And me. Poor little thing.☹️
Sometimes it’s just the small things that press the bruise isn’t it? 😢
Gransnet forums
Estrangement
In danger of becoming estranged from adult children
(243 Posts)I have two children aged 20 (boy) and 22 (girl)who are university students in Ireland. The oldest finishes university at the end of April. In Ireland, unless you are very poor, parents have to pay for university. I moved to the UK 18 months ago to get a better job to be able to support my children through university.
The children live in a house that I own in Dublin - I bought it when I was 23. They pay no rent as they are students. I pay all the utility bills and maintain and insure the house. They have a very expensive lifestyle as students - lots of foreign holidays, designer clothes, out drinking several nights a week, eat only at the best restaurants and cafes, have Sushi delivered to the door when they feel like it, and take taxis whenever they wake up late and can't get to work and/or university on time. They work full-time and go to university to be able to pay for their expensive lifestyles. They still get good grades.
However, they treat the house with terrible disrespect and me to, a lot of the time - I am a single parents since they were aged 3 and 18 months. There has been an infestation of mice in the house on two occasions. The last time this happened, the pest control company said it was the worst mouse infestation they had seen in a private house - and the infestation led to the neighbours house being infested also. This happened because my children, particularly my daughter, left food lying around uncovered, and bits of old food in the sink. I was renting out a room in the house at the time to another student. She had left food rotting on the table and kitchen work surfaces for a week. My children never let me know this, or never asked her to clean up, or never cleaned up the rotting food themselves to prevent a mouse infestation. When my children discovered there was mice in, they never let me know for two months. The final bill to get rid of the mice was 560 euros for the pest control company, and 2163 euros to defumigate the house afterwards and get rid of all the mice droppings. The children, but more particularly my daughter, are still not cleaning up the house. My son will do it sometimes with a couple of reminders. I went over last week to the house, the day after a new heating system was put in which cost 7000 euros, the bin in the kitchen was overflowing, there were pizza boxes with half eaten pizzas on the table, and bits of food in the sink. The external bin had not been put out for collection for several weeks and was overflowing. The carboard rubbish that my son had gotten from his Ikea delivery was left in the front garden. When I asked my daughter to empty the kitchen bin and dispose of the pizza boxes and their contents, she went mad, saying she hadn't time, that it wasn't her job, saying she hadn't time as she was going to work - the external bin is in the front of the house, so on her way out to work. Later I discovered she had no work that day.
There is a Ukranian girl now sharing the house who is lovely and keeps the house clean, but who has to do more than her fair share, because my two children won't help, though she acknowledges that my son helps a lot more than my daughter. This Ukranian girl states my daughter refused to help with any of the cleaning, leaves clothes everyone in the kitchen and sitting room, leaves used sanitary towels sticking out of bins and leaves takeaway foods uncovered and rotting in the fridge until they smell. About three years ago, there were two German girls sharing the house with my children and they couldn't cope with my duaghter's mess, leaving clothes everywhere, not cleaning up, and letting her dog pee everywhere and refusing to clean it up afterwards.
There is a back story to this, and apologies if I am long-winded. My daughter has always been quite a difficult person from a young age. Terrible temper tantrums from aged 2. In teenage years, she would scream the house down if the clothes she wanted to wear for school were in the wash - no uniform for school. Boundaries never worked - her demands were never given in to, and she lost privileges such as pocket money for bad behaviour. She also bullied her brother a lot and would make him cry - when I saw it, I always intervened, though they are still very close and tell each other everything and will back each other up against me. Other people have also found my daughter very difficult including teachers, and the family she stayed with in France when she spent a year there during the fourth year of secondary schooling - she had wanted to this and it was very expensive to do - 15000 for the year. As a teenager she would often threaten to tell social work that I was beating them up, and threaten that she would get my son taken away from me. She used to tell my son that I beat her up, and he would take her side, but when I asked him had he ever seen me beat her up, he would say he never had. She would also tell neighbours that I had assaulted her. When she used to threaten social work, I used to give her the telephone number to ring - I worked in healthcare so had the relevant numbers.
However, there is more of a back story to this. My son is not blameless either. I was very close to my son until he was about 14. At this time, he started to mix in with a bad crowd, and nothing I said or did could dissuade him from this, and he resented how much I tried to keep tabs on him. My son eventually started stealing from me, discovered the pin numbers for my online bank account, sold items from the house - cameras etc. He would have friends in when I was not there and they would eat all the food in the house, so it would be all gone within a day or two - this was before they went to university. They both had parties in the house when I was on night duty - I had to work four nights per month, and once when I went away for a night with my best friend. They damaged the work surfaces in the kitchen by dancing on them, damaged sofas by them and their friends vomiting on them. I had a converted attic in the house which was used as a den, and they put cigarette burns in the furniture and threw burning shorts and jeans out of the attic windows.
