Well, at least this time, I am not the so called problem.

Eh?

Does your daughter know you’re laying her private life out on the internet?

It makes a change from OP monopolising threads on news and politics. I won't post anymore on this. She never takes advice that doesn't agree with her view. She must live in an echo chamber

Agree that yes I am resentful and bitter. Rightly so, some stranger comes and interfers with my daughters marriage, destroys it a d that turns my own daughter from someone who would regularly write "I love you mommy" in messages to calling me an abuser because her dad couldn't help but yell at me (not her) im her childhood when he wanted me to do things rather than simply ask like a normal person. Yeah my daughter died , rose and became someone else. So yeah I resent the people who brought that about.

I get all that as your perspective but focusing on it is not going to help you really is it

Madgran77

*Agree that yes I am resentful and bitter. Rightly so, some stranger comes and interfers with my daughters marriage, destroys it a d that turns my own daughter from someone who would regularly write "I love you mommy" in messages to calling me an abuser because her dad couldn't help but yell at me (not her) im her childhood when he wanted me to do things rather than simply ask like a normal person. Yeah my daughter died , rose and became someone else. So yeah I resent the people who brought that about.*

I get all that as your perspective but focusing on it is not going to help you really is it

Well, at least you get it. Some people cannot understand or get anything unless it happens to them, really. I sure wouldn't get it if my young self read my own posts. I would say just screw em, but, that would be my young, unaffected self.

It does not help, you are right. I think it's I look too much back at just around 8 years ago, seriously, on top of the world, love all around our family, my daughter, her husband, first grandchild's first birthday and all of us were over the moon, always together, happy.

I used to thank God everyday, especially since the road before had some bumps, things had peaked into perfection. It's really has been hard, it literally happened overnight when it did happen, and it was final before anyone could try to
work it out, talk about it, etc.

Just suddenly over, just like that. Not one hope. Like being hit by a truck, but with no real recovery, just forever banged up. I tried very hard to be there for her but as time went she started just resenting my help, which was everything from comfort talk, to cleaning her house, to offering things she might need either emotionally or financially, taking care of things with the kids, etc.

I really feel she felt like a loser, rejected by her soulmate, and I was the one who raised her, so it was my fault.

Alot of talk became about critiquing how she was raised, everything from my husband to what food she ate. Didn't want to relive memories like watching videos of their childhood or share movies of that era with the grandkids.

By contrast, my son loves the era, lately has been happy we revisit it watching movies and I've gotten some things for our computer room like Star Wars decor, Back to the Future, etc. from the 80's. He loves his childhood. She doesn't. She used to.

Oh well. Way off the original subject. I think the girlfriend should have asked my daughter first. Apparently my SIL is too wimpy to defend what he believes in. This isnt' the first time her son has been allowed to do something she opposes and they didn't even bother asking her.

So much for the co-parenting she was bragging about to me last year. Guess he got tired of her rules too.

"Alot of talk became about critiquing how she was raised, everything from my husband to..."

Your husband, as in her father. Her abusive father. Which you neglected to protect her from, for one reason or another.

You talk about how rosy the past was but people grow and tend to get wiser. They sometimes look back on their childhood and realize what they used to think was completely normal was in fact far from it.

Maybe it's time you wisen up and take accountability for your mistakes rather than babbling gossip online about your daughter.

Shame on you.

Gosh, OP I understood, from previous posts that you liked your ex SIL....
The best advice is to step back from your daughter's affairs and be grateful she allows, even minimal contact with her children.
Have you been to see a therapist about all this?

NoNews

"Alot of talk became about critiquing how she was raised, everything from my husband to..."

Your husband, as in her father. Her abusive father. Which you neglected to protect her from, for one reason or another.

You talk about how rosy the past was but people grow and tend to get wiser. They sometimes look back on their childhood and realize what they used to think was completely normal was in fact far from it.

Maybe it's time you wisen up and take accountability for your mistakes rather than babbling gossip online about your daughter.

Shame on you.

Not abusive at all to her. Verbally abusive to me, always complaining, putting me down. So she needed no protection.

BTW, she's perfectly fine with him now. Ironic, ain't it? Or actually, it makes sense because she was never abused by him, so why wouldn't she be ok with him?

Shame on on you for blaming the real victim of it all.

MarieElla

Gosh, OP I understood, from previous posts that you liked your ex SIL....
The best advice is to step back from your daughter's affairs and be grateful she allows, even minimal contact with her children.
Have you been to see a therapist about all this?

