Friendship, advice and support if estrangement has affected your life

'The devil is in the detail' as the saying goes and it's certainly worth thinking in advance how best to express yourself without the risk of escalating things even further.

Who'd of thought though that any of us would feel the need to do so when talking to our own child.

We're due to go home from our flat today having been here since Wednesday but I've woken up with stomach ache and having to keep dashing to the loo!!! It's not a long drive, only about 45 minutes but I think we'll have to set off later than we normally do, and hope my tum settles down.

No idea where it's come from, I didn't go out at all yesterday and Mr. S.'s is fine so it's not my cooking. Well that's my story and I'm sticking to it .

Smiles hope you feel better later to go home. But at least Mr S did a great job on the flat so if you need to stay a day or to more you will be nice and cosy there. There are a lot of different bugs doing the rounds at the moment especially one that leaves a cough which takes a long time to go. If memory serves me right you had a cough which took a while to go . My daughter is entering the 5th week of hers but at least it isn't constant and kept her awaking anymore.

I have a theory my be nuts but I think every now and then or body decides it needs a could clean out hence an upset tummy.

Get well soon..💐

@Smiles well I got some really good advice last night from @Madgran . I been practicing the words and my delivery of the words so I get it right .
Obviously when things get to my stage there’s bound to be something that I’ve not said quite right but it’s finding out . The only way is to be careful as you say . That’s very difficult when you can’t speak freely with your own child though.
Hope you feel well soon and yes there’s a tummy bug going round here too . I have a pain and thought it was from my meds Xx

@Smiles

We're back home Whiff and I'm feeling better but my tum still feels a bit off. Sorry you DD hasn't got rid of her cough, it's good it's no longer keeping her awake but still tiresome.

You could be right about our bodies deciding they need a clean out, and that supports my claim that it wasn't anything to do with my cooking .

It's a sad day isn't it when you're afraid to speak freely too and with your own child, especially if you always used to able too Ladys.

Hope the pain in your tum doesn't amount to anything.

@Smiles well I got some really good advice last night from @Madgran . I been practicing the words and my delivery of the words so I get it right

Good idea LadyS. Say it in a way that works for you but follow the principles of:

* making him feel heard
*demonstrating you are listening
*not engaging in the angst; engaging in listening
*using "I see"; "Oh!"; "I have heard you!" " Is that still the case?" "I understand what you have said"

There MIGHT be a scenario where repeating back helps as in :

"Just to check..my understanding is that you are saying you do not want me to ....! Have I got that right?" ..... followed by "Ok. Thankyou, I wanted to make sure I had understood tour wishes correctly!" 🌷

@Smiles yes once the trust has been broken it’s very hard isn’t it . There’s an element of needing to protect yourself from further hurt and the “ easy” relationship you once had just seems to disappear overnight . It’s hard to come to terms with .

I hope you get well soon- this tummy ache feels a bit like a bug . There’s so many things going around at the moment. I’m normally quite hardy !

@Madgran
Thanks again , these tips are really useful for me because I get all flustered and then he gets the better of me . Awful mind isn’t it when we have to practice a strategy to communicate with our AC ? But this is the situation.

Glad you are back home Smiles and hope you feel better today.

Just wrote a piece on I am a widow thread.

I woke at 4 crying after dreaming about zombies. I am 65 not a teenager. It's not as if my husband was one of the zombies.

Going out for the day as I don't want a repeat of Friday. It's not a day for thinking about what I have lost but what I had and how because of his loved I am who I am today. So getting the bus to the station and off to a village not to far away for a wander round and lunch then on the way back probably stop at another village I have wanted to go too. Just to see what it's like.

Hope my son remembers what day it is today and remembers it's 20 years . I know my daughter will remember. She's at work today. And asked me yesterday if I want to go out to a garden centre tomorrow and have lunch. Never turn down a garden centre or lunch. Be a toss up who gets the most food down them me or my 3 year old grandson. When I was at their home last week it was him. He's brothers 6 so not messy.

Went to sit fit yesterday. Had relaxation at the end . Had to sit with our eyes shut and our instructor counted down from 50 we had to inhale on the even numbers exhale on odd. One of our group fell asleep for a few minutes when we had finished so sat in silence until she woke with a start. Mind you we had a full work out before hand to the Beach boys.

Craft on Thursday but nothing planned for Friday. If my fabric arrives will make a bag to take my cross stitch when I go on holiday in May . Have the outer fabric just need the waterproof lining . We will have to wait and see.

Have a good day everyone.

💐Whiff. Enjoy your day out. Celebrate what you have now, how far you’ve come. what you have achieved. I don’t feel any differently now on Anniversaries as the loss is there all the time but I now remember the good times. I don’t doubt your son thinks about his father a lot as does your daughter.
When people, including our children feel threatened of a situation or trapped in one, they can lash out even at those they love. Sometimes it’s space they need to deal with what’s causing it. Words can be misinterpreted as none of us watch what we say all the time.

Have a lovely day Whiff x

Hope your tummy is better today Smiles

Good you're having a nice day out Whiff it will take your mind off things, but weather not good, very windy here and overcast.

Put all my bedding in early so I could get it on the line to dry but looks like I will be using the tumble dryer. I recently bought a washer-dryer but not happy with it, it creases everything up terribly. I didn't have room for separate appliances, and I know that would have been far better. Didn't need a dryer in my other house as had a spare room to hang the washing in bad weather, keeping windows open for air to circulate.

Allsorts good thing to remember the good times when you're feeling sad at your loss.