Things came to a head in those years before university, when my son age 16 decided to hide drugs in the house for one of his undesirable friends in exchange for 50 euros - the house was subsequently raided on a tip off by our police, the Gardai.. My son subsequently had to go into hiding as there was a threat on his life from the loss of money because the drugs were seized. This meant he had to change school as the drug gang knew which school he attended. No state school would take him because of the risk, but I got him into a private school, which cost 8000 per year. I had to work 55 hours per week though to pay for this school for two years, and eventually suffered with burnout. My son and daughter also had to move out of what was our family home to where they live now, which was my first house, which I had bought at a very young age and managed to keep. The gang tried to intimidate me in my home, and I was living in fear of being petrol bombed for the drug debt. A member of the gang came to my house one night. I knew who was ringing at my door, and I rang the police and they were arrested.
These were not children who were neglected. They did lots of after school activities, which they wanted to do. My daughter's hobby was sailing, and I paid for all this, including her sailing exams. They both also loved music, and had piano, singing, drum and saxaphone lessons. We travelled each summer abroad. They had lots of support with school, and I paid for extra tuition as they needed it.
I guess here, I would just like some opinions. Because of all that has happened, I feel a lot of resentment towards my children, and don't feel any real connection to them anymore. My daughter in particular, has always treated me with some contempt. If I text her, she will not respond for days, or until she needs something from me. If I try and arrange to do something nice with her, she will fob me off constantly. If I talk about how their behaviour has upset me or how I find it disrespectful, they become angry and annoyed and just walk away. If I say that something they have done or said has hurt me, and I feel the need to talk about it, they again become angry and blaming and everything is my fault. It's a big effort for them to do anything for Mother's Day or my birthday - if I don't remind them beforehand they won't do anything, yet I always go out of my way to celebrate their birthdays and buy them something nice, and also to make Christmas special. They will meet up with me when I am home sometimes, but they seem only interested if I am taking them out to an expensive restaurant or with the promise of cocktails and a serious amount of alcohol, and so it's gets expensive for me to try and maintain a relationship with them. Tea/coffee and cake in the local cafe or breakfast/lunch in a local bar is not enticing for them.
I am no longer sure, I can maintain a relationship with both of them. I still feel so resentful and sad about all that has happened and the way they have treated me, and that's impacting on my life, friendships and my relationship with my partner. I am working full-time abroad in the UK, but feel no longer able to do this - just wrecked by everything, and want to work part-time, but I can't sell the house where they are living because they are still in university, but yet I cannot stand to go there, and all the pressure to maintain it when they treat it so badly. After the last night when my daughter refused to empty the overflowing bin, I said I didn't want a relationship with her anymore, that I was so tired of trying to support them when they treated me and the house so badly.
Apologies for such a long post, and thanks to whoever manages to read through it, I just need some direction and advice on all this.
The hamster went back to the pet shop. My son's girlfriend's brother manages a pet shop. Hopefully, some nice family with parents and youngish children will take him and look after him well.
ElaineMcG47
The hamster went back to the pet shop. My son's girlfriend's brother manages a pet shop. Hopefully, some nice family with parents and youngish children will take him and look after him well.
Good. It doesn’t matter what the creature is, they all need to be looked after properly.🙂
VS did you not read the post? Very long I know, however those two entitled people would have had warnings ages ago about their filthy way of living and if they hadn’t cleaned up their act be out, their decision. I don’t know why parents should he disrespected and take it lying down. You might like washing up lying about, we all do at times but certainly no rodent infestation, just filthy.
OP, I am Irish though living in the UK.
I don’t understand why your children couldn’t get SUSI grants.
Hi! Sago, I couldn't get SUSI for them as I was a couple of thousand over the limit on my salary. The limit was 57k for payment of college fees and I earned 59k euros working in the health service in Ireland as a clinical nurse specialist. I also had a 2.5k qualification allowance on top of that for my specialist masters qualification, so was in total about 3.5k over the SUSI limit. In any case, my children didn't want to apply for SUSI even if they could have gotten it as SUSI only permits students to work in holiday times, and the limit they can earn has just gone up recently to about 7.5k - my two wanted to work throughout the year to fund their e
Apologies, clicked too soon.
to fund their expensive lifestyles - I think they are probably both earning about 32k to 35k euros each.
I'm currently home for the weekend and being stonewalled, with no replies to texts, calls, conversation etc. My daughter has been given her notice, but not sure I can cope with this until September with my son. Trying to detach calmly!
Then in that case with the information provided I really don’t understand why it is the case that you are living in England to earn more money and presumably paying rent when you could be in Ireland with a home in Dublin ( to anyone that isn’t aware Dublin rents and property prices are sky high).
