Friendship, advice and support if estrangement has affected your life

Love, (((hugs))) and for you Spring.

This time of the year does make everything seem harder doesn't it as spring still seems so far away.

These sadder times will pass and you know if you need to talk we are here to listen and give you what help we can.

Take care.

@Smiles yes I was quite taken aback to have a conversation with my DIL (!!) discussing the fact they had started trying for a baby . Now I certainly did not ask her first when they might start - can you imagine!! See this is how things were back then , I got on with her well enough to be told about the trying but you can understand why I was confused when I wasn’t told their activities had been successful! It’s quite funny when I put it like that . Actually my AS has changed physically recently. He looks more like his dad now especially when angry . His dad had a habit of just looking really harsh and mean sometimes which changed his features completely. Now my son has this going on . Sometimes when he’s being nasty , it shocks me how like his dad he’s become. This is because weirdly, he looks exactly like me . Very spooky - it’s like all the nastiness is there in his face on view. I think when faced with possible estrangement, it’s easy to think you’re the only one , especially as we’ve not been told why as @Allsorts has said . Coming on here makes me realise how commonplace this is . So much hurt being caused and so much cruel behaviour happening. Xxx

@Spring20 I’m sorry you are having a bad time . Unfortunately I feel low all the time at the moment, but my situation is unfolding so to speak . The horrible weather doesn’t affect me any more than the nice weather funnily enough . Sometimes it’s worse when the sun is shining and you feel absolutely dreadful.

Well I was taken aback when I read that you had been told you they were trying Ladysu, and yes that one example shows how the relationship has changed beyond all recognition. You were told they were trying, but not told when they'd succeeded.

So your son has changed physically too; it is odd isn't it. He was so handsome and like you've said, it's as if all the nastiness is there on his face.

Over the years I've found myself having some very strange conversations with others, strange not just because of what's being discussed but because something I found so odd was actually being experienced by someone else.

I don't think any of us had any idea how common this is until we came here and realised that only was it not just us, but others were also experiencing the same treatment and behaviour.

You think you're going mad don't you and it's such a relief when you realise that you're not.

@Smiles yes I thought it was quite funny at the time being told they were trying for a baby . I said something ridiculous I think like oh I hope it goes well then , ! I’d probably be accused of something like not validating their experience now ( lol ) as opposed to saying something ridiculous and getting away with it . I have to be ultra careful now about choosing my words so carefully as you know . I am fast becoming a highly anxious shadow of my former self . I will be glad when we get to the end of March simply to see if my son enforces the no contact with the baby rule , then at least I can make some decisions xxx

Just hang on in there, you can do it.

@Smiles thank you . Of course my hope is that things are resolved, or at least we agree that in future we will move forward rather than harbour grudges about past events. Who knows ? It would be nice to be part of this exciting time leading up to the birth but I suppose that would be far too much to expect.

Thanks for the kind comments - sometimes a virtual hug is really needed! Ladysu have been following your thread. Cannot offer much more than what the good folk here have already said, but a key is to reduce expectations. Is the only way to manage the disappointments/silence. I hope with all my heart things improve for you however.

Morning all.

I can't believe it is still raining here as it's been doing so for at least 24 hours so it's cold, wet and miserable for another day. It just makes it harder sometimes to keep your spirits up when the weather's so horrible, you don't want to go out and your dogs don't want to go out either.

Thankfully we have something to look forward too this evening. We're going to the theatre to see a John Godber play 'Do I love you'. We love his work and have seen several plays over the years but not for a long time.

TBH, I just love going to love productions and have been known to drag Mr. S. along to something we've never heard of, written by someone we've never heard of and one or two have been a bit odd.

The theatre's only a 10 minute walk from our house, so I'm hoping it's stopped raining so we wont have to mess around with wet coats and umbrellas when we get there.

We all need a virtual hug from time to time Spring and isn't it lovely to know that we can always find one here. Hope you're feeling a bit brighter today.

It's such a shame that the excited anticipation of awaiting the arrival of a GC, especially the first, is being denied to you Ladysu.

Morning all

Remarkably the sun is shining right now! Didn't get to take Joey out for his walkies yesterday as heavy rain all day!

Hope you have a nice time at the theatre Smiles and you enjoy the romantic play.

