Government watch

www.gq-magazine.co.uk/article/soft-brexit

Just read this - sort of follows on!

OBR has warned that Britains fiscal position is in too precarious a position to withstand another economic down turn.

Brexit down down will send national debt soaring.

UK consumers are suffering a sustained fall in living standards as real pay fell again in the 3 months to May, piling more pressure on cash strapped households.

ONS has calculated that U.K. Employees are earning £15 a week less than in March 2008.

It's interesting that there are more people in employment though - 74.9%, the highest since comparable records began in 1971. Think that's from the same report.

I'm happy to take a little less in my pay packet if it gives someone else a job.

www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/employmentandemployeetypes/bulletins/uklabourmarket/latest

Do those jobs include people on zero hours contracts, though? People who would struggle to get a mortgage so have to pay extortionate rates to rent homes from rich landlords??

Unclear how the level of employment affects the fall in living standards. And no that is not the same report.

Tagan2 probably best to read through the report if you're interested in specific details.

WW which report did you use from the ONS?

I can't deal with anyone that accuses me of lying primrose

the highest since comparable records began in 1971

1971 - that would be when the school leaving age was 15 then. In the last two years it has gone up, first to 17 and this last year to 18. I rather think that would make some difference. Add that to the quality of the jobs that just about get people into the "working" figures and I would take that comparison with a large pinch of salt.

And of course gg we all pay extra to ensure other people get a job. Very strange economic theory that .

Oh and that's the ONS report saying the average wage has fallen.

I'm happy to take a little less in my pay packet if it gives someone else a job. That doesn't just show little knowledge of the economy it comes across as a pretty arrogant "I'm all right Jack" point of view too.

Crossed post white-wave. You really have to wonder just how some people manage to continue to ignore reality don't you.

They ignore reality by accusing some of lying. Not a good look

I assumed that you'd read it and could enlighten me, Primrose. I tend to assume that if someone posts a link they have read it themselves. I'm just a bit busy today and thought I could cut a few corners; my apologies.

WW It's clear you're upset that GN wouldn't remove a post I made on a different thread but you need to accept their adjudication and move on.

We do all pay so that other people can get a job. I'd be happy to pay higher taxes for more nurses. How's that different?

GG2 I don't choose how the ONS collates their information! They're good enough for most people .....

It's not an 'I'm alright Jack' approach. Unemployment can be devastating and I think most people would prefer to be in a job earning, quite literally, a few pounds less a week than no job at all. If everyone makes a small contribution, a lot of people can be helped.

Oh accept their adjudication and have moved on, but I will NOT accept you calling me a liar. You have not even had the grace to apologise. Which in my view says a lot about your character.

Just to change the subject a little. It has been interesting to see the comments from our visitors to Michel Barnier today. The Welsh and Scottish leaders are talking about a grab of powers back to the executive from their countries and the opposition about a grab of powers, back to the executive from Parliament. We have seen that May 'uncovered' wanted absolutely no opposition and they seem to be using the 'Repeal Bill' for much of the same.

I really am fed up with the anti-democratic remarks coming from the Conservatives and their supporters. I do not believe I help my country just by agreeing with far-right Conservativism or by making it possible for these people to succeed. Shouting that I, and other who hold that view are unpatriotic or that we should 'get behind the government' will not persuade me and I doubt it will persuade Corbyn, Sturgeon or Jones

It is in my view an attack on our democracy. They intend to take so much power and using the Henry 8th powers amend stuff at will without recourse to parliament,

The graph was from the ONS report you felt backed all your views Primrose. I was using your own source. I too wonder if you bothered to read it or, just as some people do, accepted the gutter press style headlines about it.

Your comment Unemployment can be devastating and I think most people would prefer to be in a job earning, quite literally, a few pounds less a week than no job at all. If everyone makes a small contribution, a lot of people can be helped would be correct if your contribution did go towards other peoples needs but that has to be one of the comments showing the greatest ignorance of how the economy is currently working I have seen in a long time. I'm afraid any reduction in your working income is far more likely to be lining an already capital rich member of our society than someone scrapping a living.

fullfact.org/economy/facts-about-zero-hour-contracts/

Same statistics used in the ONS report but in a more easily assimilated format.

Hummmm wasn't Primrose meeting with some real politicians recently?

There are all sorts of ways that employers get round contracts etc these days. About 7 years ago when DH 's DS was looking for work he went to a gardening business to do a fortnight's k trial - he did a lot of bricklaying for them. And was just paid his Jobseeker's Allowance.- he is a very good bricklayer - and after the two weeks there was no job - at this point he had not been redundant long - but he still had no permanent job the following year when he was offered the same two weeks work for the company again!! But he would not go. Shortly after this he got a full time position.
His partner was working for a company which went bust and she was unemployed - she was offered a three months training with one of these bargain shops - she took that as it appeared that there would be a job at the end of the three months. She was only given four hours a week - as we're all the others that started at the same time - when one person fell out of the scheme she was given their four hours too. However at the end of the three months they were all told no jobs and the company took on another cohort - these companies get a lot of payment from the Govt for taking on people- they get rid of them as they get it again for the new people- bit of a scam really, but these things get the unemployment figures down.

I thought so, Rigby.

It's okay saying you are happy to take less in your paypacket to give someone else a job.
Unfortunately many people who are already in work cannot afford to live where they work, particularly key workers.

www.24housing.co.uk/news/housing-closed-to-key-workers/

www.24housing.co.uk/news/association-staff-set-to-strike-over-pay-decreases/

I agree with you Primrose and think we will have to all pay a little more tax in the end.