So what would GransNetters do?

Think we were the only country that backed down. No leadership at all.

Nope. Canada, I know for a fact. I think France and Switzerland too.

The flood gates didn't matter at all. It was here before we put all those countries on the red list.

Mollygo

3 households. I’ve mentioned this before. If I invite 2 (immediate family) households, to ours, there would be 8 adults with one retired and the others all working in various contexts (not from home) including teaching and hospitality, 1 student fresh from Uni, and 2 children. 3 households isn’t any more sensible, no matter how good it sounds.

I think what everybody is failing to work out is that the restrictions aren't trying to keep you "safe". They aren't trying to make the chance of you catching Covid zero. They're trying to reduce probabilities.

If there are eight people in your house, the chances are reduced compared to if there are 30 people in your house. And especially compared to going to a concert with 1,000 people. That's it.

Mollygo Lateral flow tests are there for circumstances like those you describe.

Apparently when considering lockdown this can mean drinks and cheese for 19 from different households without social distancing.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/dec/19/boris-johnson-and-staff-pictured-with-wine-in-downing-street-garden-in-may-2020?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other

Whilst this was happening schools, pubs and restaurants were closed and that day Matt Hancock, then health secretary, had gave a press conference urging people to stick to the rules and not take advantage of the good weather over the May weekend to socialise in groups.

Good grief.

No to a full lockdown but yes to the restrictions mentioned above. People are already taking personal responsibility by cancelling meals out etc. We must do what we have to to protect ourselves and our families. We have the vaccine and now the testing kits and should use them.
As for those who flout Covid guidelines (I am looking at you Number 10) I am hoping that the ire of our collective consciousness will eventually pierce their numb skulls

I would bring in vaccine passports ASAP and make them mandatory for pubs, restaurants, cinemas, , etc. This would surely help the beleaguered hospitality industry - people will be more likely to use such venues if they feel reasonably safe.

People who refuse the vaccine are entitled to do so but would have to accept that certain things will not be denied to them.

I would like to see much stricter enforcement of mask wearing - or perhaps I should say any enforcement - I have yet to see any at all. And people who are genuinely exempt should have to produce something official to confirm it. At the moment anyone can say they’re exempt whether they are or not.

Mollygo

3 households. I’ve mentioned this before. If I invite 2 (immediate family) households, to ours, there would be 8 adults with one retired and the others all working in various contexts (not from home) including teaching and hospitality, 1 student fresh from Uni, and 2 children. 3 households isn’t any more sensible, no matter how good it sounds.

Mollygo our planned Christmas get-together is also three households: six adults, one 5 year old and one 7 month old. Lunch is booked at the local pub restaurant.

Even if all this is still "allowed" by then, it's not compulsory and if we as individuals aren't comfortable with it we can always impose our own restrictions.
I've opted out of two social meetings recently as they were with people I didn't need or particularly want to see.
I hope you can reach a decision you're all happy with! ?

Thanks to all who have mentioned that it’s my choice and LF tests are available.
I’m just pointing out that 3 households sounds good, but could involve a lot of people from different locations, jobs and contacts.
I’ve opted for my own restrictions and we will be a much smaller number, but everyone opting for their own restrictions is partly responsible for the spread.

We are only responsible for the spread if we are actually infected you can't spread what you don't have

A hospital consultant said in an interview on R4 this morning that 80-90% of those in hospital with COVID were unvaccinated. With vaccination rates rising fast, over 80% of the population having had at least 1 vaccination and over 50% 3, most COVID cases are coming from a small proportion of the population who are not vaccinated.

The best guide to what to do over Christmas socialising is not to go into any place, or meet with anyone who is unvaccinated. Everyone I am seeing over Christmas is triple vaccinated, or in the case of the children has had COVID in the last 2 months.

It’s been proven that many people are asymptomatic Rosie, and you can also spread covid if you’re incubating it and the symptoms have yet to show.

Good to hear reliable information MOnica. When you consider the size of the UK population that percentage represents a lot of people.

M0nica

A hospital consultant said in an interview on R4 this morning that 80-90% of those in hospital with COVID were unvaccinated. With vaccination rates rising fast, over 80% of the population having had at least 1 vaccination and over 50% 3, most COVID cases are coming from a small proportion of the population who are not vaccinated.

The best guide to what to do over Christmas socialising is not to go into any place, or meet with anyone who is unvaccinated. Everyone I am seeing over Christmas is triple vaccinated, or in the case of the children has had COVID in the last 2 months.

Like I said, believe what you like.

But fewer than 50% of the population have had the third dose.

But yes, believe whatever you like, including any other stats that you think fit the narrative.

Germanshepherdsmum

It’s been proven that many people are asymptomatic Rosie, and you can also spread covid if you’re incubating it and the symptoms have yet to show.

If you are asymptomatic a lft should pick this up that's what they are for
If you have symptoms it's a PCR

No.

But Rosie does everyone always test before going everywhere, hairdressers for instance? And we know that the lft is by no means infallible even if you can get hold of one.

I don't think lockdown is necessary yet, BUT making mask wearing in public indoor places, limiting households/numbers getting together and social distancing mandatory would make a difference. On the passport question, I feel that it would be fairer to have proof of either vaccination or a negative test for entry to indoor events and venues. The big elephant in the room, though, is how do you prove that a LF test has been done, let alone that it was negative? I do them whenever I am meeting people, but only I see the result and can report whatever I like; ergo so can everyone else!

Germanshepherdsmum

But Rosie does everyone always test before going everywhere, hairdressers for instance? And we know that the lft is by no means infallible even if you can get hold of one.

Can only speak for myself I test before going out You can get them from NHS website just have to try a few times
Several places in our town have them just takes a bit of effort to find them

I was lucky to get a supply from the NHS website just before they ran out. Unfortunately living in the sticks we only have one pharmacy within miles so little opportunity for people round here to get supplies, same in many rural areas.

No. I would be working on getting the unvaccinated sorted out. I heard an ICU consultant saying that the majority of his inpatients are unvaccinated. What puzzles him is that if they contact Covid they are bombarded with a cocktail of drugs, all with side effects. Makes zero sense to me.

Where I live test kits are available in pharmacies, libraries, community centres and the shopping mall. You just have to go and collect them. If one place has run out, try another. It’s the same with the website. Try again later. But I am teaching my granny to suck eggs surely.
Some people won’t bother to test but if I do and stick to people and places that I trust then I can’t think of anything else to keep myself safe. I do not want another full lockdown.

Germanshepherdsmum

I was lucky to get a supply from the NHS website just before they ran out. Unfortunately living in the sticks we only have one pharmacy within miles so little opportunity for people round here to get supplies, same in many rural areas.

Suggest keep trying on NHS website I just tried and they are available

I agree with Sarnia (I heard the same interview.) It is the unvaccinated that are causing all the overload in hospitals. Sanction them, and leave us to get on with our lives.

Sarnia

No. I would be working on getting the unvaccinated sorted out. I heard an ICU consultant saying that the majority of his inpatients are unvaccinated. What puzzles him is that if they contact Covid they are bombarded with a cocktail of drugs, all with side effects. Makes zero sense to me.

Can anyone explain to me whether these unvaccinated covid patients in ICU actually came in with covid or whether they picked it up while in hospital for something else? Surely a fair percentage must have come there from other wards where transmissions are rampant? In that case do they not need to be kept apart from the very start of entry?

No.