We should think of Jo at the ballot box

Wilma, this thread wasn't started until yesterday morning.
As it happens, I agree with you about immigration being seen to be the most important point.

Just seen on the news that Boris Johnson is saying he is pro immigration. His dad is on another rostrum saying people should vote to stay in. Fun when they meet.

Apologies, I didn't know about the agreed moratorium on discussing the referendum.

Absolute rubbish. I was moaning on about it that morning. The mans a charlatan and totally lacks any integrity.

He's now saying that if Jo Cox hadn't been killed, there wouldn't have been such a fuss about his poster. The man is sick.

Many people are just not listening to reason. The migrants have always tended to congregate in certain areas and the people living there think the whole of the UK is the same - which it clearly is not. I agree with what you are saying Grand D but how the perception can be changed is a difficult one.
The payment of benefits is up to the UK Govt also and could have been tailored not to include people till they had contributed for a certain amount of time but the EU gets blamed again.
Just keep repeating what YOU want people to believe - say it enough times and many people think you must be right - Farage has been doing that for years and just not been questioned enough about his statements.

If it is about immigration why the lies? @vote_leave are blaming the EU for UK migrant problem which is sheer ludicrous. For the latest migration figures clearly show that more migrant come from outside the EU than from within the EU.

The likes of Boris and other Tory MP's have done very little to resolve that issue, instead they constantly harp and point in the direction of the EU for their own failures.

It is time for less double talk and more truth.

Reading even some of the latest comments on these pages, far too many believe the majority of migrants are from the EU, which highlights the affect of brain washing propaganda from the RW media & UKIP. Or is it we are becoming far more gullible?

In my opinion if we vote out we are idiots - please note in my opinion

Immigration issues based on a post-Brexit myth. We must look such idiots to the RoW.

I agree Wilma, it has become all about immigration , this has boosted the Brexist campaign

Like it or not, this referendum has become about immigration, with the Leave campaign perceived as against immigration. That's the bottom line. Posters can voice their opinions about their reasons for voting in or out, but history will show this event as being predominantly about immigration.

I also cast my vote a few weeks ago, but immigration wasn't even in the top 3 reasons for my voting decision.

I'd like to know that too, dj, because I've never seen anybody posting far left views on GN.

In any case the right and left labels don't fit comfortably any more.

Traditionally, the right would have been the bosses and the wealthy. The left would have been the working classes, the poor and those who believed in socialism for ideological reasons.

Over the last few years, the splits have been more complex. A consistent theme of many supporting Leave is criticism of the élite (left and right wing) in Brussels, although it baffles me how people think Westminster is less élite. People with those views would historically have been labelled left-wing, but increasingly they are adopting right-wing viewpoints and, in some cases, tactics which have been used by extreme right-wingers in the past. It's no wonder Nazism has been mentioned, because that was exactly their appeal - manipulated and fuelled by people with extreme right wing social views.

It's all very confusing and other people have written more eloquently than I could about the phenomenon. I'll leave people to Google.

People are very passionate whichever way they feel the vote should go - that is good because for a long time many people have been disinterested in politics and compared with this vote it didn't matter too much as after a maximum of five years there would be another election.
I just hope that whatever way it goes it proves to be a good way or we are stuffed. - there will be no second chance.
There will be a lot of sorting out to do either way - I assume Cameron will need to look at both his own position and also of those in his cabinet. Not an easy task at all.

I'd like to know who people think are the far left on GN.
I read lots of stuff criticising those on the far left, particularly from posters like practical and obieone, but there is nobody on here I consider to be far left.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/jun/17/mainstream-politicians-clueless-on-how-to-deal-with-migration-debate-says-jo-coxs-husband

An article from Jo Cox's husband about immigration.
Please read it.

Just to upset some I am posting my thought on two threads also. Why not there is a repetition by so many posters.

Hate does not belong to any one political party. Hate does not predominantly belong to the far right nor the far left.

Hate belongs to ' the individual ' but when collectively
there is a joining of like minded ' individuals ' who display hate it is corrosive and easy to observe.

Apologies for the typo's, I had invited my 12 year old granddaughter to write a few words to which I intended to add a few more comments. I had not realised she had posted it, but I am proud of her words.

Can I ask all to take account of the words of God before voting simply
" Love thy Neighbour"

get round those tables and fight hard for changes for a better EU from inside, instead of continuous snipping from outside.
Sorry,but nearly half the population can't negotiate a happy family life,let alone unite the country.
Greed is the problem today,pure GREED.In or out,it's mostly nothing to do with race,almost everyone is racist to some degree.theres bound to be something you can't like about some people,human nature.Its when you hate a whole group that's the real problem,(like Hitler) not many people like that.So don't keep pulling the racist card,it's unfair and untrue.
People need to learn to appreciate the simple things in life,Yes,we could all get on together,but tolerance,patience,good Manners,thoughtfulness,kindness,all missing from at least half of the population,they can't even get on with their own families,so who are they to preach to me.