Ladysu You've been given some good advice and I'm sure that's the best way to go. Just stick to talking about pleasantries and just ask how DIL is doing with her pregnancy. Extremely difficult not to mention the baby, so again just keep it light and pleasant. I wish you luck xx

@yogi
Thank you . Yes I’ve had some very good advice and I’m trying my best practicing it ! Funny thing is I always ask how my DIL is , I’d love to see her and chat but she won’t . Can’t do any more . I won’t talk about the baby this week- if my son brings the subject up then I’ll use the approach suggested in here . It will be difficult because it’s human nature to want this relationship but I’m going to let it go for a week. Just see how it goes .

Good idea to take yourself out today Whiff, hopefully it will help to take your mind off things. You have tomorrow to look forward too as well. It's lovely that you get to spend so much time with your D and GC.

It's virtually impossible to watch everything you say isn't it Allsorts. It's the nature of relationships for there to be times of friction, and when that relationship is important to you allowances need to be made and conversations had, to prevent avoidable escalation and unpleasantness.

Tummy seems to have settled thanks Yogin. Didn't have my singing lesson this morning as she had to cancel but choir tonight.

I've never wanted a washer/dryer because if they're separate you can be drying while doing another wash. Never tumble dry bedding but put on airers to dry to avoid too much creasing.

Good suggestions from Madgran Ladysu. It wont be easy not mentioning the baby in terms of everything being OK because it's only natural to do so. Just as your reaction to suddenly being told there may be a problem last August, when you didn't even know she was pregnant was IMO understandable.

I can understand not telling anyone in the early stages in case something goes wrong, but I've never understood why in some cases the expectant mother's family is told, but the expectant father's isn't.

We were at my aunt's second wedding when I was convinced I was pregnant with DS. They all laughed at me because at that point I hadn't even missed my period, but I was right and so excited told anyone who would listen .

@Smiles oh what you say is so true . Why can’t allowances be made within families at difficult stressful times . I have desperately tried to explain to my son and his wife when she’s listened in to our calls , the important of forgiveness. Not just so it benefits me, but so it heals our relationship. Why throw away over 30 years of love for the sake of an incident of unpleasantness. I’m not getting anywhere at all . I’m afraid to keep pushing and I need to hold back , but it’s important that we all understand the mental and physical impact this is having in all of us . I’d give anything to hear my son’s voice on the phone just saying hi mum . I’d be overjoyed to hear his wife saying hi there , let’s talk but they won’t . Stubbornness is so overrated . You are right . It’s so difficult not mentioning the baby within the context of what’s going on here . A child is a gift , a joy , but not a possession. To see my son as a father fills me with so much pride it’s untrue , however it’s unlikely I will actually get this experience. I know my DIL will be a loving mum , again seeing this would undoubtedly reduce me to tears . These days , however, my tears are not joy they are misery and I can’t do anything about it . We all share such awfulness in here dont we

I've just sent you a couple of pm's Ladysu .

It seems that what's known as a 'throw away society' has in some cases been taken to the extreme to include parents.

@Allsorts .
After a lot of self reflection, I realise that last week I was incredibly unkind to you and I would dearly like to offer you the Olive Branch of Friendship. Please would you consider accepting this ? I let myself down by saying unkind things to you which were most certainly not deserved- you were trying to advise me .
I hope you will accept this unconditional apology together with assurance that my behaviour at that time was out of character and rather extreme. Please take care. [flowers]

@Smiles.

I accept your apology Ladysuisee. Thank you. Perhaps with time you will be part of their lives, for that's what we are. You don't know what's going on in his life, lots of people when stressed out, for that's how he seems, shout and say things they don't mean. A bit of space for him and his wife is probably all that is required, they are a couple with things they don't want to discuss, none of us told our parents everything, why would they, that doesn't mean they don't care.

@Allsorts thank you .
Yes I really hope that one day we’ll get back to where we were before. It’s really odd being excluded because they were happy to share when they were trying for this child ( I might have preferred not to know that bit !) . Well , when I was pregnant I did share the news straight away with the whole of my family then we rang my MIL . It was very different . As a family we talked about my now AS’s impending arrival , names , I even shared information about scans etc , which is why I’m finding this so difficult. It’s so different that’s all . I’m hoping a bit more space will do the trick I will just need to hope for this . It’s so sad to see my son change like this , when a much wanted - for child causes discord in the family . I can understand my DIL being fragile and I’ve given her plenty of space so we will have to see .

@Smiles yes I don’t like the way parents sre being chucked away like rubbish for being surplus to requirements. It doesn’t feel nice at all

Morning everyone.

That is odd Ladysu, so you knew they were trying for a baby but weren't told when she became pregnant . It's more usual to say you're trying unless you're having trouble conceiving and are looking for support.

It is sad to see such huge and unpleasant changes in your own child. The last time we saw our ES he was almost unrecognisable physically so much so, that when we saw him in the distance and I said to Mr. S. "doesn't he look awful", he asked me who I was talking about. He hadn't recognised him!!!

You do feel as if you've become "surplus to requirements" and if all those years of loving, caring and supporting them count for nothing.

Hope you had a good day yesterday Whiff and didn't tire yourself out. You're probably enjoying lunch at the garden centre with your D and GS as I'm typing this.

We only know what they tell us don't we Allsorts which is why if we've never been told why we've been estranged, we'll never know.

Choir was good last night, we have a few new members which is great especially for the bases and tenors. Getting rather top heavy with sopranos though and I'm not talking about our bust sizes .

That should have been 'it's more usual not to say .......'

Anyone else having a tough time right now?
I don’t know if it’s just the grey February weather but everything seems so much sadder today. Sending love to you all 💐