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(361 Posts)
GagaJo Mon 13-Apr-20 09:17:55

We need to be angry. We need to hold the government to account.

Yes, many of the populace are not abiding by the very lax lockdown. BUT the government should have abided by the WHO advice to TEST, TEST, TEST. By not doing that, they will have cost tens of thousands of British deaths. Our family members, our friends, our colleagues.

When this is over / slowing down, they need to be held accountable. We had THREE months notice. We watched Italy and Spain. And yet, they did nothing.

Mamissimo Mon 13-Apr-20 09:29:54

Anger is the last thing we need when this is over! What we really need is the courage to face our problems and take stock so that we can learn from this.

We need to make sure that the NHS is never underfunded or poorly managed again....
That social care for the elderly and vulnerable is high quality and properly funded
That the homeless still have somewhere to sleep
That we keep our air cleaner

What we don’t need is to waste our energy in being angry and keeping the blame culture going. It’s time for the country to grow up and work together to build the services we want and need - and pay for them!

timetogo2016 Mon 13-Apr-20 09:33:35

It`s pointless getting angry GagaJo.
It wont make ajot of difference and we need to start looking forward not back.
The only good thing to come out of this is the NHS willbe well funded in the future.

Blinko Mon 13-Apr-20 09:33:59

I think the time will come when they will be held to account, for all the reasons cited. But right now is probably not the time. It is surely what to expect when HMG is more concerned for the money-go-round than for human life.

GagaJo Mon 13-Apr-20 09:45:31

The ONLY way they'll be held to account is if the population is angry. It's the only way we can galvanise real change.

They also need to be FORCED into doing the right things now to avoid even more needless deaths. Not selling contracts to mates, rather than going with the rest of the EU. FORCED into accepting the WHO's advice.

And frankly, not standing up and LYING on camera. This is not the time for political lies. It also isn't the time to manipulate the media into shifting the blame onto the population.

But as for hauling them over the coals, yes, I agree. When it's over. But we can't lie down and play dead then. They AREN'T the good guys who've lead us through this. They are the bad guys who have murdered British people through their ineptitude and refusal to accept guidance from experts.

jaylucy Mon 13-Apr-20 09:49:34

I have it under good authority , from someone that is currently involved with the research on test kits that the reason people were not originally tested en mass is because the tests that were available were giving unreliable and inconsistent results on the people that had been tested.
My feeling is that this virus has been around for longer than anybody realised and it has mutated to what it is now. If you think it is worth getting angry over something that not even scientists worldwide could have guessed at, go right ahead.
It's a fact that a lot of the PPE is manufactured in China that has been in lock down for several months - production in some areas is beginning but the problem is that many people had returned to their home cities before the Chinese New Year and had to stay there. Actual factories were allowed to open a couple of weeks ago but they didn't have the workforce to go into full production until about now.
My ex husband lives and works in China in textiles so has told me this.
What I do think is amazing is that the number of companies that are completely out of the health sector stepping up to produce what is needed - may this carry on in the future so that the UK can be more self sufficient in the future.

Iam64 Mon 13-Apr-20 09:56:24

It's my belief that people are dealing with a whole range of emotions just getting through this pandemic and all that goes with it.
I won't defend the last nine years of ridiculous and unnecessary austerity. The contribution of that to the current difficulties is becoming clear to many, who previously denied that slashing the NHS and all our other public services would not devastate our ability to care for our people.

I don't see the point in winding the population up into righteous anger. Round here, many people out on their state approved walk are chatting from the appropriate distance. I'm meeting people I didn't know before, no one expressing anger, all acknowledging this is unprecedented. Most express the view we should have locked down earlier, hoping the Conservative move to privatise our NHS will be knocked on the head because of its central role in this crisis. I'm so relieved to be meeting people who aren't angry. Who are reflective and wanting to support neighbours and people in need.
Righteous anger is occasionally needed. Raging anger is never helpful.

quizqueen Mon 13-Apr-20 09:57:17

My anger is saved for the Chinese government. How can you test without the testing equipment, especially when it is unreliable.

Manmar2 Mon 13-Apr-20 09:57:34

Good post jaylucy- agree.

Septimia Mon 13-Apr-20 10:00:50

It really wouldn't have made any difference which government was in charge or what they did. SOMEONE would have found things to criticise and that situation is not helped by the journalists who asked stupid questions in order to advance their own careers.

Of course it would have been better if we, and other countries, had been better prepared. However, as jaylucy says, it is amazing the way that companies and individuals are stepping up to help.

And of course there should be a proper enquiry, when the situation returns to more or less normal, to see whether things were done right and to ensure that we're better prepared in future. But at the moment getting angry isn't going to solve anything. Asking appropriate questions and making alternative suggestions is probably much more productive. As well as abiding by the rules, of course.

