Child arrangement court order

And a reason to deny children their GP's!!!

I feel for the OP. This thread has turned into a whole gamut of justification and horrendous stories of extreme cases of estrangement. The OP only wanted to know if anyone had been successful. I would suggest a Freedom of Information request to your local family court to find out. It's awful that so many posters have used this post to just bang their drum. Not all GP who have been estranged are entirely at fault for this.

Just for the record Unhappy1, I think you were very brave and I am so very sorry for the outcome. You cared enough to instigate proceedings, did what you thought was right and that pain is now added to the loss of your GC. This is so very sad. If you had the chance to begin the case,what would you do differently? Is there anything to learn or reflect on from your experience?

Smileless,

So your es told you what the problem (or part of it) is!
Why do you say you don't know why your es estranged you/he never told you?

It doesn't matter whether I think it is enough to estrange or not, your son and dil thought it was, together with maybe other issues in your relationship.

The issue here is that you do not acknowledge it as a problem, your es does.

Btw, you also sound very angry in your posts.

You cannot be denied anything if it never belonged to you or had rights to it in the first place

Gosh I find the idea of GPs wanting to tell children their side of the story horrifying. If the child's parents are abusive then they should rightfully be reported to the relevant authorities. If they aren't, whether a GP gets contact through court or connects to them in later life... Wanting to impart their side of the story again seems like a competition for the child's affection. As a teacher I have seen the damage this does to children first hand when their parents seperrate and one wants to get across their side. Personally I have told my younger child my mother was unkind to me. My older child saw enough for himself. Now if either of my children want a relationship with my mother I will never stand in their way. If however she wants to give her side, however she sees it I will not compete for them. I will simply explain that if they need to put me down or demean me to my own children, they are Not good people.

At the time he told me, they weren't married and we weren't estranged Hithere. The estrangement came 3 years later so no, he hasn't told us why we're estranged.

His wife regarding him as a mummy's boy was never given as a reason and the only problem he had with her comment at the time was that she said it and he was offended by it for himself and for me.

Really!! Of course you can be denied something "if it never belonged to you or had rights to it in the first place" but we're not talking about things, we're talking about human beings, not it's.

People, with feelings not property. Be careful Hithere you sound as if you regard your children as your possessions, to do with as you wish, well they're not and you shouldn't.

I don't sound angry, I am angry but not because our estrangement, because of the constant blaming of EP's and GP's by those who are themselves not estranged, one who isn't a GP and several who are themselves estranging AC.

I’m not estranged from my parents, or my inlaws, my children have great relationships with both sides.

I was estranged as a child from my favourite aunt, she was mad at my father, and refused to see me because of it. My parents kept trying to facilitate that relationship, and every time I was hurt by it. I wish they had stopped trying. When I did see her, she talked poorly about my parents.

So no, you don’t actually have me pegged.

I just happen to feel that extended family value is only a value if all parties want it.

I don't sound angry, I am angry but not because our estrangement, because of the constant blaming of EP's and GP's by those who are themselves not estranged, one who isn't a GP and several who are themselves estranging AC.

Are you reading a different thread? Or just blinded by your anger?

This isnt about who is to blame for estrangements.
It is about the damage court orders does to children.

And only the people who instigate court proceedings can be to blame for that

Parents and relatives (including GPs) who have had guardianship or fostered are justified in doing it, it still causes harm but that is balanced with the court order being about a member of the immediate family.

But to put a child through court orders for contact with extended family... that is not justifiable!

You dont have to be a GP to have seen the damage court orders do to children. Just ask any teacher or anyone who works with children.

No notanan I am not blinded by my anger I'm just fed up with the constant bashing that EP's and EGP's receive. I would be less angered if there was a degree of acknowledgement that the parents who deny their children their GP's, are just as responsible if the GP's decide to go to court by their actions, as GP's are if they decide to go down that path.

If these parents allowed some contact, there would be no need for GP's to go to court. So no, it is not only those who instigate court proceedings who are responsible. The parents are equally responsible for denying contact in the first place. So when you continuously go on and on about the damage done to children whose GP's go to court, remember it's the actions of their parents who are ultimately responsible.

I never thought I had you "pegged" *Summerlove" any more than you have me. Your aunt had the opportunity to pursue her relationship with you and chose not too. GP's who decide to go to court aren't given that opportunity which is why some choose to go to court.

