Regret it Brexit Part 2

Petra ??
Few Remainers want to hear that on here though.

During the Brexit referendum campaign in 2016, gloomy economic forecasts by the Treasury were dismissed by Leavers as “Project Fear”. Many now gleefully note that, at least in the short run, they proved spectacularly wrong. Ministers like Boris Johnson, the foreign secretary, insist there are no downsides from Brexit.

It is thus odd that, unlike then, the government refused to produce any official forecasts for Brexit. In December David Davis, the Brexit secretary, who had boasted of his department’s rigorous impact assessments, told the Commons Brexit committee that they did not in fact exist. Yet early this year he had to share a leaked confidential draft of the government’s own EU exit analysis with the committee, which has now published it on its website.

www.independent.co.uk/voices/final-brexit-deal-march-peoples-vote-london-boris-johnson-theresa-may-nhs-latest-a8413706.html

I’m not sure why Reamainers are always accused of project fear when brexiteers projected fear over migration and Turkish membership throughout.

How come the £ has taken a complete nosedive since the referendum?

Grandad1943
Your ref. to an intergrated europe
Macron has declared that he wants to fine countries that refuse to take migrants. Doesn't sound very integrated, does it? Sounds more like fragmented to me. I would imagine the eastern block are saying: bring it on.

I have stated that there are political problems in the European Union. However, no one has stated they wish to break up the trading Bloc whatever the outcome of the politics.

That is the big difference between Britain's position and the rest of the EU

The Huffington Post reports "Anti-Brexit People's Vote March Banners Show British Democracy At Its Very Finest"

www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/anti-brexit-peoples-vote-march-banners_uk_5b2e3732e4b0040e27432a04

There were some brilliant posters.

I'm beginning to have second thoughts, by which I mean I'm beginning to see more of the disadvantages of staying in the EU. Though I agree the initial economic problems are a big worry if we leave.
I was reading an article yesterday by someone who is in a position to compare the relative stability of the various european countries. The gist is that compared with the UK, other european countries have experienced much more turmoil in the last 1000 years and are subject to more rapid and dramatic political shifts. So the UK is a stabilising influence in the EU.
The current immigrant problem is causing less of an upheaval in UK than elsewhere, where it is of major concern.
So possibly leaving the EU is more prudent at this time, as the future of the rest of Europe is so uncertain.

The U.K. was involved in many wars over the last thousand years - longest period of stability has been since joining the EU,

Feels very isolationist to me. Not sure if a backwards step is the way to go,moving inclusively forwards seemed to me the better option. Only time & history books will reveal who had the better outlook & judgement.

Welshwife - but we've never been invaded , occutied for centuries.

occupied not occutied.

We were occupied centuries ago by the Romans. Vikings and Normans.

Being an occupier of another country and plundering its wealth is nothing to be proud of though really.

Fennel
You are right to worry. If people were keeping up with the news coming out of Brussels today, it is serious.
Have you read what the Italians want. They want every country to take their share of migrants. If they don't, Italy is going to open its borders again. The migrants will naturally head towards Austria and everyone knows that the present right wing government got in on an anti immigration ticket.
If the get through Austria they will go straight into the German state of Bavaria. This is the state that could bring Merkel down.
People who know what's happening estimate that there are 80,000 migrants waiting to cross the Mediterranean.

fennel
You say you are having second thoughts.
If anything will make up your mind, this video will do it.
I don't know if your on Facebook but join ( and then cancel if you want)
In the search bar put: Brexit Breaking News + CORRUPTION IN THE EU.
I thought I knew a great deal Re what's wrong with the eu, but this is mind blowing.

I admired Tony Benn, and this speech also made me rethink:
www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWnpbEMMsNw
Although things have changed so much since then.

ps I think that was Austin Mitchell who introduced him - someone mentioned AM recently in another thread.

UBS survey of 600 companies spells out Brexit "dividend":
- 35% of companies plan to reduce UK investment post-Brexit
- 41% plan to move a large amount of capacity out of UK
- 42% plan to shift capacity to euro zone

Talking of Tony Benn.

There were back bench MP's such as the current Leader of the Labour Party who wholeheartedly agreed with Benns views on the European Union . They stood on their principles and voted against most EU legislation brought before Parliament.

What happened?

Grandad 1943

Am I correct in thinking the Unions were anti the European Union over many years but have changed their tune too?

It is the case that both Labour and Conservative parties have divisions over the subject of the UK leaving the European Union and no matter how much spin and political propaganda/shenanigans are spoken or written that is the inevitable outcome of such a decision.

Whether or not you were against the EU before the U.K. joined things have moved on and many many things are difficult to unravel or go back on. That is the position the U.K. finds itself in now. Difficult for everyone.

Brexit will cost Britain £72 billion in lost economic activity annually, according to an analysis of government figures. Leaving the EU is already dragging down the British economy. The UK is now growing more slowly than Japan or Italy.

uk.businessinsider.com/the-economic-cost-of-brexit-in-gdp-2017-11

Most of the population find huge numbers difficult. This number represents more than £1000 pa for every man, woman and child. Would it make a difference to the angry leavers if the figure was ten times as much? I think probably not. They still want to believe the "brexit bonus" lies peddled by the Express, Sun, DM, and quite disgracefully, even by Theresa May.

What we joined all those years ago was the Common Market not the EU! It was a trading block nothing more, (the clue is in the name!) for seven countries in western europe. At the time we had no idea what the real purpose of this trade arrangement was as of course we were lied to! No surprise now, but it would have been then! Hard to believe I know, hard to believe how naive we were!! We thought it was such a good idea! If I'd known then what I know now, I wouldn't have entertained voting to stay! It's an enormous disappointment, so for me the sooner we get away from Europe's version of the USSR with the same bully boy tactics to smaller weaker (satellite) states, the better.

I think we are giving more time to BJ than he deserves. If I was in his constituency I wouldn't be impressed with his self serving behaviour over the recent vote, and I suspect many erstwhile supporters are becoming disenchanted. I see that John Lewis is the latest business to express concern about a hard Brexit.

John Lewis's problems go far deeper than an uncertain brexit! Of course it will be used for and latched on to for all sorts of woes by all sorts of people, when in fact there are many other reasons to consider for their difficulties!

No doubt their problems are in some part due to the change in shopping habits, but the Chair of JL says that the uncertainty, and possible disruption in trade caused by an uncertain Brexit is affecting confidence in spending, and also will affect importing fresh produce and goods. He says it is important for businesses to speak out about their concerns. I think it's a pity that many of these concerns weren't flagged up by major businesses and manufacturers prior to the referendum.