Septimia Mon 13-Apr-20 10:01:52

* journalists who ask, not asked.

craftyone Mon 13-Apr-20 10:09:11

The virus has been kept under wraps in china for a long time. They are who you should be angry with gagajo

Our government are doing a sterling job. My relation, running a research lab also re-iterates about defective testing kits giving incorrect results

Anger does no-one any good. Change it to being helpful, my sister is helpfully organising in her community, looking after people and delegating to those who would like to help but are a bit reticent. It is the easiest thing in the world to rant and rave whilst sitting on one`s backside doing bugger all for the community as a whole

GrannyLaine Mon 13-Apr-20 10:10:59

How is anger remotely helpful in this particular situation?
All over the world, there will be lessons learned about how best to cope with a pandemic on this scale. Our government and its advisers have said as much on a regular basis.
We do the best we can with what we know at the time: when we know better, we do better.
In my view, a better approach on a personal level is to use kindness to help those who are struggling in these unprecedented times and to look for the positives in this strange bubble we are living in.

GrannyLaine Mon 13-Apr-20 10:13:48

craftyone your last sentence is spot on. I couldn't agree more.

eazybee Mon 13-Apr-20 10:15:42

Thank you Jaylucy for your COMMON SENSE post, and also yours, craftyone.

Whitewavemark2 Mon 13-Apr-20 10:18:20

Anger is a rational response when you consider the absolute pigs ear the government made in the decision making process over the past 3-4 months.

The government will be held to account at the appropriate time.

Meanwhile save your energy for your own mental and physical health.

Galaxy Mon 13-Apr-20 10:20:28

It is the easiest thing in the world to just sit back and not challenge the status quo.

MaizieD Mon 13-Apr-20 10:25:03

And of course there should be a proper enquiry, when the situation returns to more or less normal, to see whether things were done right and to ensure that we're better prepared in future.

Statements like this make me close to despairing.

There was a simulation exercise in 2016/17. It was called Operation Cygnus. The conclusion was that the NHS would fail catastrophically. The tories decided to do nothing to implement the report's recommendations on the grounds that it wouldn't be 'cost effective'. The report was suppressed.

What is the guarantee that an enquiry 'when this is over' wouldn't have exactly the same result?

I'm with GagaJo on the 'anger' issue. Some people have to keep this issue alive. It's my experience of life that if extremists push for something you get a result, even if it's more moderate than the the extremists would like it to be. No extremists, poorer chance of getting anything at all done...

No, you don't have to spend 24 hours a day seething with rage, of course that's futile and damaging. But the appallingness of events as they unfold shouldn't fail to get an emotional response.

Iam64 Mon 13-Apr-20 10:25:15

Whitewave - yes, don't waste energy on anger is the point I didn't make very well.
We all have enough feelings to manage in this difficult time, getting angry will change absolutely nothing.
We have increased our monthly subscription to the local charity supporting homeless and people in need in our town. We are avoiding supermarkets so no longer leaving food etc in the charity boxes so they're getting cash instead.

Shelmiss Mon 13-Apr-20 10:25:58

I think the government are doing a fantastic job. I think that this virus would have challenged any government, Tory, Labour etc.

As others have said, how the country is rallying round is amazing. It’s horrendous what is happening out there. I know of quite a few close friends who have lost loved ones in the past couple of weeks from the virus.

But all of them support the government and the sterling job it’s been doing.

gillybob Mon 13-Apr-20 10:27:55

I agree with craftyone it is not our government we should be getting angry with and I agree that this has been around far longer than we are being lead to believe .

As it stands I don’t have any anger to use on anyone right now. Just sadness .

25Avalon Mon 13-Apr-20 10:30:40

If anger makes you feel better and helps you get through this fine. I agree there has to be a reckoning at the end of this crisis but not in anger. There will have been mistakes made in China as well as here but these are unprecedented events that need to be looked at in a rational manner so that we can learn from this experience and hopefully avoid a recurrence in the future. Some of the scientific advice has been flawed and the media have sensationalised everything. When this is over let us look at things calmly and examine what happened. We will be judged by history in any case.

GagaJo Mon 13-Apr-20 10:30:44

A 'sterling' or 'fantastic' job????? With that death toll?

We are doing the WORST job in Europe! Only bested by the UK and that is down to having a lunatic for a leader. I don't think our leaders are lunatics. But they are totally inept.

I agree, a challenging situation for any (and every world) government regardless of political affiliation. But ours are doing 2nd worst.

GagaJo Mon 13-Apr-20 10:32:18

Apologies, that should read only bested by the US (gramatically, a VERY poor sentence).

Pikachu Mon 13-Apr-20 10:34:31

Of course it hasn’t bern around ‘far longer’ than 5 months. This piece of misinformation is currently doing the rounds on FB and other social media. Believe me if you have a background in sciences and understand how viruses spread this simply cannot be true.

What is true is that some common colds are actually a form of Coronavirus which is where this rumour came from. But this is a virus - one which hasn’t been seen before.