Do I run for cover?

How would you like one of yours to live with her,

I would write an email addressed to your sister stating very clearly that you very much want to continue the relationship you have with her BUT you are not prepared to discuss your niece with her just in the same way that you do not discuss sister with niece. Add that you hope she will respect your point of view as you are feeling very harassed by her at the moment as are your children and you feel your own wellbeing is at risk.

You have to control this situation yourself and not allow your sister to control it. Be there for your niece as per norm. Re your sister you need to be very assertive and put boundaries in place ie. Tell her that you flatly refuse to discuss your niece with her, as being her mother, it’s down to her to try to repair their damaged relationship, not you. Your sister must be told it’s so wrong of her to drag your kids into it too. If she dosent respect your wishes, then you may have to sever all ties, knowing you’ve done all you can to help. Don’t allow yourself to be dragged along with your sisters unreasonable behaviour, it will drag you down. Maybe that’s why your niece stepped away ?

I am in a somewhat similar situation in that a family member has rejected our whole family apart from me and my daughter. I am sorry for you and everyone concerned. I don't think you should cut off your sister. Even if she is behaving badly.or has health problems that have helped to create this situation, I have no doubt she is in a lot of pain. You can listen to her and sympathize with her distress. But if she wants more than that, just keep saying that you can't help her or your niece resolve something that is between them. Stay calm when she is going on about it to you and try not to worry about it or distress yourself about it at other times.
I don't think you need to cut your niece off either. I imagine she doesn't want to discuss it with you. You could say to her too that you don't want to act as a go between between her and her mother other than letting her mother know, if she asks, that you have seen your niece and she is OK.

Hi InRainbows,
I'm sorry that your Rainbow ethos has run in to some dark clouds. It is apparent that your sister is imperatively demanding that you must become the intermediary between her and her daughter in the sad circumstance of whatever disfunction exists between the two of them. I would recommend that your disavow that role. It is not at all fair of your sister to pressure you in any way in this regard let alone in such a manner that it is disrupting your own mental health and precious sleep.
I would suggest that your sister needs to be told that while you love both her and your niece, the difficulties they are having will have to be resolved between the two of them. In these difficult and awkward circumstances, you simply cannot play the advocate for either party and it is unacceptable that your sister is trying to force you to do that on her behalf. Afterall, it's their dispute and problem, not yours!
In the interest of maintaining your loving relationship with both of them as best as that can possibly be done, it should be made clear to your sister that for the sake of your own mental health you simply can no longer tolerate or respond to her demanding inquiries about her daughter. At the same time also telling her that you love her and want to support and be there for her but you cannot and will not be a party to their dispute nor be a conduit of information about your niece's whereabouts or activities.
Wishing you luck in dealing with this obviously difficult situation.

Point out to your sister that you have apart from your niece other friends, relations and commitments that result in your not always being able to answer her phone calls or texts messages immediately.

I would add that she is being totally unreasonable in believing that you are with your niece every blinking time you do not answer one of her calls, and tell her to stop making such an ass of herself. My sister would have backed off if I had done so, but it is up to you to know how to deal with your sister.

Talk to niece to find out what caused her split with mother? I suspect your sister at some level is jealous of your relationship with her. Niece needs to be aware of what is going. Put it to her that you are worried about your sister and want to act for the best as you love them both but sisters demands are wearing you down and you are exploring all avenues to resolve or calm down the situation. Maybe approach your bro in law as well. What M0nica said really.

I feel for you. My sister is estranged from both her children and I sort of understand why although I am sure that there should have been a less extreme path through the mess. I have at times found my sister is extremely sensitive from any contact I may have with them. She is sure that I am bad mouthing her to them. In fact, I tried to maintain a balanced relationship where I do not discuss her in negative terms but may talk in her defence if I think there is unfairness on their part. Nowadays we don't really discuss my sister at all but talk about their lives. One of her children really misses the good things about their Mum but can't cope with the drama she brings with her. If I said that to my sister, she would be furious. She talks about their abusiveness, abandonment and hatred of her. In reality they have just tried to set boundaries, love her but not her behaviour and feel unable to reset the relationship to a happy one. It is terribly difficult. I don't envy you at all but I think you should attempt to set boundaries firmly and kindly to your sister but if that does not work, you will be finding out why her own child has backed off.

I’m with Welbeck on this, keep up with the niece and go low contact with your sister, explain to her if only in an email or letter if you cannot deal with her face to face that you are all adults and you are not taking sides, but the situation is stressing you. She needs to be told that she is the one that
needs to sort this out with her daughter not use you as a go between.

