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Not just Labour then with division ....

(36 Posts)
Urmstongran Sat 09-Feb-19 11:24:40

The EU too it seems.

‘The Yellow Vests Are A Warning Sign Of What’s To Come Down The Road:

In recent months Italy’s two far-right deputy prime ministers, Luigi Di Maio and Matteo Salvini, have criticized French President Emmanuel Macron on a host of hot-button issues from immigration to the gilets jaunes (yellow vest) anti-government demonstrations. After Maio met with gilets jaunes leaders this week and declared a “new Europe is being born of the yellow vests” Macron saw red. He said the comments were unacceptable “provocation” and immediately recalled France’s ambassador to Italy.

Salvini initially seemed contrite, saying Rome didn’t want a fallout with Paris, and suggesting the two leaders meet to iron out their differences. Unfortunately that conciliatory gesture was followed by insistence that Macron address three issues first: make French police stop pushing migrants back into Italy, end lengthy border checks blocking traffic, and hand over some 15 Italian leftist militants granted asylum in France in recent decades. With the European Parliament’s elections coming up at the end of May, France’s Minister for European Affairs, Nathalie Loiseau, just wants everybody to mind their own country’s business and play nice with their neighbors.’

I think there’s a bumpy ride ahead.

jura2 Sat 09-Feb-19 11:58:52

yep, and we have pulled the trigger ...

petra Sat 09-Feb-19 12:24:02

yep,and we have pulled the trigger
I'm sure the populist movements in Italy, France, Austria, Holland, Germany would take offence that our 'little island' took the credit.

EllanVannin Sat 09-Feb-19 14:37:33

Bring it on if it's going to make politicians sit up and take notice because nothing any member of the public says or does is making any difference !

Urmstongran Sun 10-Feb-19 13:13:16

This too in today’s news:

‘For Skaarup is parliamentary leader of the populist Danish People's Party (DPP). And the island he was visiting for the first time has split his nation over plans to turn it into 'Europe's Alcatraz' – an isolated fortress to dump dozens of rejected and criminal refugees who cannot be sent home.

This 17-acre scrap of land – home to a research station for animal diseases and a cemetery for infected carcasses – symbolises how a Scandinavian country once famed for liberalism and tolerance has become the toughest on refugees in Western Europe.

Denmark's immigration minister even posed with a cake on social media to celebrate passing her 50th law restricting migrants.

Recent measures include a ban on face veils, confiscating jewellery from refugees and designating 29 urban areas as 'ghettos' subject to special laws to control residents.’

So, it’s not just us then finding migration difficult to deal with. The cracks are showing within the EU.

oldgoat Sun 10-Feb-19 14:31:35

And in the UK the Tory party are divided. In fact, divisions in the Conservative party are what have landed us in the shambolic mess which is Brexit, but no doubt they'll find a way of blame Labour.

oldgoat Sun 10-Feb-19 14:32:15

Blaming labour.

M0nica Sun 10-Feb-19 14:38:47

I have been reading in the Observer today a long and detailed analysis of the Gilet Jaune movement in France.

It is a very amorphous movement. It includes the Far left, Far right and as far as |I can see Far centre, if such exists. Maio met with only one faction of the gilets jaune and the heads of other factions were furious about the meeting, they thought it inappropriate and irrelevant and just a publicity stunt by Maio and the faction leader he met.

It was a very interesting article. If you do not already read the Observer, there is till time to rush out buy a copy and read it.

Urmstongran Sun 10-Feb-19 14:45:23

I will try to get a copy later, thanks MOnica

The Denmark issue is pretty awful though isn’t it? Seems desperate measures for uncertain times.

Jalima1108 Sun 10-Feb-19 15:32:28

yep,and we have pulled the trigger

Have you not been watching 'Inside Europe: Ten Years of Turmoil' then jura?

And perhaps I have been watching different news about Europe from you for the past 10+ years.

Amazing that we can be blamed for what has been going on in Germany, France, Italy, Greece, Spain etc etc over the last few years confused

At least we were not in the Euro! You can't say that the crises with that are the fault of the UK, surely?

Urmstongran Sun 10-Feb-19 16:42:09

‘Inside Europe’ is riveting stuff. I’m looking forward to the final part tomorrow night.
It explains a lot.
Quite an eye opener really.

petra Sun 10-Feb-19 17:01:47

you cant say that the crises with that are the fault of the uk, surely
Oh yes she could grin

Urmstongran Sun 10-Feb-19 17:16:04

Yep, she’d find a way 🤣

petra Sun 10-Feb-19 17:28:35

But we are supposed to believe that the uk is the nasty racist country, and La La Land aka Denmark is all sweetness and light.
What some don't realise is: these countries newspapers are online in English.
Same situation in Sweden, but don't tell anyone wink they want to keep it a secret. Mums the word.

