I predict another rise of covid

Perhaps some would welcome a police or a military state.

People need to have a collective social responsibility; perhaps some think the tanks and guns should be brought out to 'disappear' those who break the rules.

Poorer areas are, of course, more densely populated too, MayBee

Callistemon I don't believe the figures from the UK either.

Yes Callistemon I do think we need something like a war footing.

Is Cumbria densely populated?

I think we need far more antibody testing plus research into how resistant someone can be to catching the virus a second time.

Germany now has another rise in infections since easing lockdown only last Wednesday !
It only takes ONE person to cause an outbreak.

I am worried about what is happening in Australia because lockdown is practically over in some states.

"Avoid hugging" was the message.

The top twenty mostly densely populated English boroughs are all in London. The next two non-London boroughs are Southampton and Portsmouth, both of which have an about average death rate.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_districts_by_population_density

Out of 317 English boroughs, in terms of population density, Middlesbrough is ranked 72, South Tyneside 82, Sunderland 93 and Gateshead 116.

They're all above average, but nowhere near the top four.

I’m not seeing much social responsibility. People spitting at policemen: fly tipping: any excuse anyone can think of for not wearing a mask in public. Hospitals vandalised: black markets in some items. It doesn’t take much for society to break down.

Angela Merkel always warned of a rise in cases if lockdown were lifted. I have no doubt there will be a reversal.

Does anyone really believe the figures from some other countries, eg those from India?

Do you realise how very insulting that statement is, Callistomen?

Why would other country's figures be suspect? Because they're foreign and we all know that all foreigners cannot be trusted an inch?

Our figures can't be trusted either, you know. Virtually abandoning testing early on has meant that we'll never know how many people went undiagnosed and died at home from Covid. Nor will we ever know how many of the huge number of Care Home deaths are due to Covid.

What we do know is that, when comparing our numbers of deaths each week with the average for that week over the past 5 years (so yes, it includes seasonal flu deaths) the figures published by the ONS show that in week ending 24th April we had reached a cumulative total of 38,482 excess deaths this year in England and Wales alone. The addition of Scotland and NI's numbers brought it to over 40,000. There are two more weeks to go on there now. With excess deaths running at some 10,000 a week in England & Wales, that seems to take us to over 50,000 by now...

The chart WWmk2 has posted shows the number of excess deaths in various countries. The one I saw this morning (from the Financial Times) showed our percentage of excess deaths as being 61% above 'normal'. No other country has higher.

Now, you can go on believing that all those dreadful foreigners are fiddling their figures and we're not. I prefer to have a wee bit more faith in the integrity of most foreign governments...

I am worried about what is happening in Australia because lockdown is practically over in some states.

Locking down too early is pointless.
If you lockdown before there is ANY CV19 in your region you just reset to the beginning when you reopen and you have it all ahead of you.

Some regions of Oz werent flattening a curve. There was no curve. They were just delaying the START of their curve.

And now theyre at the start of their winter waiting for it all to start as they havent really had it yet

Arguably it would have been better to wait until it was there and then manage it as then it would have been there in summer not winter

It's very interesting about blood grouping in different countries.
Those countries with a higher population of blood group O+ have had fewer deaths.
Bolivia.
Ecuador.
Chile.
Colombia.
Mexico.

We are a richer country than those named yet deaths have remained one of the highest ?
We have less than half the population with blood group O+ !

Re those North Eastern boroughs, growstuff I think a common factor is poverty. Note that Newcastle, with its possibly more middle class population (University) isn't there.

For anyone interested the ONS has an interactive map that you can zoom in on to get figures for postcode areas from beginning of March to 17th April. Scroll down to section 4 for the map

www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/bulletins/deathsinvolvingcovid19bylocalareasanddeprivation/deathsoccurringbetween1marchand17april

In countries like columbia many poor have no access to healthcare and wouldnt be counted...

Re those North Eastern boroughs, growstuff I think a common factor is poverty. Note that Newcastle, with its possibly more middle class population (University) isn't there.

Yet poverty stricken white areas like around kent and essex and devon etc arent too bad.

Being BAME has proved the biggest risk factor yet the shielding list has not been rearranged to account for this. So now we have white people shielding who are lower risk than BAME front line workers!

The north west has very established BAME communitites and they are worst hit.

I’ve just read that the laboratories testing the (ahem) 100,000 UK tests (now there’s a figure not to be trusted perhaps) are taking resources from NHS testing laboratories. And I didn’t realise they were privately run. Staff in the NHS laboratories are very stressed and overworked because of it.

Something to do with the overall make-up of the blood ? Obviously.

Blood is usually an indicator of what illness/ disease that person will be prone to in later life.

Honduras was free until an infected person from Europe landed there in March.

Nothing to do with poverty.

Perhaps some would like to follow Putin’s methods. Three of their experts have mysteriously “fallen” out of windows in recent weeks.

If people are dumb enough to think the guidelines don’t apply to them do you seriously think they would have blindly followed anyone else, even if labour could stop their party imploding. You can’t cure stupid!

My only quibble is the amount of the initial fine. Probably less than most people spend on a night out. Perhaps a percentage of annual income and payment rigorously and immediately enforced regardless of status? Prison or working in Covid related settings might make the idiots think twice if they try to avoid paying up.

Around Easter I posted that we passed three large groups of Asian men celebrating on their driveways. This area is heavily populated with Hindus who live in decent high value housing but if only a small number were incubating Covid, the spread would be intense, especially as many have elderly relatives in the same household.

Internationally there has been widespread manipulation of the statistics and, without honest evaluation, it’s impossible to reach logical and agreed systems for the future.

I'm worried about Australia too as my D is A neg. and there aren't many of those groups.
Also GD there has mild Thalassemia so has to watch herself.

MaizieD Now, you can go on believing that all those dreadful foreigners are fiddling their figures and we're not. I prefer to have a wee bit more faith in the integrity of most foreign governments...

Unbelievable - you would prefer to have more faith in the integrity of foreign governments like China, India et al, but not your own? Have you read recent headlines? China covered up the outbreak of the virus! Words fail me.

ridiculous post, MaizieD.

You don't believe the figure of a relatively small country like the UK so why should uou believe the figures from a huge country with a widespread population where people left the cities on crowded buses and went back to remote villages?

Have you ever been to India?
Have you ever lived there?

I think one of the major scandals in the management of this virus is the way it has/is tearing through Care Homes.

Did I hear Hancock say the other day that care homes had been a top priority from the start?

If so why weren't the residents in these homes monitored, protected, staff and residents tested, PPE kit supplied and so on? Did someone decide from the outset that they were "collateral damage"?

What an indictment of a rich and civilised country that we didn't protect the most vulnerable, and the full death toll may never be known, but individual families know.