Hope you are feeling more upbeat today Spring and that the sun is shining where you are, makes you feel better, the sunshine. }}}hugs{{{

It's very sad you are being denied the joy of your new grandbaby, but try to carry on as you are, just being pleasant and agreeable and not asking for anything. I know this is not a normal way to be but you are trying to save your relationship with your son so it's worth the struggle, you have a good chance of getting things back on track as you haven't actually been cut out, so you need to keep it that way as hard as it no doubt is to keep your mouth shut, it's the only way.

When I was first estranged, everyone told me to back-off, but I couldn't listen, couldn't do it. It was like telling me to cut-off my legs and carry on walking.

Spring nice to see your post but sorry you are having a hard time. I hope things will get easier for you given time. 💐

Smiles hope you both enjoy your trip to the theatre. I am going with my daughter and grandsons next week to see The tiger who came to tea. I like the film so looking forward to seeing how they stage production will work.

My daughter took me to see Keith Brymer Jones on stage with his wife last year. It was brilliant. I see he is doing it again this year highly recommend if he is coming to a theatre near you go you will have a lovely fun filled evening.

Ladysusiei in my son's email he said I spoilt the surprise of him telling me they where pregnant as I guessed. Once they where married they both told me they would be trying for a baby. I lived over 100 miles away he phoned me on a Friday asking if they could come for the day on Saturday and he sounded excited so knew what they where going to tell me. Apparently he said I cried and said I wouldn't be a proper grandmother because I lived so far away. I don't cry over things like that and I have never believed distance makes any difference to being a proper mom to use his word or grandmother,sister etc.

Unfortunately they lost that pregnancy . And he said in his email I said it wasn't a baby . Which I never said. My brother said that. Because of the type of pregnancy it was I contacted the hospital that was the centre of excellence for that type of stuff and talked to a nurse generally about exactly why it happened and how I could help. She put me in touch with a forum and was shocked to read it had happened to women twice.

My son doesn't know I did this to try and help them . As he wouldn't talk to me so I have never been able to put him right about his lies and assumptions.

When my daughter was pregnant the second time I already guessed . And when my grandson gave me an envelope with the scan picture inside I said I know what this is before opening it she didn't take the hump because I already knew. She just asked how I said because you look like you did last time. She laughed and said no one else had guessed.

When we told my husbands parents I was pregnant the first time finally had approval from from my father in law but my mother in law said nothing. Before we got married he told me I was defective because I was disabled.

We had devised a strategy with them if they started on us we walked out. But always went back the next Sunday because my husband loved his parents but didn't like them . I hated them.

When I was pregnant with our son and went to tell them my father in law was overjoyed. He was besotted with his granddaughter but my mother in law took against from when she was a baby. Her brother and sister in law where there she looked at me then said to them she's only got pregnant because her friend is. So we walked out.

We had been trying for 6 months my friend was happy with just her daughter and didn't want another child but once she got over the shock she was fine and had another daughter.

My mother in law was all out son until he got his own personality. Then treated him like our daughter. Unfortunately my father in law who adored the children died not long after I came out of hospital in 1988 our daughter was 4 and son 8 months . My parents loved all 5 of their grandchildren and adored them .
My mother in law was nan in name only .
My son and daughter in law knows what a bad mother ,mother in law and grandmother is as they knew her.
But have been tarred with the same brush.

As parents and grandparents we are dammed with we do and dammed if we don't. Our children decide to estranged us and make excuses why to suit their point of view and will never admit they are wrong. It's always the parents fault. But as parents whe have a choice to play their game or not since last year I decided not to play their game and feel so much happier for making that decision. But that's me and how I protect myself from being hurt anymore..

@Spring20
Thank you for your support. I am reducing my expectations in fact they are rapidly dwindling . I’m so disappointed by the way this last year has unfolded, because we used to be a real close family unit . I’m giving them both space , will be speaking to him tomorrow and I’ll just take it from there . I am really hoping things do improve- despite the way my AS has spoken / treated me with utter disrespect lately, I will find a way to forgive him . Trust will be more difficult but I can work on trying to be more confident in trusting him .
Thanks.