Surely you should turf both of them out, reclaim your home and let them get on with it.
They are earning more as undergraduates in Ireland as many post grad students here in England, they do not need your help.
Stop enabling your children.
I think the OP has already posted that she’s going to do that. Both are going to be evicted in the Autumn.
Yes she has DL a difficult decision for her to make but one that was necessary.
Yes, sometimes tough love is the way to go. Enabling people to act badly never works for long.🙂
Hi! Sago, I am here in UK as there was only shift nursing jobs available to me in Ireland and I couldn't use my master's qualification there - that is, there were very few jobs in the area I did my masters in and any jobs that were there were usually obtained on the basis of who you know and your connections - Ireland hasn't changed that much in this regard. Due to age and a health issue I wasn't able to do shift working any more. My salary here in UK is good, and the higher rate of sterling to the euro actually covers the rent on my flat which is just a very small one bed in a cheap area of UK. You are right, Sago, property and rent prices are sky high in Dublin, but now it is all over the country - a room to rent in a large town in the country is now about 800 a month the same as West Dublin - it would be a 1000 per month for a room in areas nearer to Dublin City. That's not that much far off London prices.
To Diamond Lilly and Smiles - my two seem to be taking me seriously now - my daughter is actively looking at moving in with friends who have a room to rent, and my son and his girlfriend are looking for a place together.
That's really great news Elaine it will be much better for all three of you if they leave before you're forced to evict them 
.
Elaine lovely to have a positive up date.
Is there a way back after eviction or asking to leave though?
I know it's horrible because I've experienced our home being treated like trash and I was financially supporting two (unemployed) adults who had a child but acted like children themselves and expected everything to be paid for like kids! The entitlement was real! But things still aren't great because they have been almost silent since having to support themselves and pay for their own home. I think they actually resent the lack of support! 
I think having lived through similar, that it's good to prepare yourself for the fact that sometimes they only put up with us because they can use us- and when we stop letting them use us, they leave our lives. 
I hope your kids re different.
It really depends on those who are evicted Onward, if they value the relationship or if it's as you say, just about what they can get out of it.
It's awful to think you may need to prepare yourself for no longer being in their lives if you don't do what they want, but unfortunately for some, that's the reality .
Yes @Smileless2012 I think that is a reality, not just because you stopped serving them, but also because it's a loss of dignity and the wake up call probably really hurts. It's not anything I'd take lightly because I'd be worried that the hurt of the situation may make them estrange.
I'd also consider that, if they are already behaving in an awful way, but financially benefitting from the situation, there is no respect or consideration from the parent, perhaps they feel entitled to live for free and not clean up after themselves and are oblivious to their parents feelings?
So perhaps once they no longer benefit from the free living situation they could be likely to go no contact or become worse. It's sad to live in fear of this and to struggle with grown adults who are oblivious to the daily stress they cause by their refusal to communicate or attempt to live in a hygenic or considerate way.
Ooops I meant in paragraph 2 that they have no consideration for the parent
Hello! Just qn update. My daughter has gone travelling ans will be abroad until April 2027. My son is still in the house. The house is going on the market on the 2nd week of October. I am downzizing to a two bed apartment if the house sells and I told my son he could have a room there until he finishes university in June 2026. As I mentioned earlier it is almost impossible for students to get accommodation in Dublin. He has bern making some effort with the house but requires constant reminders yo do things. At the moment when I come home from the UK, he is not talking to me, no hello, no asking if I need anything if he is getting a lunch roll from the shop.
About 5 weeks ago he mislaid part of a Hive system for our heating. He removed the Internet and the Hive to his room from downstairs., but didn't
plug it in and lost a piece that came with it, though I managed to buy this piece separately and it was only 30 euros. I was annoyed with him and sent him a text - I was in the UK - that I had asked him not to remove the Hive and Internet from downstairs as it was meeded to turn and and off the heating, which we use for hot water in the summer. The new heating system and Hive were installed in Feb costing 7000k in total including 500 gor five. We can't operate the heating system on a schedule without it or without getting a manual timer installed instead. There is a Ukranuan girl shating the house who needs the hot water too.