Just to clarify - My point about there not being a level playing field between parents and GPs wasn't said in favor or against the situation, just stating what seems to be a fact. However, notanan, I get your point about children needing to have primary caregivers, and, most often, of course, those are the parents.

Kudos to you and yours, Paddyann!

Smile, I don't understand, you chose not Togo to court and no one is telling you off. You live your truth, don't put yourself in a box

There is certainly a degree of acknowledgement that some parents deny grandparents contact with their grandchildren for reasons that are not just.

However, it is unreasonable to expect a degree of acknowledgement that parents who deny grandparents contact with their grandchildren are responsible for any subsequent court orders those grandparents try to put in place.

Parents can deny anyone contact with their child (excluding the other parent) if they wish. That is their right as parents. Grandparents have no rights.

The courts recognise this - that is why there are so few cases where grandparents have actually been granted a contact order. The legislation exists to protect a child’s relationship with a grandparent with whom they have formed a primary attachment.

It seems that some posters cannot recognise (or accept) the fundamental right of parents being the ultimate decision makers when it comes to their own children.

No notanan I am not blinded by my anger I'm just fed up with the constant bashing that EP's and EGP's receive.

Stating the destructive impact of having their household taken to court

Of having life restricted by court orders

Of the horrible realities of court ordered contact (potentially including contact centres)

Is not EP/EGP bashing.

It is A: stating fact
And B: seeing court ordered contact from the child's perspective.

GPs are not forced to go to court.

They have a choice.

They can decide to accept that the parents have made a decision, and leave the parents and GC alone to pursue their own lives.

Or, they can choose to go to court to fight for their "rights".

At the end of the day, as your own situation has demonstrated, you have a choice.

GG65, not when it means they don’t get what they want.

My point about my aunt was more to illustrate the damage of a child having someone in their life who disagreed so strongly with the parents.

I had far more damage from my visits with her than I would have had, had my parents chosen not to push the relationship.

Her issue was with my parents, not me. The things she said about them, and how she treated them was terrible.

My parents encourage the relationship because they thought they were doing the right thing and making sure I knew my aunt and that she had access.

It was not the right thing

Joyfulnanna..thank u for ur support.
In answer to your question...if you can afford a solicitor get one...I couldn't so had to defend myself....be prepared...you are in a formal court room..alongside the parents...your brain turns to mush....get help from support unit attached to court...they will help you and also go into court with you so ur not alone...all forms have to be in triplicate....your first appearance I court is only for the magistrates to decide whether to give you permission to apply for access...so be prepared to go to court at least twice..I went four times as parents didn't turn up twice. There is a court fee I think "250...if you meet criteria you get help with this. If any GP are going to court I am happy to help ...be prepared for the long haul..mine took 9 mths ..please don't be put off by some of the comments against going to court...if it's right for you do it..if not then that's ok too.

And finally...thank you to notanan2..for your considerable contribution to this thread...I have read your endless comments...and totally
disregarded them..

Yes Razzamatazz I live my truth and I respect the right for others to live theirs.

No, it is not unreasonable GG. Actions have consequences and the consequence for some parents who take their children away from their GP's is that those GP's may choose to go to court.

With no one to represent you, you were courageous to go it alone Unhappy. Court was not the right thing for us but I respect your decision to do all that you could to maintain your relationship with your GC.

I'm sorry for you and for them that it didn't work out and I hope that one day you'll be able to tell them how hard you tried.

Unhappy your attitude is really in these few comments. I hope there is more to you because you come across really badly and like an extremely difficult person to get on with. I hope EPs will follow a different path to you.

Really off-putting.

Thankfully, I'm immune to the rancid process that some low-life put into the court system there. As I stated before, and my reason for commenting on this thread..

When you decide to assault your child in this manner, you have made yourself and enemy of the family for the rest of your life.

^Florida is aggressive in statutorily protecting the privacy rights of its citizens, and the courts have repeatedly interpreted requests for visitation from grandparents as assaults on parental privacy.

In 1980 a privacy amendment was added to Florida's constitution. It reads, "Every natural person has the right to be let alone and free from government intrusion into his private life except as otherwise provided herein." In the 1996 case of Beagle v. Beagle, the court decided that the state could not intervene to award grandparent visitation over the protests of parents in an intact family unless failing to award visitation would be detrimental to the child — the so-called "harm standard." The court held that this high standard was necessary to *keep the state from intruding on the private lives of its citizens.*^