more of them by spreading the virus around? I sometimes have nightmares thinking about what the next pandemic might be like. Perhaps no-one over 60 will be admitted to hospital, and their bodies will be collected each day, after dying quietly at home, so that younger people can have their needs for "socialisation and education" fulfilled. This may be far-fetched but it is surely the logical conclusion for all this dreadful ageism.

Thank the ‘ young ones’. A lot finished work due to stress & MH.

keepingquiet

I think young people suffered far more during Covid and trust me I lost someone and my family had a truly harrowing time.

However, leaving my students who were sent home at a moments notice and told not to come back just weeks before their GCSEs was the worst day of my professional career.

They didn't just miss their education, they lost contact with friends and family, couldn't go to their clubs or after school activities etc.

Very young children didn't see people's faces, only masks. They were not cuddled, given treats or had birthday parties.

The long term effects of this are still being felt in my own grandchildren so no I don't think my life is worth more than theirs. It should not be a lottery. All lives are important and if only the government at the time had realised this!

Yes that is very true.
All ages suffered from one thing or the other.
I suppose that’s not fair of me to say about the younger generation giving up on work.

I did not mean to say that young people who survived suffered less than older people who survived, or that the lives of older people are as important as the lives of younger people. Young people have the opportunity to overcome their difficulties and lead useful and fulfilling lives. There would have been no coming back for the hundreds of thousands of older people who would have died if we hadn't had a lockdown. You need to compare like with like

Everyone's life is important whatever their age. Young and old suffered during Covid. Children's education was disrupted and older people died in hospitals and care homes. It was a terrible time all round for everyone. Now we must look forward to the future and hope that we never have such an awful epidemic ever again.

Different pandemics a of the Spanish flu epidemic of 1918-1919. Those most affect different age groups. In the second and most deadly phaseffected and most likely to die were in the 20-40 age group. My 38 year old grandfather died of Spanish flu in January 1919

So next time, it may be the old and very young going out and about caring for the working age people confined to their homes because they were most at risk.

The decision to shut down the country in 2020 had nothing to do with protecting the elderly, we were housebound anyway, it was all about politicians running round like headless chickens wanting to be seen to do things when they did not want to do. fher countries managed to keep children in school and without lockdowns.

Old were nto the wolves in the last pandemic, old people with COVID were returned to care homes even though they were still infectious, old people were locked in care homes as if they were prisoners and not allowed to leave just left to catch the disease running through care homes like wildfire and forced to catch it and die, no matter what their children wanted. Old people died alone in hospitals and had only minimal funerals, which has caused continuing trauma in many families affecting younger people.

Can I just say my two oldest GC did fine in their GCSEs and A levels. They kept in touch with friends on line. They studied on line. They don't seem affected in the slightest, one at uni and one working. No different to my kids at the same age. I wonder why some were so badly affected.

My younger GC certainly saw people's faces, their parents who had so much quality time with them, no nursery no school no work for some.

We can choose to focus on the negative or we can be positive. Our choice unless we lost loved ones which is a different matter.

M0nica

Different pandemics a of the Spanish flu epidemic of 1918-1919. Those most affect different age groups. In the second and most deadly phaseffected and most likely to die were in the 20-40 age group. My 38 year old grandfather died of Spanish flu in January 1919

So next time, it may be the old and very young going out and about caring for the working age people confined to their homes because they were most at risk.

The decision to shut down the country in 2020 had nothing to do with protecting the elderly, we were housebound anyway, it was all about politicians running round like headless chickens wanting to be seen to do things when they did not want to do. fher countries managed to keep children in school and without lockdowns.

Old were nto the wolves in the last pandemic, old people with COVID were returned to care homes even though they were still infectious, old people were locked in care homes as if they were prisoners and not allowed to leave just left to catch the disease running through care homes like wildfire and forced to catch it and die, no matter what their children wanted. Old people died alone in hospitals and had only minimal funerals, which has caused continuing trauma in many families affecting younger people.