I texted him and said over text I was really annoyed and that the heating couldn't be scheduled without it. I asked him to find the other piece and sort it out after he returned from his weekend away. He got really mad at me saying I always tell lies that it would work without the Hive. He said then that I have a temper and that's why he never rings me. If you see the original post, I have put up with a huge amount. My neighbour used to say he didn't know how I put up with it all and I was a very quiet woman to do so. It serms I can't even get justifiably annoyed but I am accused of having a temper or telling lies. This reaction from my son has happened a lot over the years. When I tried to talk to him before about how it seemed he and his sister always seemed to be dissing me and critic8sing me, and I needed to talk about it and understand what was going on, he started shouting at me in the restaurant, saying I was a shit mother, that I was trying to come between himself and his sister. I ended up in tears and there was no move from him to show any empathy or sympathy. I felt then and in iur recent interaction anout the Hive, that my son se4ms to enjoy the piwer of having the ability to hurt me. It was the same this time when I texted back that I was really hurt by his accusation that I was telling lies or had a temper. I reminded him of what our neighbour had after witnessing my son and daughter destroy my house as teenagers and then my son get caught hiding drugs.
So sorry for ling post. I want to give my son accommidation until he is finishes university but I don't think I will be able to cope coming home even two weekends qnd facing this atmosphere. My son is also really angry that I am selling the house - I want to semi retire as all that has happened with my children has impacted my mental health and led to feeling life is joyless. Downsizing would enable me to semi-retire. However. My son is really angry saying all his friends live near the house and if we move he will have to travel 15 miles to college. There are buses and trains evey 30 mins that are heavily subsidised for children and college students andI would be happy to nake a 20/25 euro contribution to his bustard each week.
Also, would any of uou here th8nk just staying quiet about bein annoyed would have been better. I feel I have to bite my tongue so often and can never clear the air about anything.
I forgot to.mention thst one of the issues that I have been addresd8ng with him over the last several years us locking the house when he leaves. He never locks the fr9nt door. He only started doing it after I became really exasperated when I came home late one night to find the door unlocked yet again, and I said if that happened again,I woul be leaving his belongings on the doorstep. He has a long term habit of living and forgetting keys bit I felt that at 21 this was now too much. All comments and constructive criticism welcome@
Frankly I do not think you should let him stay with you any longer. That is an unusual thing for me to say as standing by one's children as adults will always be my default. But in this particular situation and knowing that you have tried over time to communicate and to sort out problems, I really think that he needs to learn the hard way!
I said if that happened again,I wouldbe leaving his belongings on the doorstep
You threatened the above; now do it after this last Hive situation. Tell him that you will no longer tolerate his behaviour; ignoring your specific and explained requests; his rudeness; his disrespect of you and your belongings etc. Tell him that if he is ever willing to sit down and have a calm conversation with appropriate listening and opportunity for both of you to understand each others perspective then you are very willing and keen to do that. But that luving together is not working. Tell him he is welcome to visit when you are over to catch up and have a meal
He has to then sort himself out/sofa surf and generally realise life's realities for himself. I know how hard this will be as well as scary ...but what alternative do you have to change the status quo?
Excellent advice from Madgran Elaine and I hope you take it.
Your son hasn't changed and isn't about too anytime soon so in your position I wouldn't risk him living with you until he finishes uni. How will you be able to get him to leave when the time comes if he refuses to do so?
He's taking advantage and you really do need to put a stop to it once and for all.
Thanks Madgran77 and Smileless2012. It's good advice. He is working as a paid intern for the third year of college and is saving, and has a girlfriend, so it is possible them to find somewhere together.
I would have offered him stay until the end of college in April 2026, but the atmosphere is very tense when I come home - it feels like contempt for me - I feel like a visitor in my own home. He is barely talking to me since I spoke to him about the issue with the Hive. I just feel sad and down about it all - it seems to be on my mind all the time.
ElaineMcG47
Thanks Madgran77 and Smileless2012. It's good advice. He is working as a paid intern for the third year of college and is saving, and has a girlfriend, so it is possible them to find somewhere together.
I would have offered him stay until the end of college in April 2026, but the atmosphere is very tense when I come home - it feels like contempt for me - I feel like a visitor in my own home. He is barely talking to me since I spoke to him about the issue with the Hive. I just feel sad and down about it all - it seems to be on my mind all the time.
His attitude is down to him. Do what you need to do to give you peace and happiness. 💐
What is it with these entitled children? You are a much much nicer person than me! I certainly wouldnt stand for it - they would be gone years ago. I have a difficult dd who accused me of all sorts over the years even telling my work colleagues she was hungry as there was no food in the house - we could live for a couple of months from our store cupboard. She is now 44 unemployed divorced and luckily childless. I wish you well.
Are you only buying the apartment for him to live in? you mentioned before you could retire into a small cottage (your Uncles?) could you not do that?
I would offer to go to family counselling with him but it sounds like he is being abusive to you and you have already had to put up with that with their Father ad it makes you conditioned to how you are behaving
15 miles on a bus is nothinf ffs at 21
Join the conversation
Registering is free, easy, and means you can join the discussion, watch threads and lots more.
Register now »Already registered? Log in with:
Gransnet »