Father's widow lying about the existence of a will

Oh dear, how often have I heard this? It has even happened to my own husband. The problem is that there are many ways round a will. The most tried and tested being putting it on the fire. I don't always think solicitors are safe either. In my husbands case , the solicitor concerned lost the will when they were taken over by another firm!

Re marriage is a big issue. In my husbands case he eventually got a couple of thousand pounds. The house in the will belonged to his aunt and was not transferred to his uncle on her death but he re married and the new wife left all to her grandchild...…. the problem was my husband had loaned his aunt £11,000 to buy the house and had not had it back but was left a portion of the house in her will instead.

The will was lost and the new wife's solicitor actually transferred the house to her possession, by some move or other..... his uncle had never filed for his wife's death either as an intestacy or with a will. IN his own will, he was silent on the house.

But oh what a web!

Intestacy is no guarantee either but in some ways better as no one messes with the government rules. Having said that though, many a relative pops into a house and takes off with belongings and money and many other things. I have been on the end of that.

I am jaded about wills. I have no will. The law will suffice in my case. I have no family I want to see get anything . If I am dead before OH then he can have the lot and he can decide ( and I keep a lot of it in joint names for that reason). If I am left, I may well have to make different arrangements.

But a will is no guarantee of anything. Its nothing more than a list of wishes. People often ignore wish lists unfortunately.

A mirror will is an old fashioned style of will that was almost like a bogof offer. It meant that instead of drafting complex trusts, a single simple will could be drawn up and there would be a near identical version for the spouse.
They’re actually a BAD IDEA for second marriages, in particular.
Unfortunately, it’s assumed that the surviving spouse will follow the wishes of the deceased spouse but there is nothing in law that can compel them to do so, once they have inherited. If the spouse decides to give everything away to the local cat charity, there is nothing you can legally do to stop them.
The only way to ensure that your children will inherit is to set up a trust instrument.
That’s why it makes sense to get a wills & trusts specialist solicitor to draw up your will.
Especially in Ireland where I’ve met some disastrous solicitors, who really should have been struck off for their disgraceful incompetence.

Lots of the anger in these situations is directed at the second or final spouse or partner who is seen to benefit at the expense of the deceased person's own children. However responsibility really lies with the deceased person who either didn't make a valid will that reflected their wishes regarding their biological children or actually chose to leave the estate to the surviving spouse and their family by a directive in the will or as the result of a default distribution such as occurs when a person dies without a valid will. It may be easier to blame the beneficiary rather than face the often hurtful reality of the actions or inaction of the deceased person.

I believe that often the fundamental issue is people's fear of dying and a refusal to face and deal with the associated issues. Or sometimes people just couldn't be bothered or procrastinated until it was too late. As someone who spent years sorting out the mess my own father left I vowed I would never subject my own children to such a situation. I can sympathise with those who feel aggrieved and forgotten and some may have redress in the law but most won't have that option and as several posters have said they were relieved of a lot of money along the way.

I can only urge all Grans to make sure you have a valid will and store the original with a lawyer, not at home or with family members. Do not make a "do it yourself" will. It's a false economy. Make sure information is left providing the location of the will with your personal papers. Ideally all beneficiaries should know in advance what the will directs but there may be situations where this is not possible or advisable. A properly drawn up will is the only way to be confident that your estate will be distributed as you want it to be - whatever that may be. Just do it!

You need to go and see a good solicitor.

OK, thought I'd update you all, thank you for your replies.

I have spoken to the solicitor and the will has been revoked as they married after he made it . So it appears she wan't lying ( I'll have to go to confession now) My siblings and I are now entitled to a third of the estate. I am now in the process of obtaining a copy of the Letter of Grant of Administration so we we can find out what the estate is worth and who her solicitors are. I still don't think it's going to be easy. I'd rather we didn't go down the legal route but I doubt there's any other way. She has ignored us all for 12 months. Thanks again for your help.

I want to echo Craicons points above about trust arrangements for children.

I am not currently practising, but you can bet your behind I had a trusted colleague draw up our wills and trusts for the children.

Yes, it costs a few hundred pounds upfront, but you have peace of mind that should anything happen, you have protected the position of people close to you.

You cannot rely on anyone “honouring” the intention of the deceased when it comes to money. There is a reason so many family feuds have a disputed inheritance at the bottom of them.

We had a friend of my MIL who made a will and left a copy with a local solicitor leaving everything to my MIL or my husband as he had fallen out with his family years ago. When my MIL died suddenly of cancer, although my DH tried to be helpful to her friend, he was somewhat of a recluse and so, struggling with his own grief, DH backed off. One day, within a year of his Mum's death, he suddenly noticed the house was for sale so I went to the Estate Agent to ask which home the gentleman was in. That was when we found he had apparently died intestate, The Crown's Solicitor had put it on the Intestacy List and one these Heir Hunters had tracked down his supposed list. Nobody had contacted the solicitors in our small town and it turned one of them had the will. I was staggered to find that it is not incumbent on the authorities to check more thoroughly. Even the neighbours they'd checked with had explained they were new to the area but the rest of the street were long standing residents who knew each other well. Had they asked at any other house, they would have found that the Gentleman definitely had a will and would have known the solicitor too. Instead, they had heirs who weren't really heirs so felt they'd been fleeced and the real heir who knew that there were 'treasures' that were definitely missing by the time he knew about it. I think you should be required to register a will at a central place in order for it to be valid and have to go through a process to ensure you remove it if you change your mind.

