Breakaway Labour MP’s

Annie Jewish people come in all different shapes, sizes, personalities and political persusion!
I know some Jewish people who are really fed up of being defined by non Jews and clumped together in one homogenous group rather than as individuals.

PECS - the same could be said of any group, men women, gays, lesbians, transgender, black ethic minority groups, the list is endless. We all want to be recognised as individuals but it’s possible to generalise. Black Americans share a history of slavery, many generations ago but it still influences them. The same goes for any group that has been subjected to oppression for being say, female, black, jewish etc

Exactly my point Iam!
Too often it is suggested that there is just one" Jewish voice". That in itself is quite racist.

I read Iam64 post differently ,

I don’t know I just find it baffling that of all the good labour MPs out there we see Corbyn, McDonald, Gardner and the woefully incompetent Abbott.

Don’t get me wrong all good constituency MPs but cabinet ministers?? Able to lead the country?

Not in a million years.

POGS Intimidation and bullying has always been a factor in all party politics- what on earth do you think the Whip's job is? In the past they have been chosen for their ability to hunt out secrets they could use and their willingness to use that knowledge and any other measures that might be effective. It might be interesting to consider if in fact we are seeing the end of such behaviour and the results of ineffective Whips. In the past MPs have stuck and voted with the party because of the way they were treated. If there is no such pressure and MPs decide to move to Independent groups then will it be possible to continue with the parliamentary system as it stands? And what will happen in elections when you vote for a party but can't be certain that the MP will follow the party line.
Mycatisahacker I'd rather them than Gove, Hunt and Boris all of whom b***** up their jobs as cabinet ministers.

trisher

I think you may have been watching too many episodes of ‘house of cards’

But I agree with you about the Tories. Incompetent.

Far left and far right politicians are invariably stupid and unpleasant.

That’s why we are in such a mess. Labour is hard right and the Tory party is becoming increasingly too right for me.

Corbyn often voted against party lines

I mentioned previously watching the ' Live ' debate in Parliament on antisemitism. There have been others and posted on GN.

Barry Gardiner keeps getting mentioned so it is appropriate to post his words , this is one of his comments during that debate.:-

" The CST does more than work on safety. Its work to record and analyse antisemitic hate crime is integral to our understanding of the scale of the problem that faces us. Last year, it recorded 23 antisemitic incidents in my borough of Brent alone, and 1,652 across the country. That makes for sober reading. Antisemitism is at a record high, with a 16% rise in incidents nationwide year on year and 100 incidents every month. This is the lived reality of our Jewish fellow citizens living under the strain of antisemitism. It is appalling—the arson attacks on synagogues, the desecration of Jewish cemeteries, the neo-Nazi graffiti on posters for Holocaust Memorial Day, the vandalising of centres of Jewish life, the physical attacks on Jewish children at their schools or on public transport, swastikas daubed on Jewish homes and antisemitic hate mail sent to Jewish workplaces and schools. These hideous crimes are a warning to us all. We must do better, and we must be better.

That brings me to the issues facing my own party, the Labour party. It was the Labour party that introduced the Race Relations Act and the Equality Act, and it has put fighting inequality, racism and prejudice at the core of who we are and what we believe in. How can it be that we are struggling so badly to eradicate antisemitism from our own membership? I joined the Labour party because I believed it was quite simply the best vehicle for progressive social change in this country. I still do, but no party has a monopoly on virtue, and in the Labour party we are learning a bitter lesson. For all the strength and passion that we have derived from the mass influx of new members that has seen our party grow to more than 500,000 strong, we have not had adequate procedures in place to react swiftly and decisively to that small minority of members who have expressed sometimes ignorant but often vicious, dangerous and vile antisemitic views.

On behalf of my party, I want to publicly apologise to the Jewish community that we have let them down. We know it and we are trying to do better. We are trying to become the party that we have always aspired to be. We will not stop working until we once again become a safe and welcoming political home for people from the Jewish community, as from every other. The Secretary of State said that we stand here today to say of antisemitism that we reject it. We do. We must."
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He is not a lone voice, he is not the right wing press, he is in Corbyns Shadow Cabinet , he is is a Labour MP who has the guts to speak honestly over the antisemitism issue in the Labour Party .

Why don't some members and commentators who portray they hate racism , bullying, harassment on any other day have the guts to do the same as those Labour MP's and Councillors who have reported this happening for over 3 years?

Yes hear all that POGS

But as Luciana says deeds not words.

As in I agree with you but Corbyn either can’t or won’t act because he hasn’t the character to be a leader! He’s a protester not a leader. You know it I know it and it’s becoming increasingly clear that even his own MPs know it.

The country already do.

Mycat he won’t act

Sadiq Khan has also spoken out condemning it , as has many Labour MP’s , lot of people speaking out against something which allegedly doesn’t exist .

Mycatisahacker for Blair and Campbell it's the Thick of It not House of Cards and even Campbell thinks it's as close as you can get to actual events.
The actions that have been taken to get MPs into parliament to vote when there is a small majority are hilarious.
All those speaking about the Jewish community as if it were one single entity and everyone who is Jewish thinks the same are being anti-semitic. Judaism has many branches and many different groups within it. Some are undoubtedly on the right of politics and others on the left. Some do not engage with politics at all.

Blair and Cambell, diversion again

I hope you aren’t accusing me of ant semitism trisher.

PRessed too quickly
I’ve never suggested Jewish people are the same, has anyone else here done so? I don’t think so, the extent some will go to to say there isn’t a problem in the LP would be entertaining if it wasn’t dangerous and sad

It is dangerous and sad indeed, but posters ( one or two)
Still push the mantra ‘ nothing to see here!’ Or ‘there may be anti-zionism but no anti-semitism’ or ‘ It’s all in the minds of the right wing press’ etc etc etc.

trisher

Well Campbell has s massive ego so would love to think of himself that way. I loved the thick of it by the way.

I don’t think anyone has said all those of the Jewish faith think or vote the same!

Why would they? And why would anyone think that?

Seems still a bit of failing to grasp or accept the depth of the problem here as their own deputy PM said today

And I don’t remember any racism being tolerated in the Labour Party under Kinnock, Smith, Blaire, Foot, Brown, milliband!

Why now? Why has it crept in now to disgrace the Labour Party.? We all know the answer to that don’t we?

Agree Anniebach he won’t act as he’s hopeless.

And to clarify..I have never said there are not people with anti- Semetic attitudes within the Labour party.
I have pointed out that amongst people who are Jewish there is a wide range of opinion about a) the extent / problem of anti Semitism in the LP & b) the conflation of anti - Semitism & anti - Zionism & c) Israeli government attitude & policies in Gaza , West Bank & Israel.
On here it feels many non- Jews are only hearing the opinions of the anti JC group.

PECS

Can you not see that you have put the problem in a nutshell.

It’s there but it’s not that bad! Not all Jewish people mind!

Mycat exactly so,

I've been talking to my husband about it, and we agree that anti semitism will always exist somewhere, though the level varies. Until the days of the Messiah when all nations will live in peace together. Psalm 117.
In the meanwhile I prefer to be in denial because it's scary, and not good to think people don't like us.

I have never understood why it exists though. From early childhood I have never understood why some people hate others because of their faith, their appearance, the colour of their skin, etc. I am by no means a religious person, so it's probably the way I was brought up, but I don't understand where the hatred comes from.