Urmstongran Sun 10-Feb-19 18:10:42

Yes petra which is why I posted, especially about Denmark as it has always had a very liberal outlook.

Chewbacca Sun 10-Feb-19 18:26:00

yep, and we have pulled the trigger confused

From that statement, I'm assuming that "the trigger" refers to Brexit? Is that correct jura? If so, you're intimating that Italy, France and Sweden etc have been so awe inspired by the UK's smooth transitional exit from the EU that it's inspired them to also rebel against the EU directives on immigration. But wait..... that can't be right can it? As you've said, ad nauseam, the UK is seen as a laughing stock by the rest of the EU and they pity us for our folly in wanting to leave their loving embrace. So who pulled the trigger and, more importantly, who is holding the gun?

petra Sun 10-Feb-19 18:40:18

I'm assuming that you've now flipped to your Swiss nationality not wanting to be associated with a country that started this mayhem.

I do love a bit of witty sarcasm grin

Lily65 Sun 10-Feb-19 18:49:19

So, it’s not just us then finding migration difficult to deal with

I have never had a problem with migration or migrants.

Urmstongran Sun 10-Feb-19 18:55:53

You’re fortunate then Lily65 that your family members weren’t working on building sites in central Manchester for contractors when white vans would pull up at 6:30am and Polish plasterers and Romanian brickies would pile out and be working ‘cash in hand’ for less than the going rate. Illegal? Yes it was, in more ways than one.

Urmstongran Sun 10-Feb-19 19:12:21

France has endured its 13th weekend of protests now. This from The Guardian (it’s in The Telegraph too but those who voted Remain castigated me roundly for quoting from ‘that’ newspaper!)

‘Thousands of French gilets jaunes (yellow vests) demonstrators marched on Saturday in what was their 13th weekend of action. There were scuffles in Paris and a demonstrator’s hand was mangled by a small explosive.

There was also an overnight arson attack on the Brittany residence of the National Assembly head, Richard Ferrand, (who is the equivalent of our Speaker Bercow). though no immediate link was made to the actions against President Emmanuel Macron.

Just who are the gilets jaunes?

The demonstrations, named for high-visibility jackets worn by the protesters, began in mid-November over fuel taxes. They have since broadened into a more general revolt against a political class they view as out of touch with common people

In Paris, several thousand people marched on Saturday beside symbols of power such as the National Assembly and Senate.

The demonstrations were mainly peaceful, but some protesters threw objects at security forces, a scooter and a police van were set on fire and some shop windows were smashed.

One participant’s hand was severely injured when he tried to pick up a so-called “sting-ball grenade” used by police to disperse crowds with teargas, a police source told Reuters.

The interior ministry put the total number of protesters around France at 12,000, including 4,000 in Paris. The police source, however, said numbers were higher, with 21,000 demonstrators taking part in rallies outside Paris.

“We’re not children, we’re adults,” said Hugues Salone, a computer engineer from Paris, who among the chanting and placard-waving protesters. “We really want to assert our choices, and not the choices of the politicians who do not live up to them.”

petra Sun 10-Feb-19 19:30:49

Same here. Friends lost their business, fitting high end office furniture. They had their day though when one Russian contractor made such a pigs ear of googles office in Dublin that when he was asked to go over to make it right the price doubled: they accepted.

Urmstongran Mon 11-Feb-19 10:26:17

Any comment Lily65 to my post following yours? I’m curious what you think.

Lily65 Mon 11-Feb-19 18:18:32

my comment would be.....a few white vans and some friends of petras who made a lot of money, do not amount to much.

paddyann Mon 11-Feb-19 19:31:50

Surely its the employer who is paying immigrants below the legal minimum that should be prosecuted .Maybe the immigrants had no idea they were being paid under the counter .....maybe its what was normal where they came from.No excuse for ANY company in this DISunited kingdom not knowing the rules though.Strange to blame the newcomer to the country and not the business

Urmstongran Mon 11-Feb-19 19:49:46

Oh they knew. Everyone knew. Gang masters dropping illegal migrants off who were looking for work without any paperwork. Cash in hand. Cheap labour for the contractors.
Some of the big construction firms wouldn’t countenance it right enough. So the men piled back in the vans to try their luck elsewhere.