I've ensured that if I die before DH, my half of the house and my assets are in trust for AC. If DH were to inherit all of my assets on my death, these would then be part of his estate, and be used for his care, which he would require if I wasn't here. I accept that his own assets will be needed for his care, but hate the thought that mine would be used too.

I thought you could have wills registered with the Probate office or something like that? I am about to do a DIY will ( divorced years ago, three adult children to inherit equally, no other bequests so very simple) ne I found a reference to some gvt office in Manchester where I can have the will registered and possibly stored. I have not looked into it further yet but will do soon. Has anyone else heard of this?

There is no law that anyone has to register a will. No doubt many people's estates are treated as if they died intestate, but they didn't. My sister wrote her will on the back page of a book, in the last week of her life, and gave it to me to keep safe. I could have simply destroyed it if I'd wanted to, and nobody would have been the wiser.

I am so pleased that your inheritance problem has been resolved but I do wish that ALL second wives and husbands are not constantly branded as lying gold diggers, it’s simply not true.

There are some greedy and malicious people around, including SOME second wives and husbands, AND certainly including some adult children, step or otherwise. Many second wives have been treated very badly by their ‘step’ relations including adult children, aunts, uncles and others.

People need to face up to the prospect of dying, leave a proper will or whatever legal instrument they decide on and stop hiding their head in the sand.

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Good luck with this one. In the late 1990s when my father died my then separated stepmother contested the will. It spent nearly a year back and forth with solicitors as she tried to get the will overturned as it was in my son's favour. In the end she only settled out of court when I threatened High Court regardless of cost. In fact no one would have got anything but by that stage I wanted it over to properly grieve. I probably made wrong decisions. But do take solicitor's advice.

kathy in your shoes I would be worried about her trying to get rid of as much of the estate as possible to convince you it’s not worth pursuing.

She owes you a third of his estate at the date of his death regardless of how much of it she’s spent or given away since then.

Get more legal advice on the costs of pursuing this and decide if the third of the estate is worth more than the legal costs.

Good luck.

When my husband and I made our wills at the solicitors, they were printed out ...given to us to proof read and check all was correct then two members of staff witnessed them. We were each given a copy of our own wills in sealed envelopes to keep and told they kept copies themselves but lodged the originals with the London Probate office. I thought this was the norm having never made a will before.

People need to face up to the prospect of dying, leave a proper will or whatever legal instrument they decide on and stop hiding their head in the sand

Is it really facing up to the problem of dying that causes these issue ? In my own case I am aware of my mortality and it doesn't concern me that much. However, the reason I do not write a will ( aside of all the waste of times I have seen wills ignored) is that I don't want face up to "living" or rather all the problems writing any will by definition may bring with it - in other words, all the arguments and nasty words and actions that will ensue from anything I do that does not please everyone else!

That's the real problem. I don't want to spend my life having had words with those who don't like what I have decided to do because it doesn't suit them.

Wills are entirely confidential Abbey unless you choose to disclose their content. So I don’t understand your post.

Wills are never entirely confidential. People have to be told that they are written and people have to witness them. Executors have to be appointed and somewhere in all that then information leaks out.

Then those who do not like it complain or become bitter and nasty.

Your executors don’t need to be made aware of the contents of your will, at least in Scotland.

I am the executor for a number of relatives, and I have no idea of the contents of any of their wills.

I will carry out those duties to the letter, nevertheless.

Your solicitor and their staff may witness the wills.

Whenever wills come up I think of Lynda Bellingham, (the OXO advert lady). She had teenage sons she adored but married for the second time. She died not many years later leaving everything to her husband as she said she trusted him to look after the boys.
There has been acrimony ever since.

Abbey Your signature on your will can be witnessed by people in the solicitor's office when you go there to sign it. They are accustomed to dealing confidentially with clients' affairs. They will not gossip even about the fact that you have just signed, let alone what is in the will. They don't know what is in it anyway, only the solicitor who drew it up will know that, and if he/she gossips about it they should be struck off. Leave a note somewhere that it will be found, saying that the will is lodged with the solicitor and give contact details. It won't be read until after you have gone through the pearly gates, so if they want to make a fight of it, they can do it without you. You won't care by then.

Executors do not always follow the instructions in a will either. I have had experience of that too. As I said earlier, essentially a will is nothing more than a final wish list.

Yes, I agree kathyd, a lot of acrimony seems to result from wills and they get contested and all manner of things.

It depends on the individuals involved, like everything else. Some people would dispute it if they got the best palace in heaven, they would want a holiday villa in hell as well.

My parents used a will kit it was a complete disaster,my brother was a trustee and took everything.So please everyone make a will and TELL everyone you have made one,where it is,solicitors name etc.

My siblings and I never expected a penny as his wife was many years younger than him with AC and GC of her own. The only reason we enquired was because she won't answer any of our calls and messages, generally avoiding us. This made us suspicious but it seems we're better off now. All we ever wanted were some momentos/personal effects.

Over the years I have had this happen. We made a will and after 10 years we went back to the solicitor to change it. They had no trace of our will even though we had the receipt to prove we had made a will with them. They just said no worry just make a new one.

An elderly man neighbour who we looked after, after his wife died told us that he had left us £5000 in his will. For 5 years we had done his shopping for him looked after his garden took him to hospital appointments and looked after him in general cooking him a daily meal all for no payment. Then out of the blue he had his house painted the painter was working on his house for 3 weeks. Two years after his house was painted he died leaving his house and money £4092000 to.....you’ve guessed the man who painted his house!!!! Whom he never knew before he painted his house. Nothing to his sisters or anyone else. One of his sisters tried to contest the will and lost £2500 in legal fees.