@yogi thank you for some really good advice there . You’ve highlighted how unnatural it is to have this strained relationship and how difficult it is to keep my distance for the time being. I have been trying so hard , but at first I was falling. I now realise that this will be the only way to turn things around . Giving my son and his wife space , for no matter whatever reason, is key . I know they’ve been horrible to me , but I’m prepared to take a different approach especially if it might just pay off . I’ve stopped being angry or even disappointed I’ve accepted the situation for what it is . I can’t change their behaviour only mine can’t I ? I will speak with him tomorrow and take it fro there . You’re right though , it is unnatural.

@Smiles - sorted technical issues!! So unless things are absolutely awful speaking with Dan tomorrow I’ll update on here . I’m really hoping he will have simmered down since last time . We’ll see .
@Whiff it’s awful isn’t just how many situations get distorted and so many lies are told about things . Pregnancy does seem to expose any cracks that might be brewing up in a relationship, which is such a shame . I must say that I brought my son up to tell the truth no matter what , now he’s an adult he’s lying about so many things and getting caught out . It makes me wonder how he can justify telling me that he needs to keep his child from my influence. I’m hurt by this because I’ve been brought up with good values and passed those onto my son .

Take care everyone and thank you for your kind advice and thoughtfulness.

@madgran meant to say practicing my technique which you advised me on .. Hopefully I will get to put it into practice this weekend. All I need to remember is keep calm ! xxx

Ladysuisei

@madgran meant to say practicing my technique which you advised me on .. Hopefully I will get to put it into practice this weekend. All I need to remember is keep calm ! xxx

Hope things go ok Lady.

Yes keep calm, really listen and give space. Let him bring up "dificult" stuff if he wishes to. If he does, still calm, listening, not arguing or justifying at this stage. Otherwise provide tea/ food etc and general chat. Really hope it works better for you.

I know its not easy but nor is it "giving in" ...its just taking some control of what happens in the encounters, not engaging with the angst but taking on board what he says.

Afterwards you can reflect on how things went, what he said; what your view would be of events as described by him are; what you feel is perception; why he/they might be feeling what they feel; your part, or not, in causing that.

You can then work through the points made and plan next steps/a way forward that works for you/for them within the boundaries they are requesting etc without being driven by overwhelming (and understandable) emotion.

I have reiterated all that above as I know how easy it is to boil it down to keeping calm when you are actually managing to do so much more than that in such difficult circumstances for both yourself and your son.

@madgran the key for me is keeping calm . My son has an uncanny ability to tie me up in verbal knots which certainly hasn’t been helping . I know the pauses in the conversation, more active listening and checking what he means etc will help me . At least things won’t descend into an argument which is the worse possible thing - like you say I want to start maintaining some control over these conversations. What you’ve advised me to do makes so much sense given both our personalities. The thing is me and my son are so similar and we both tend to be stubborn I suppose . He won’t ever admit his shortcomings though which doesn’t help matters . Even admitting them just to himself would be a start . I’m pretty self aware but it’s my anxiety that sets off like a runaway train that causes problems in these situations. Thank you - I’m going to work really hard on being calm this time and include lots of the pauses . Let’s see what happens. On a Saturday I speak to him on the phone , which normally goes badly then Sunday he comes to see me which is slightly easier face to face . Thanks .

LadyS 💐

Morning everyone.

Oooh Ladysu I'm feeling really quite nervous this morning. You'd think it was me who was anxiously preparing to talk to our son, not you anxiously preparing to talk to yours.

So awful when it comes to this so I'm thinking about you and keeping everything crossed that it goes OK and lays a better foundation for his visit tomorrow.

Had a great time last night at the theatre Yogin. The play was brilliant as I knew it would be; John Godber at his best. A cast of only 3, 2 taking on more than one role which is typical of his work. It was an excellent performance and there was a standing ovation at the end.

So yesterday was a very good day, despite the awful sea fret that enveloped us for the entire day. An unexpected face time call from DS so he could tell us how well his new post is going. and how much he's enjoying was the cherry on the cake.

Today's off to a good start as the fret has lifted, it's stopped raining and I can see areas of blue sky .

Hi, it’s been a while. Hope all are well.💐

Last year, I decided I needed to come offline (other than for banking etc), to try and get my head around losing DH, and to try and deal with my flakiness etc. and concentrate on real life.