I did like him. I hate what he did. If he came back tomorrow, I'd welcome him, forgive and forget. I still like him but what he did to my daughter was cruel, didn't give their marriage a chance, just saw an opportunity to have something "better" like a young girl.

So there is no hate here...just mad sometimes but most of all, disappointed in him. I'd say that's pretty normal under the circumstances. And I blame the girl more since she had the experience knowing the pain of divorce, as her mother had just gone through it. But at least she had her parents together during childhood; that's something she took from my grandkids.

Have been to therapists. Tried a couple. All were shocked and in agreement that my daughter's behavior was a result of her trying to blame and control the only person who really gave a crap. And they could only offer me ways to try and cope. Gave me strategies to manage with her, which surprised them when those would fail. One of them used to open her mouth in shock. I think she was stumped on what to do really. But she tried.

I have coped partially, but the on going problem makes it hard to resolve and move on. Well, I have moved on in some ways; I was obsessed always with my kids and couldn't stand it if something happened to them.

I cried for literally years after this all happened to her, knowing how much pain she had to be in. At least now, somehow her rejection of me as a mom just quelled that pain in me.

Although I sometimes still feel for her pain, it's just not at all at the same level it was before, which is some sort of twisted blessing I guess. I don't even worry about her life at all anymore. It's weird. I guess I love her but not as much as I used to? Idk. Maybe because she is not the same person, the one who used to text me mommy mommy and I love you. That person died, in a way.

Now I'm more protective of myself. I will speak up when she tries to criticize or misjudge something I do or say. I will not put up with it anymore, it's a pattern she learned from her dad. And he's finally learning too,

I'm not going to let him continue without calling him out on it. Seems he's starting to understand I will not let it slide anymore. He's a narcissist, someone once a long time ago tried to tell me that but of course, young love is blind love.

So as they say, children learn what the live. My husband was the example since he was the dominate type whereas I was the peacemaker, the more silent one. Never dawned on me, she would take after him. She was a sweet girl. But, people change.

So many ineffective therapists out there...I think you need one to help you take responsibility in the breakdown of your relationship with your daughter.
Then the relationship will have some hope of rebuilding.

Op

You are very wrong that verbal abuse directed to you did not affect her

It was also abusive to her.

You are so in denial about that

Ya you're the real victim here. The adult who could have walked away, not the helpless child who had no choice but to stay.

"So much for the co-parenting she was bragging about to me last year."

And I see you're finding joy that your daughter was wrong.

With mothers like these, who needs enemies.

Poor daughter.

Please stop talking about her behind her back. It's not motherly at all.

And I'm afraid to ask what you were feeding her as a child, but the fact you're unable to take her criticisms seriously speaks volumes of your character.

As a child you have no point of reference or wisdom. You just live life, eat whats in front of you and carry on like everything is normal. As an adult, you can look back on your childhood with a much greater understanding and knowledge of what's right and wrong.

Also, you should show your daughter what you have been posting. If you can't comfortably do that, than that itself should be a really big clue that you shouldn't be doing it in the first place.

Food for thought.

MarieElla

So many ineffective therapists out there...I think you need one to help you take responsibility in the breakdown of your relationship with your daughter.
Then the relationship will have some hope of rebuilding.

Absolutely.
No therapist worth the money would openly agree with a client complaining about another person involved in the reason you are seeing them.
As for one of them opening her mouth in shock, almost laughable. They just wouldn’t do that.

But unfortunately, I don't think the OP is open to changing her behaviour as has been shown in her complete lack of self reflection.
I think her daughter is right putting a distance between her and the grandchildren.

Hithere

Op

You are very wrong that verbal abuse directed to you did not affect her

It was also abusive to her.

You are so in denial about that

Well she certainly is in denial that she should be blaming the source, her dad now, isn't she?

She should be blaming both of you!

petra

MarieElla

So many ineffective therapists out there...I think you need one to help you take responsibility in the breakdown of your relationship with your daughter.
Then the relationship will have some hope of rebuilding.

Absolutely.
No therapist worth the money would openly agree with a client complaining about another person involved in the reason you are seeing them.
As for one of them opening her mouth in shock, almost laughable. They just wouldn’t do that.