My son and FIL worked on COVID wards. No old people died alone on their wards, my Dil said she couldn't understand how she never caught it when she held so many dying people and was coughed on and vomited on as she held iPads for them to say goodbye. They may not have had family with them but to say they died alone is insulting to the brave young people who cared for them, cried for them and then got on with it.

That should be DIL not FIL, he died in 1949.

Interesting article.
Life is naturally divisive because our very existence means that we are separated into different groups according to our age. I can't see how that is to be avoided.

Personally I think that closing schools was the worst possible decision during covid. There were a couple of posters on GN who even wanted both teachers and pupils to wear masks when schools returned in order to stop transmission. How stupidly wrong would that have been, as if children weren't already making huge sacrifices for older, more vulnerable people?

I think closing most of the country down was a big mistake.
I think the young should have carried on working, whilst the older people sheltered.
All this 2 metre distance stuff was ludicrous, now when I think about it. Someone only had to sneeze by the time you’ve caught up to their spot in the queue you probably would have been covered in the virus anyway.
It absolutely battered my MH.
I couldn’t go over my parents door step, my dad, I hadn’t realised he was suffering from dementia (mum hid it from me, so that it didn’t worry me).
We couldn’t really see our grandson as
We could stand in the hallway, he was only a toddler at the time.
We chose husbands mum who was the worse, to be in our bubble.
Thank the lord KS wasn’t in power, didn’t he said he would have had us in lockdown even longer?
I will never, ever do another lockdown.

I will never, ever do another lockdown.
Likewise.

The person in the article says we should now give something back to the young in return for what they gave the rest of society, but I don't think many people would be prepared to do this.

I disagree, OP. Children and young adults were affected dreadfully and the repercussions are still being felt.
Younger, hitherto healthy people died, too.
I find this thread somewhat distasteful. It wasn’t a competition.

It wasn’t a competition.
👏👏👏

I have heard so many people, of all ages, retired,working and from other countries too, say that they will never, ever do another lockdown.
It seemed to bring out the worst in some people when given the power to control others.

The article is by John Lanchester. From what I have read, he seems somewhat obsessed with supposed intergenerational battles. It is people like him who whil up resentment between generations.

The synopsis of of one of his novels, Look What You Made Me Do, supposedly a satirical comedy:
It is hard to say more without risking spoilers, but if the novel has a state-of-the-nation agenda, it lies in the inequity between the boomers who have helped themselves to everything and the millennials who must live with the consequences.

The Guardian

whil
whip

Early in the pandemic, there was I suspect a worry at the top that the virus would affect all ages- including the skilled adults running and working in all essential services like hospitals. I do not think the early lockdowns were to protect older adults- but for ages so to protect society, and to keep services functional.
In our area, the ambulance service were ordered not to take people over 60 to hospital- only try and save younger adults.

I align with those posters who have said that it shouldn't be a competition between generations. The author is stirring the grievance pot unnecessarily. I also do think that there was any need for school closures or socialisation restrictions for the younger generation during Covid as their risks were so low and older people at risk were able to isolate away from them.

Some children/teenagers may have fared OK, as in the case of theworriedwell's GC. But it can't be denied that many babies/children/teenagers did not and were adversely impacted in many ways. Some may have been isolated at home with multiple siblings (not all with individual on line access or mobile phones) parents may have argued more (domestic and child abuse abuse was now hidden and Social workers could not monitor/support in child protection cases during lockdown), parents may not have been supportive and involved in home schooling efforts to the detriment of their Childs education, they may have had financial problems because unable to work as usual, no garden so no outside space to access and cool off from family all cooped up together in flats or small homes etc.

The comparative educational attainment data because of school attendance loss measured after Covid showed attainment decline across all ages- specifically a greater loss for lower socio economic groups. This made it harder for those doing GCSEs and A levels after Covid, eg summer 2022 harder because of playing catch up with course work curriculum for many. A level and GCSE grades in England surged during 2020 and 2021 due to teacher assessed grades. This was followed by a reduction by 2023-2024 with moderated examinations have finally caught up to close to 2019 pre Covid standards. This catch up transition to pre pandemic levels was quicker in England and Northern Ireland. Pandemic learning loss widened the gap in top regards between disadvantaged students and their peers and in some areas is still wider than in 2019. Plus there has been an increase in resits pst pandemic due to lower pass rates, particularly maths and English.

