Stop blaming Pensioners

I don’t think there is Callistemon but I’m not sure of that. Maybe someone else knows definitely.
I agree with Doodledog and Monica that many people would not be capable of continuing to work up to their 70s and what’s more, I think it unreasonable and unkind to expect them to do so. People pay NI for their state pension, which is not enough to live on anyway, and when they have paid for many years, they are entitled to not be forced to work until they drop.

annesixty, that is a very sweeping statement and, dare I suggest based on a stereotypical idea of what someone of 70 is like.

if they are still te\ching/doctoring at that age, they will be fit and healthy and will have kept up with all modern developments in their field, They may well be far better at their job than some of their younger colleagues (said with a lot of feeling)

Doodledog Of course you are right that not everyone is falling apart at 70-90, but not falling apart is not reason enough to be denied the pension you've paid for all your life*, and anyway, nobody is implying that that is the case. What people are saying is that some people, particularly those who have worked in manual jobs, or those who have conditions such as arthritis are physically unsuited to working well into old age. In less physically demanding jobs there are stresses, and keeping up with changes in technology can be difficult for some.

*And yes, I know there is no 'pot', but the fact remains that people have paid NI on the understanding that they would get a pension at 60, and it's already been raised to 66/7. I don't think it is at all unreasonable for people to expect the government to honour its promises. We are all different, so there is nothing stopping those who want to carry on working to do so. That shouldn't mean that we all have to though.

Fair enough. The rules changed- the age became longer to collect. I know that may annoy some people. I understand,

Inarticulately, I've been attempting to point at a solution to: people living longer - more people taking out - less people 'putting in' (I do know there is no pot..

I give up.

Perhaps everyone has their children, if not themselves, prepared for what appears could happen. Save, save, save for ones own retirement!

Longer to collect means older to collect, obviously

I think annsixty makes good points.

It really isn't fair that someone in a physically demanding job should be expected to work when it is taking a toll on them.

Some GPs and nurse practitioners really have not kept up-to-date with the latest medical findings and patients may suffer (or even die) as a result.

Save, save, save for ones own retirement!

And if someone is living hand-to-mouth, how can they be expected to do that?

I’m not convinced annsixty can be dismissed so readily. There aren’t many demanding jobs that can be safely and competently carried out on a full time basis by people in their seventies. Even those who are in reasonable health don’t have the energy or staying power they had at 60

Perhaps everyone has their children, if not themselves, prepared for what appears could happen. Save, save, save for ones own retirement!

Yes, which is why some younger people resent the older generation. They are having to pay into a scheme that they don't see as benefiting them, and it probably won't.

In their eyes, 'boomers' (they don't know enough to differentiate between the very different deals the early and later ones have had) didn't work, got pensions at 60 and have made a lot of money on houses just for living in them, when they can't afford housing and will probably have to work until they are 70. There are no council houses now, as 'boomers' bought them at huge discounts and some young people are paying high rent to those who bought them cheaply.

They are right in some ways, but of course it's not as simple as that. As I said, they will benefit from the social mobility their parents had, and of course not all 'boomers' did well. Later ones had few of the opportunities that the earlier ones did (MIRAS, grammar schools, cheap house prices etc), and house prices in some parts of the country obviously rose massively more than in others.

Plus, whatever our age or generation, we all live different lives. They are being far too simplistic and generalising wildly.

Callistemon21

^Save, save, save for ones own retirement^!

And if someone is living hand-to-mouth, how can they be expected to do that?

I have no solution other than to cut back and save, teach our children cut back. I think, for all the reasons, not just inter-generational squabbling, the pension system, as it is, yields worry.

Likely I'm an alarmist worrier...

Cutting back when someone lives hand-to-mouth is not possible.

Callistemon21

Cutting back when someone lives hand-to-mouth is not possible.

Yes, and if people haven't been able to afford to pay into a pension they won't be able to save either.

iam64 Who said anything about people necessarily working full time at 70?. It may be possible to retire flexibly working part time and drawing some pension but not all.

At 70 DH was still travelling around Europe and spending time standing on cold quaysides for hours and then bucketing around offshore in supply boats. At 80 and a heart bypass later, he is still doing office work checking engineering calculations and advising on solutions to tricky problems offshore.

Well as people have said, that suits some, but it isn't for everyone. There is an option for anyone to defer their pension, but I wouldn't want to see it become the expectation that people do so. There are far too many variables, and in many cases it would be cruel to expect people to choose between working into older age and missing out on a full pension. It would lead to even more of a gap between those in physical jobs and those who are not.

It's difficult enough to persuade younger retirees to volunteer for charity work without expecting people to work into their 70s.

Many of the fundraisers DH volunteers with are in their 80s, one gave up at 92 and very few people in their 60s are coming forward now.

Retired people are the mainstay of the charity voluntary sector.

I think alater pension age will have to come with a flexible pension start date.

It will need to be possible to grant people medical/fitness early retirements.

I should point out that I posted that “I” would not be happy having much older people teaching and practicing medicine.
That is still my personal opinion .

It irritates me when so called gold plated pensions are mentioned. I paid £150 a month to my NHS pensio for 21 years. Now retired I receive £535 a month, hardly a princely sum, but I’m so glad I paid into it as it subsidises my state pension which I also paid into via NI contributions from the age of 16. I am now 68. I do sympathise with the youngsters today, particularly with the price of housing, speaking of which our small terrace house had virtually to be re built!

Quite a lot of 'silly billies' on MN as Denis Healey might have said. Worth ignoring moans about pensioners and Winter Fuel, Brexit, etc.