Believe what you want. They were good therapists who also wanted to involve my daughter who refused because, I guess, she's perfect and it's all me. With that attitude, no wonder she has issues and who knows, maybe she treated my SIL with the same attitude and he couldn't wait to leave.

I don't believe that, because I know how men are with younger women, so I think he just took off, but, perhaps my angel wasn't so angelic.

I have tried being understanding with her for several years, believe me, did the therapy, changed my habits for her, catered to her every rule with the grandkids, tried to support her, make things easy for her, helped her both with the kids, her house, financially as well and it really made little difference.

Apologized for her dad's behavior (funny how he didn't have to apologize though, eh?). Apologized for anything I did that she didn't like. Pretty much changed who I was......the therapist at one point said I had the right idea but I was pretty much giving up myself trying to conform to that perfect mom.

I'm not saying some of it didn't work, temporarily. But in the long run, nope. So it's not worth it. Not worth being worried about everything she wants or needs, or letting her belittle me. Not worth being worried about being truthful, and forthcoming.

I'm learning now, finally, that the best thing is to outsmart. Lately, that has worked a bit. Being more upfront with what I need or expect. It's a work in progress because I've been a pushover too long. Lately I've got my husband working on my side now, because he knows if things don't improve , I'm walking.

I'm doing what needs to be done. I am cooperative but I am also defending myself, not taking any bullshit anymore.

The post was simply about how double standards are infuriating. But we'll see how it all goes with the religion stuff. I'm going to use that later if I need to. I won't defend her non -religious position if it ends up he takes to it.

I think you're in danger of being completely cut off by your daughter.
The more you post, the more you show how difficult you are!
Have you shown her this thread?
Or any of the others you've posted?

MarieElla

I think you're in danger of being completely cut off by your daughter.
The more you post, the more you show how difficult you are!
Have you shown her this thread?
Or any of the others you've posted?

Naw. I have been the most honest forthcoming person anyone could have as a mom, family member. But when people want to complain, want to control you, and are narcissistic in nature, they use the most innocent things you would not believe. I was a trusting fool. I'm done being that.

So no, not showing shit.

I won't be cut off. The irony is, she is not going to ever turn her back on her father. So I'm good, especially since he is retiring after this year, he'll be around more since his job takes him away for long periods. So he'll be wanting more time and that means I get more. This is gonna work out for me, I'm determined to make sure of it. Like I said, I'm done being a pushover. I have some plans for the future.

I do dream one day she'll realize her mistake about me, but then I stop myself and realize I may not trust her anymore even if that happened. I will always love her but in my heart I think I'm letting her not take space there anymore.

I won't be cut off.

That is not your decision to make.

Honestly, reading some of the posts on here, I wonder why people bother with families at all. I'm thankful that my parents emigrated to Australia shortly after I married. My children have moved abroad. The only contact we have is by e-mail, which makes life much simpler.

You don't know me.

But I am different than I was just a mere few years ago.

I have been thinking.....the way I was.......not being difficult, being mindful of myself , cooperative, loving, self sacrificing, caring , trying to not argue, be a peacemaker, be quite instead of complaining, trying to just ignore things and being honest for years and years didn't end up working, I realized that I should try something new.

Like be more self serving, less honest, less caring, less mindul of myself, less giving, less loving and perhaps, being a bit difficult, might work out better. Worth a shot.

I mean, to continue as I was and expect a different outcome....isn't that the definition of insanity? I won't repeat past mistakes.

Despite everything, my grandkids both still really enjoy us and want us around. They tell her , it seems anytime there is something going on. We have been doing some things to reconnect with my son in law and that's working. I really hate the girlfriend for what's she's done, but, I'm good at pushing my feelings aside when it's worth it, and the grands are worth it.

So my daughter will start losing control. She clearly already has with her ex, it's just the beginning.

I could have almost killed someone for her at one time, I was a very tribal mom. Not anymore, not the way she has decided to treat me and not care for me anymore. Her feelings seem to be all that counts. Well, mine do too now.

Allira

^I won't be cut off.^

That is not your decision to make.

She won't. I guarantee. There are several reasons I won't get into here.

mum2three

Honestly, reading some of the posts on here, I wonder why people bother with families at all. I'm thankful that my parents emigrated to Australia shortly after I married. My children have moved abroad. The only contact we have is by e-mail, which makes life much simpler.

Believe me, you are right. Give me a time machine and I'll stay single, raise some puppy dogs and call it a life. Much happier and calm.