Child arrangement court order

Yes some people defy courts... and break laws.... and dont follow rules...

... doesnt mean that the above doesnt bind ordinary people who arent brave or careless or intoxicated etc enough to do so!

I wouldn't say ordinary people I'd say decent people, and when it comes to issues of contact with children decent people don't need court orders to tell them how to behave, they know how to behave and do so instinctively.

Oh my goodness, there is a lot of talking in circles going on here, and a lot of twisting of words.

I don't see any word twisting.

and when it comes to issues of contact with children decent people don't need court orders to tell them how to behave, they know how to behave and do so instinctively.

Right well a minute ago you were saying that people WITH a court order would chat amicably and sensibly about when to rearrange or ignore a court order... so why do they have/need one in the first place?

This is getting silly! I was simply replying to the idea that a visitation court order at Christmas time is a suggestion that parents may be unfit, and its not! Court orders are not about that. There are instances where a court order would fall at unsuitable times, and the parent does risk penalties if they dont oblige.

Whether or not courts have the CAPACITY to enforce court orders
Or whether or not some people flout court orders, is really not the point.

Smileless, forgive me but you are making me feel very uncomfortable the way you jump on everything I say.

Can we just please all talk without ECs being treated like we are here to make trouble.

Lost we clearly hate all grannies just because we do not think that court orders = a happy ending!

It was you who made that point notanan by saying that people cannot make alterations to court orders.

It is not my intention to make you feel uncomfortable LostChild but I must say that I feel the same way. Perhaps we are both misconstruing the others intentions.

I wasn't aware that the conversation on this thread was making EC feel that they are here to make trouble but I do feel that is how some EGP's are made to feel.

I don't think "court orders = a happy ending" either which is why we didn't go to court but I respect the right of GP's who do go to court to do so.

It was you who made that point notanan by saying that people cannot make alterations to court orders

Even in your example, they are not making an "alteration" to it they are both agreeing to ignore it and the courts do not spy on everyone so...

Where there is a dominant and submissive party to a court order it is totally different to swapping a 50:50 arrangement. And the submissive party to the order are at risk if they dont present the child to court ordered hand over.

Yes, I say I am hurt by your behaviour but, somehow it is me that is the problem.

Younger generation talking about protecting children from damaging legal processes, the reactions of their own parents if it's the parents who are abusive and pointing out that GP should consider that, but somehow that is anti GP instead of pro children.

Of course they're making an alteration. If both parties agree to change the court order they are agreeing to altering it.

I respect the right of GP's who do go to court to do so.
Then why not respect that,while you don’t agree with /think their reasons are valid or based in reality, that people have the right to end relationships with “family”.

Of course they're making an alteration. If both parties agree to change the court order they are agreeing to altering it.

The court order still exists unless the court says otherwise. It is unaltered. The only way to alter the actual order is to go back to court

They are agreeing to ignore it. Which they can fairly confidently do as they are 50:50 so why is going to dob themselves in????

sigh

"who" not why

Who said you were the problem LostChild? I didn't. You expressed your reaction to my posts and I have expressed my reaction to yours.

It is anti GP's when GP's who choose to use the courts to maintain their relationship are accused of doing so for their own selfish reasons. Even making memory boxes has been derided on this thread for goodness sake.

I said that if adult GC contact an EP it should be an opportunity for the GP and thd AGC to get to know each other

Not used as a chance to demonstrate how much they fought the parents!

Going to court to show you fought is not a positive message either way.

EP EGP

Of course they have the right to end their relationships with family Summerlove but not necessarily the right to end their children's relationship with their GP's.

I didn't say the court order doesn't still exist notanan, the court order remains it is the agreeing parties who make the alterations. It was you who said alterations couldn't be made.

But look, we can agree on something sigh.

Ok. Some people ignore what a court has ordered.... some people are not risk adverse! (Not that there is risk to anyone in your non comparable example of JOINT resident parents, not a court order upon a resident parent for visitation with someone who is not!)

Still does not mean that if visitation occurs at Christmas time it means the court thought the parents are dodgy.. that is not what that process asesses

I never said it did, you're confusing me with another poster sigh

I know you didnt but the Christmas statement was what started this line of....... "conversation"???

I've been avoiding you Smileless, because you make me uncomfortable, but OK.

Oh the post made this afternoon at 4.30. Muddies the waters a bit to bring it into our 'conversation' when I haven't mentioned it don't you think.

I dont think anyone cares any more smileless was just trying to bring it back to the topic being discussed and away from semantics...