That has worked so well for the last 50 years Granddaughter[Lets give Britain a stronger voice in Europe]
Part of my reason for voting OUT

Britain has such a weak voice in Europe. Barely a whisper.

Let's give Britain a stronger voice in Europe where we can fight for improved changes. Other wise we are going to spit the Nation by intolerence, fear and more hatred.

We need to make changes the British way is round the table rather than on the sidelines snipping

Eleothan, just read the beginning of your post, will not read the rest.

I said - I, not we or all but - I would have felt aligned , seems some can express their opinions and feelings but not all , I stand by what I said - I as in me Annie would have felt aligned , I did not say anyone who voted with Brexit should feel this way, just how - I would have felt, how dare you and others attack me for expressing my own feelings on this murder . I named no one , how nasty some are here

A special plea to all of us, let's defeat the intolerance , hatred,stories that has developed in our socity. Let's return to a more compassionale, loving a constructive Britain. Reject the divisions created by Mr Farage vision and get round those tables and fight hard for changes for a better EU from inside, instead of continuous snipping from outside.

Parts of the EU do suffer from the migrants - rural France had many Romanians - thefts etc did rise as usually it is a very safe crime free area - but it is the gipsy section of their society which was causing the problems. It does seem to have settled down again now - people are much more aware. But of course the great majority of the EU does not have a stretch of water to give some protection. It is the traffickers which should be targeted and given really heft prison sentences. Many of the illegal migrants to the UK are helped by UK traffickers.
Michael Gove could sort the UK out ? - he has managed to ruin the Education system and is fast doing the same to the Justice system so to give him a free hand with the rest of the country will really let him finish the UK off!!!
As much as I have never agreed with much Cameron and George have said I would go for them over Boris, Farage, Gove and IDS. The agreement about leaving the EU will have nothing to do with any of them - the UK will be TOLD what the terms will be by the other EU countries and there could well be a penalty to pay.

I have voted Leave by post.

I worry about the number of migrants who come to these shores. Of course we need migrants to fill the many jobs they take here such as in the NHS. It is the NUMBER of migrants that should IMO be restricted.

I have my niece staying with me on holiday, she is half Italian half English. She says the small town she lives in in Northern Italy is inundated with migrants who beg all around the town. They are nervous of the migrants who surround their home and have to keep the burglar alarm on night and day as they fear a break in.

I hope that Michael Gove becomes Prime Minister and sorts out the new look Britain.

I agree with a lot of what you say, Eloethan, but there are a few comments on here which I find offensive. I will not name names, but some who are on the Brexit side are particularly nasty. Singling Annie out is not fair.

I wonder if there is anyone who has already voted who wishes they had not been so hasty.

Anniebach I have just read this thread and I have to say that I find your comment "Thank God I didn't vote Brexit. I would have to accept I was of the same mindset as the Britain First movement" a sweeping and insulting generalisation.

Whilst I think it is true that there is certainly a very unpleasant whiff of racism in the Vote Leave campaign, to suggest that everyone who votes Leave is a racist and is in some way a supporter of a vile group like Britain First is absolutely untrue.

I have agonised over the referendum vote and finally decided to vote Remain. It was not an easy decision and I am still unsure as to whether it was the right one.

My husband voted to leave and I can assure you he is not a racist. John Rees, one of the original founders of the People's Assembly and the Stop the War Coalition, wrote an article in which he said:

"... the dominant voices on both the Remain and Leave side are right wing or Tory. Both sides contain much racist argument, the predominant voices are pro-market.

"So the real differences only emerge if we examine the social forces behind the two camps.

"On the Remain side stand the main institutions of British and international capital: US imperialism, NATO, the G7 group of industrialised countries, the Bank of England, the overwhelming majority of large UK corporations, the majority of the Tory cabinet, the Financial Times, the Economist and the Guardian.

"The right wing forces on the Leave side comprise about half of smaller UK businesses, a minority of the Tory cabinet and about half of Tory MPs, UKIP, and the Murdoch and tabloid press.

"... Nigel Farage, and possibly Boris Johnson are verbally and in policy terms extreme opponents of migrants and refugees.

"But so are Cameron and Theresa May. May is running Prevent, one of the most racist government programmes ever to become law .... detention camps are EU policy now .... the "bodies for money" deal with Turkey is happening right now."

The very people that you have criticised in the past - the Blairites and those who have done everything to undermine Jeremy Corbyn - are the most committed pro-EU people.

My own feeling, however, was that the vision of those on the radical left who believe that leaving the EU will provide an opportunity to challenge the current neo-liberal/austerity agenda and create a fairer Britain, is an unrealistic one. Should Leave succeed, it will be the likes of Farage, Johnson, Duncan-Smith, etc. etc., who will set the agenda. Their track record does not suggest a desire to maintain or enhance policies that protect workers' rights, our public services or the environment.

Jalima, it didn't become ilegal until 1964 , the sixties was quite a decade, the racial equality law, abortion made legal,homosexuality laws, I feel quite exhausted thinking about the energy I had then, a strange decade, JF.K. Bobby Kennedy. Dr King, Malcom X assassinated