I’ve had great support from my kids, and GCs, along with friends, neighbours and others.👍

I still haven’t heard from DHs family…..but no loss to me.🙄

It’s been 10 months and I’m getting there - I still get bad days, but I’m adjusting. I decided to do it the hard way - no counselling (no point), and no medication. I’m not paying to waffle at a stranger who can’t change a thing, and I’ve got enough vices without taking the risk of getting addicted to drugs.

So, I’ve had to develop self help. I still have a dodgy sleep pattern and appetite, but my hair has stopped falling out - little steps.👍

I’ve grabbed positives where I can - against the odds, my ex and I have become friends. We spent Xmas together with DD and family.

We avoid certain subjects, keep it to talking about our long past (52 years!) and are just friendly parents and grandparents. That’s all it will ever be, (I don’t want anything else, ) but it’s lovely that we’ve got to this.🙂

He will, despite the history, always be the father of my kids.

It’s startled a few people, but it is what it is. The kids are happy- it’s removed any stress from it.

Anyway, I’ve waffled enough - thought I’d have a catch up now I’m back online.

All have a nice rest of day. 💐

DiamondLily how lovely to hear from you and so positive too. 🌻

Well hello there DL, it's so good to see your post. We love to hear how our friends who haven't posted for a while are getting on.

It's good that you're getting plenty of support from family, friends and neighbours and, that you and your ex are able to spend some time together as friends.

I'm sure you have startled a few people and I wouldn't mind betting that gave you a little chuckle .

You're missed .

DiamondLily lovely to hear from you. Love for your husband is everlasting and the grief is as well. Given time you will cope but it will still overwhelm you at times. Been 20 years since my husband died and the love for him and the grief have both gotten stronger but I cope best I can. You will always have your past and memories of your time together. And it's hard making a new present and future. Going from a couple to just you is hard and having to make all the decisions when you are used to being 2. Lost count of the times I have shouted this shouldn't be my life but that was before I moved here. As I didn't have a life I existed.

My daughter tells me how proud she is of me for making a new life. But it took me from 2004 until 2019 to live the life my husband wanted for me.

Take it one day at a time and very glad to hear you have plenty of family support. I well remember how your husband's children treated you both so they are no loss to you. And you are better off without them your life.

Your children and grandchildren loved him and that's what counts . Shows what a wonderful man he was to be so loved . Look forward to more of your waffles . I call mine rambles.🤣.

Glad you enjoyed the show Smiles. Thank goodness for this sane thread . Some very nasty posters have come out of the woodwork on other threads. Was saddened they attacked you and LadyS. Plus the others who supported you. If I had posted I would have got banned from replying to some of the insults.

Never understand why people take pleasure in hurting and bullying others.. But then again I put up.with my mother in law for 40 years and I hated her from when we first met. But my husband loved his parents but didn't like them. Thinking about it my son and daughter in law have turned out like my in laws. Expect this time I won't put up with it.

Are well just a short ramble as past my bed time .Sweet dreams all.

@smiles I didn’t see your response hiding there ! Well suffice to say my phone call was predictable . It’s very difficult to work out what’s going on here because my AS’s anger levels are going up yet I’ve not spoken to him for a week . He wants to see me on a Sunday , yet is very nasty and horrible on the phone on a Saturday. It’s puzzling. He actually wants to keep contact going - I don’t understand if there’s some other stressor here that I know nothing about . Ah well , not long to go now before the visit x

Hi, everyone…thanks for the welcome back.

Quick update on the situation around Miss Dysfunctionality and my estranged GGC.

She’s still on a restraining order, and the child is being cared for by her adoptive grandmother. Miss D has been removed from her house. She is giving good practical care, but the Jeehovahs witness situation is being addressed by the family court.

We’ve all been assessed as to who should have regular and consistent contact with the child.

Social services are agreed that Miss D can never have unsupervised care or contact with the child. Her assessments have failed on every level.

The assessors have recommended that the child is cared for by the adoptive granny, but that my GS, DD, SIL, and the rest of the family have a full weekend’s access, at DD’s, once a month.

Adoptive mother/granny is fine with this.

But, every time it goes back to the Court for an order, Miss D comes out with ever more lurid allegations against us all - they are all swiftly disproved, but we have to go through the process, of disproving..

The judge has said she wants to rule on this in May, with no further delays. Miss D doesn’t attend the hearings - just sends her solicitor in with more rubbish.

So, hopefully, in May, there will be a court enforced solution. 🙂