It also can't be ignored that Covid had an adverse effect on MH for many children/ teenagers that has lead to increasingly long waiting lists for CAMH services. Health Visitors were not able to conduct developmental home visit checks as usual, leading to a back log and some early warning signs missed (e.g. failure to thrive, hearing loss) that lead to delays in diagnosis and necessary care. Post natal mothers were more isolated and without usual support bonding and attachment may have been delayed/more difficult/ adversely impacted. Toddlers were not able to attend nursery/toddler/mother and baby groups as usual so did not have the usual social interactions. Early years Teachers reported that 3-4 years were entering school post pandemic less prepared and socialised than pre pandemic.

So as a member of the older generation I thank the younger generation and recognise the adverse impact Covid restrictions had for many.

I seem to one of the few that came out of lockdown better than I went in!! During the time I was furloughed, I learned to relax, take time for me, decide that my marriage was damaging my health so got out, enjoyed the hour long walks with my dog with only the noise of birds and insects around me. I learned that work did not define me, that being in a long term abusive marriage was no longer acceptable and that I needed to put myself first. 5 years on I'm retired, divorced and actually "living". I think we all sacrificed something during covid but my now AC and my GC are no the worse for it. I do feel though that this government would like to see all pensioners "disappear" and are doing their best with taxes and lack of care for the elderly to make that happen. For some covid and lockdown was bad for others it was a positive I that it made then re evaluate their lives and change. Any major event affects different people in different ways, young or old, it's how it is. Im just glad to be alive and trying to make the most of whatever time I have left.

I think we should stop all the divisive stuff now! I want to thank all the people of all ages who kept the shops open and the mail delivered,everyone who looked after us.As a 70+ cleaner I worked through all after the first lockdown when the office reopened for those who struggled to work from home. Many have not gone back,full time at least. Many prefer to work from home,it's an accepted practice now.
I don't think we should ever lockdown again but I think the government and advisors were in new,frightening territory...I think a lot of people have very short memories,the death toll was terrifying!
I wore a face covering for 2 years, and still do if I have a cold. The least I can do.
Time to move on and stop blaming the old people, we couldn't help when we were born.

keepingquiet

I think young people suffered far more during Covid and trust me I lost someone and my family had a truly harrowing time.

However, leaving my students who were sent home at a moments notice and told not to come back just weeks before their GCSEs was the worst day of my professional career.

They didn't just miss their education, they lost contact with friends and family, couldn't go to their clubs or after school activities etc.

Very young children didn't see people's faces, only masks. They were not cuddled, given treats or had birthday parties.

The long term effects of this are still being felt in my own grandchildren so no I don't think my life is worth more than theirs. It should not be a lottery. All lives are important and if only the government at the time had realised this!

Well said 👏👏👏👏👏
I must add to your post that thousands of babies didn’t build up an immune system.

Emeraldforest: "I think we should stop all the divisive stuff now!"

I absolutely agree with you.

Tooyoungtobeagrandma- living proof there is a silver lining in every cloud. Delighted to hear of your positive outcome.

I feel it's unfair to blame older people for what the younger endured during Covid. Older people did not chose this approach. It was mandated by the government. As in fact were most of the issues raised. It was not a choice so why should there be blame?
The blame aspect is, I believe, also a government tactic to cause intergenerational strife - or Divide and Rule!
The article didn't, I think, mention AI and what that will do to destroy lowskilled jobs which has been the traditional first step for many people in the past.
When I was 20 - 47 years ago, when there were jobs, you had typists and secretaries for example. These jobs are long gone.

I do wish history was well taught in schools. Great shame it's not.

The thing is though, that most adults had options during covid to re set their lives, to wfh, to shield if they were old or vulnerable. Children had no such choices, they were deprived of friendships, and deprived of the best education.
There were older people on here being ghastly almost saying that children should be locked away for being germ spreaders and because teenagers' body odour stank and contained germy microbes. I'll never forget the divisive attitude towards our youngest generation.