Privatisation through the backdoor?

I am totally against privatising the NHS. Any company that has its focus on making money is not going to put patients first. They will cherry pick the easier non-expensive patients and leave the long term sick to a second rate underfunded NHS. We haven't the funds to treat everyone adequately as it is, why would we pour more money into profit for private companies?

I have personal experience of this, reluctantly taking on a job to manage the sexual health services for London on behalf of a private consortium now gone out of business. Their knowledge of how to run a health service was abysmal, their ignorance was terrifying.

It’s very wrong but it’s been going on for many years in the NHS sadly. Private companies were snapping up non-urgent Ambulance contracts in London hospitals up to 15 yrs ago it started before I retired and their staff were seriously lacking in training and despite complaints and protests it’s spread throughout the services nowadays all non-urgent work is done by privates and the LOndon Ambulance Service use them also when they are over stretched.
Not good, profit before patients can’t be right.

I don't have an automatic dislike of it - so long as it works better and is well regulated.

Quite shocked to read this urmstongran, will look at the article.
Health is devolved here in Wales. Dil is a hospital doctor and she sees more privatisation as inevitable if the NHS is to survive. It must be well regulated though.

Our GP admin made an appointment to see a London consultant on the phone. However when the secretary phoned to discuss turns out that this was a private appointment. So, NHS staff, using NHS equipment and time, make private appointments? Go figure. The NHS is a cash cow for a lot of people and organisations.

Many people jump in and out of the systems- jumping queues but then having their operation via NHS. Many Consultants work for both private and NHS, and deliberately keep thei NHS waiting list massive- but then say 'ah but I can do it privately next week for £££'.

etc, etc - could write a book ...

kitty - I am afraid it does not work well and the regulation is a joke. It is political dogma writ large.

Ever noticed these private hospitals don’t have A&E departments - no they leave the messy work to the NHS it seems!

There's been cases of private hospitals performing operations and when complications arise delivering the patient to an NHS A&E department, without patient notes.

This sounds unbelievable, but as an ex NHS campaigner I know it to be true.

Richard Branson & Virgin Health have sued NHS England for huge sums when a contract bid was unsuccessful, and won, costing us huge amounts.

I've no time for RB or any other private medical treatment and find making profits out of people's illnesses unconscionable.

Theresa May's husband allegedly owns a large private ambulance service which is now very well known, certainly in London and has mopped up many of the non emergency contracts mentioned by tanith.

It's no bad thing and should be a means-tested programme.

Medicare works in Australia.

There'd be far less time-wasters ! Easing up our NHS.
Privatisation has got to come sooner or later if we wish to keep surgeries and hospitals going because right now it's not working even with the millions that are getting poured into these services.

well Branson/Virgin has made an absolute arse of running GP surgeries in Essex, so bad that it even made the main news. He has a record of legal action when he doesn't get the contracts he thinks he should get/loses them; Virgin trains being the best known example. Ellenvannin although I know I will likely disagree with your simplistic approach to healthcare, just what do you mean by 'time wasters' and 'means tested'?

GILLT57------time-wasters of which I saw plenty while working in the NHS. Violent drunks in A&E where it took nearly their quota of staff to calm them down when someone with a heart condition, already distressed had to see/listen to what was going on.
Ambulance call-outs for cut fingers ( not the finger hanging off ) and again, callouts for drunks and many more needless calls.

It would do people like you some good to spend a weekend in an A&E department---it's no picnic for the staff who have to deal with these " time-wasters ". They're there to tend to genuinely sick people----for which the staff do so remarkably well.

As for means-testing, why not ? Shouldn't those who CAN afford to pay for treatment, do so ? We treat millionaires for free !

Urmstongran -Ever noticed these private hospitals don’t have A&E departments - no they leave the messy work to the NHS it seems!

Exactly! ... and they don't have intensive care either. They want the high profit routine procedures where you can make big profits.

Had a friend that had a routine gallbladder operation in a private hospital. However in the middle of the night he started to hemorrhage. Turned out that the private hospital and no night doctors and no facilities for intensive care! So the night nurse merely dialed 999 and handed him over to the NHS to deal with the complications of the private operation.

Not all consultants are like that jura2 - one I know tells some of his wealthy patients not to bother with going private as the cancer treatment will be identical and in effect they will just be paying for a private room. Obviously some still choose to go private just for the room but at least he tells them the truth when that is the case.
Also there are some private hospitals with A&E - we used to use one in South Manchester a few years ago to save queuing in the NHS one.

If we had a Medicare system such as Australia it would also free-up our surgeries and GP's wouldn't be so rushed off their feet dealing with 7minute consultations. Aussie GP's are far more laid-back so therefore can give you the time needed unlike our own GP's.

In my youth, I spent 3-4 days with London's emergency ambulance service. I thought I would be watching them work on road traffic accidents, going to patients who had had a heart attack, fallen downstairs and broken limbs but no, we went to see people who had a headache but did not happen to have Panadol. A pinprick of a cut finger, drunks in the street and so on. We ended up acting more like social workers and I felt heart sorry for the ambulance staff
because it was not what they had signed up for. Some people also thought the ambulance was a free taxi service. Unbelievable,

Yes Charleygirl5, I worked in A&E------enough said !

I haven't worked in the NHS but I have sat in A&E Departments where a policeman has to stay with a drunk who is causing chaos for the nursing staff or is being abusive. Meanwhile, a lot of the people waiting are laughing and chatting before complaining of the wait. I'd really like to see different units dealing with those that have taken drink or drugs and a much better triage service for those who have minor complaints. Mind you, we now have to wait so long for Dr's appointments that it is hardly surprising A&E are packed. I remember the days when you could see your Dr on a Saturday morning or later in the evenings. I think a return to that system would free up A&E.

Ellanvannin don't like your tone, what do you mean by 'people like you'. ? You have no idea what I do for a living, where I spend my time, what my exposure is to A & E so wind your neck in. The emergency services do not attend for cut fingers or hand out paracetemol by ambulance, this is an urban myth, the calls are handled, dealt with appropriately and advice given. Be thankful that your local surgery is not run by Virgin Health then you would have cause for complaint.

Don't you tell me to wind my neck in ! It's you with a chip on your shoulder, not me !
It's no " urban myth " that NHS staff have to deal with obnoxious people that there has to be security officers guarding some hospitals----why do you think that ?

I have paid for treatment abroad and been damn glad of it at the time too------the same as I'd be glad to pay the NHS if I ever needed them URGENTLY !!

All of our GPs run private practices since day 1 of our NHS.

What concerns me is the waste of 250,000 women not showing up for their cancer screening appointments.

What do the NHS radiologists do instead?