I am sorry you are put in this position with no fault of your own

Please choose and support the relationships that are healthy and respectful for you, despite the dna links involved.

SpinDriftCoastal I think the OP is concerned about her sister but just needs this to stop.

Tell your niece to contact you when she wants. Don't get involved in a 'she said', 'he said'. Tell your sister to back off with: 'Please stop sending me endless messages'. Focus on your own life and family. You need to be independent of all of this and perhaps you can see why your niece has estranged her mother as she is very domineering. Look after yourself. I had an aunt and cousins like this and they thrived in a toxic soup of estrangement. They are all long gone now and their toxicity was a complete waste of time. I sent a strongly worded text to my cousin to say that I would net get involved in her toxic little plots. Never heard from her again.

Have you talked to your niece about how this and how it is affecting you?

I didn't read the situation like that at all, Allsorts.
I think the difficulties presented by her sister are just exhausting and harrowing.

InRainbows, Do you have a daughter? I get the impression you want your niece more than your sister, this will backfire.

Your sister is her mum so I can understand that she wants to know how her daughter is going. It is biology, the mother- daughter tie however much and however badly she has behaved. I actually feel really sorry for her. It’s a shame that you are sitting in the middle and hard for you because you don’t want to betray the trust of your niece. Stay neutral is all I could say.

I second going low contact with your sister - but this is due to her behaviour.

I agree that everyone involved is an adult. This means your relationship with your niece is, quite frankly, none of your sister's business.

You may have to, at least, implement a firm boundary with her that your niece is not a topic for discussion. If she brings it up, you warn her that either she drops it or the conversation is over - and follow through on that if she continues.

I think (as M0nica said) that you should try to gently have a word with your brother-in-law who is no doubt going through a sort of hell here.

I think your sister is probably unwell. Maybe she was unwell before (and maybe this has contributed to the estrangement) or maybe not...
Can he encourage her to see a doctor and access some counselling?

I would not cut off my niece.

Your sister sounds to be highly manipulative and domineering.
Maybe why her daughter has had enough.
I'd go low contact with your sister and just ignore any demands or comments re your niece.
Just step back.
You don't have to dance to her tune.

I'm looking at this problem from the other side of the fence, so to speak. We have two estranged children and one not. We know that our two EAC are in contact with our non-estranged son and also with my brother and sister and their children. The way I look at it is that everyone in the family is an adult now, so it's entirely their business who they choose to have relationships with.

My wife thinks differently. She thinks I should speak to my sister about it. I am totally not going to speak to my sister about it because it's none of my business.

Applying this thinking to your situation, it seems to me that your sister is in the wrong by chasing everyone obsessively and it would therefore be unfair to punish your niece by saying that you cannot continue your relationship with her because of the effect it's having on her mum.

So I would be in favour of you continuing your relationship with your niece but trying to help your sister come to terms with what has happened and act more normally in a way which doesn't wind everyone up. For example, would your sister be up for reading a book about the dos and don'ts of managing an estrangement, or seeing a therapist with some knowledge of estrangement? It sounds like your sister is in danger of alienating her entire family if she doesn't change her behaviour.

I think Allsorts is right InRainbows. As an EP, I don't know how I would cope knowing that my sister if I had one, was seeing my D on a regular basis.

I'm sure I'm not alone in thinking that I would be OK with this and would want to be, only to find that the realisation is far harder than I could have imagined.

I don't think you should block her, that would be cruel and only add to the pain and distress she's experiencing due to the separation from her D.

Maybe it would be easier to have a sensible discussion with your niece who it appears from your post, is dealing with the estrangement better than your sister and explain, if this is how you feel, that for the time being you feel that you cannot continue your relationship because of the effect it's having on her mum.

I do not think you can have both I think that at least for the time being Allsorts is right. You say you don't want your sister to be alone with her husband and if you block her not only will she be, but the torment of knowing you're seeing her D will only increase.

She resents your relationship with her daughter, it should be her but isn't. I can understand her feelings however wrong they are. I do not think you can have both.

I'd let your sister know her daughter is safe and you can't discuss things as it's her daughter's wishes.

Not sure I would do that.

I would want to continue relationship with sister if I could.

March

I'd let your sister know her daughter is safe and you can't discuss things as it's her daughter's wishes.

I think her behaviour explains why she's turned to you.

Yes!

Well said March.