Labour Party and anti semitism

Allygran

You have totally confused me . You say:-

"Whilst responding to your earlier post which seemed to indicate that you were not supporting the antisemitic view of the Labour Party and saw it as a distraction from discussing the rise of Nationalism"

What am I missing? Where have I mentioned the antisemitism row as a 'distraction from discussing the rise of Nationalism"?

You also say:-

"So I do hope that you realise that the post is in response to your earlier stance of dismissing antisemitism in the Labour Party and not your latest stance POGS "

I have never taken the stance of dismissing antisemitism in the Labour Party and I am intrigued by your comment. Again , what am I missing?

I think you will find that I have been vocal and taken some flack over the years on GN for raising the subject years ago so perhaps if you wish to understand where my thoughts are you might find reading this old thread interesting.

POGS Thu 17-Mar-16 12:12:56

www.gransnet.com/forums/news_and_politics/1224359-Anti-Semitism-in-Labour-Party-and-Universities

annie, are you sure?!!!! What an appalling thing to say and for JC to be a party to! I thought I had become unshockable! clearly not!!

100% sure niggly. Slam in the middle of the uproar he said himself he had spent an enjoyable evening with the group in his constituency, I did print their at the time, he didn’t say they were a far left group who want the destruction of Israel. This angered me, he just said ‘i spent the evening with Jews celebrating Passover and I learned much.

Their prayer ends with

“And fuck the Queen and especially fuck Prince Phillip. Burn down parliment . Full communism . Amen

Apologies for the language, a word I never, ever use or allowed to be said in my company

Oh dear annie, words rather fail me! Why Prince Phillip especially?!! The thought of that man being PM just doesn't bear thinking about!

Not Prince Phillip!!!!!!!

His sisters married Germans so could be that or his mother saved the lives of Jews during the war, she was living in Germany.

She was buried at Windsor but later her remains were taken to Jerusalem and she was interred on The Mount of Olives.

She was bestowed the honour - Righteous Among the Nations .

Phillip, Charles and William have visited her tomb, William just a few weeks ago.

POGS: Sorry to confuse you. This is the reason that you seemed to have changed your stance:
My debate is about how do we stop the use of anti-semitism from distracting from the the rise of nationalism and other extreme right policies? The message appeared to be that antisemitism was not important and that it distracted from addressing Nationalism.

In a later post you clearly were saying that you did not support antisemitism in the Labour Party. I must apologies if I misunderstood the post to which I responded.

Annie I’ve spent evenings in the company of racists, Christians, footballers, keen ramblers, ignorant peasants and an aristocrats. This doesn’t mean I subscribe to their views, hobbies, opinions ethics or philosophies.

Of course Corbyn is a pacifist. You have now shot yourself in the foot because if there’s one thing that everyone knows it is Corbyn’s views on war.

The only way to bring people together is to talk to them and try to influence their beliefs. You condemn a man who does this because you cannot see the benefit of this approach.

ah yes

IRA blows up the British Government , fellow colleagues are mourning so your pacifist invites the leaders to Westminster shortly after the bombing.

Claims he has never spoken to a member of the IRA, Diane Abbott trying to defend him claimed ‘he did share a platform with them but he didn’t speak to them . Beggers the question what did he bother to share the platform for.

Attends memorial services for an IRA member

Adress Hamas , a terrorist group as ‘friends’

Spends Passover with a group of anarchists who openly say they want to destroy Israel.

Refuse to pay respects at the Israeli Holocaust Museum but visits Jordon.

Wants to be PM but openly says he supports a united ireland , as wanted by the IRA dismissing, the fact that loyalists do not want to leave the U.K.

That’s bringing people together ?

Annie if you don’t talk to groups then nothing chances.

I know it doesn’t always work because of the nature of people, but unless someone tries to open a dialogue then how can progress be made.

There is a well known quote which goes something like this
“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing."

And
“If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem”

But surely one should talk to both sides and not just one?

Yes groupS. not a group . it takes both sides to reach peace

Mo Molam talked to both sides , even visited loyalists in the Maize prison.

If you have not been to the Peace Museum in Geurnika I can recommend it. It really challenges you to think about your own prejudice, about what needs to happen for good reconciliation and the process of forgiveness but without forgetting. It is a very moving place. It investigates the ongoing damage to a community if reconciliation is not achieved.

Allygran it ws not a post by POGS but by PECS, understandable as similar names and in capitals.

Corbyn was only a back bencher, his ‘talks’ could never produce anything much, and went way beyond ‘talking’ in any case actually, as he and other comrades tacitly supported and were friendly to the IRA, Hezbollah and Hamas etc.
That’s all Corbyn is, a one man demo for all kinds of dodgy groups.
The crazy fact that he is now in a position of power is frightening.

It’s no coincidence that the far left of the party ( since Corbyn took over) is now full of anti-Semites.

One doesn’t need to go to a peace museum to understand how reconciliation brings peace, N.I. Still hasn’t achieved reconciliation

True lemon, trouble is now he is leader of the official opposition party he still has the need to take sides where there is conflict. The man is a terrorist groupie .

Lemongrove thanks for pointing that out, what a awful mistake to make. I do get MaizieD and Mostlyharmless mixed up...now POGS and PECS.

Apologies to POGS and PECS.

POGS has been here a long time

The only way to bring people together is to talk to them and try to influence their beliefs. You condemn a man who does this because you cannot see the benefit of this approach

OldMeg, I would normally agree with your statement about bringing people together to talk is a way to attempt to find a common ground. However, Corbyn does not do this does he? He give platform and publicity to speakers, leaders and activists who are members of extreme groups who often advocate violent change against those they disagree with, as with Hamas, PLO, PLA etc as far as the Lavant area is concerned, and of course the IRA for over thirty years before it morphed from a violent terrorist group into a Political party and that support continues now.

Your concern that Corbyn is condemned for this, "because we cannot see the benefits of his approach" is correct. There are no benefits to civilised, peaceful, society from his approach. Encouraging, giving air time and a platform to extremists who believe in conflict is not 'trying to influence their beliefs" as you put it in a positive way, it is reinforcing their views by extending their sphere of influence by giving them a high profile public platform from which to spread their ideology.

So sorry Anniebach no offence meant to POGS or PECS a genuine error.

Please no apology Allygran, I was just explaining those of us who have posted for quite some time are use to POGS, I think I too have been muddled since PECS joined