Misreading the country?

The problem is in the process for leaving. Never imagining a country could/would leave the 'how' was not seriously planned for. A country cannot fairly leave the European Union without negotiating the future of other relations AT THE SAME TIME - which I understand is specifically ruled out. No I don't have a solution.

Because of the unique relationship between Britain and Ireland, the only way that the UK could leave the EU without breaking international law by endangering the Good Friday agreement, would be if the UK and ROI both left the EU at the same time.

There would still be terrible damage done to both economies and to a lesser extent to the remaining EU countries.

Fortunately the vast majority of Irish people, and, I believe, a majority of British people want their countries to remain in the EU.

It clearly said on the ballot paper ‘stay in the European Union or Leave the European Union’ .....
nothin at all about leave with a ‘crap’deal cobbled together by May & the EU!!!

Andy’s comments are no more inane that those who can’t keep to the point and interject puerile one liners.

We are all allowed to have our own opinion believe it or not!We still have free speech in our country or so we are led to believe.I voted to leave as did everyone I know ,the area I live in voted overwhelmingly to leave but obviously Gransnet it mostly people who voted to Remain so I shall take my leave of you all.

Should /if ? there be a second referendum, the result being as in 2016 which was undeniably in favour of LEAVE , what then.?

nannie dont go stay it is free speech...

I adore it here

WTO here we go

Then we would still be in the same dreadful position that we are in now.

It would be important to prevent the lies, cheating and foreign interference that helped to get that narrow victory.

I don't pretend to know how that could be done but we would have to hope that fewer people were fooled than happened in 2016.

IF we'd been given clear information in order to make a choice , we could have made a sensible decision . we weren't given clear information because our politicians hadn't thought out what they would do if we voted leave ,because they don't WANT to leave , too many have fingers in the European parliament pie . google how many (of all parties ) have well paid positions , including ex PMs , of course they don't want to leave .

Well, Aniebach, had the Labour party remained in power we would certainly not have had this Brexit crisis which is causing more division and damage within this nation than any other issue has done in modern history.
I'm not sure about that Grandad, if we look at history then the Labour party promised a referendum on the EU in more than one manifesto.

What a MESS, I, like many others am fed up with Brexit and the implications it brings with it, two years have passed and nothing has been acheived.Would an extension give anything? I dont thinks so just a little more time to confuse people.
I sometimes wish Brexit would disappear and we stay in the flipping EU, I am an ex pat and dread what is going to happen, and I dont even live in the UK but will obviously be affected by the outcome.I am a Brit living in an EU country,I dont know where we stand, I have not got dual Nationality,maybe its time to apply!

I read this morning that MPs are now calling for 'unity' and an effort to do the best for the country. I had hoped that might have been the theme throughout the last fraught three years, but it seems that point scoring, party politics and childish stupidity well mixed with a lot of unsubstantiated scare mongering has been the downfall of this egotistical self seeking bunch that we have to endure.

Victory is victory , narrow or wide

Hear Hear Jane10 & Megan 123.
Just flaming do it! Get out now & sort it all out later. We will survive & eventually prosper.
I can never vote for my local MP ( Sam Gyimah) again after the way he has behaved.
I feel very sorry for Mrs May having so her supposed supporters turning against her for their own benefit.

I believe that it is now inevitable that Britain will leave the European Union this year. However, I also believe that we will witness further chaos in this government and also within the House of Commons prior to Theresa May bringing her withdrawal agreement back to the house next Wednesday when it will be passed.

In the above, (and with the provision that this government survives the next few days), no other agreement is on the table or likely to emerge from the political chaos in the coming week. Therefore, with no majority in parliament to leave the European Union on WTO terms, a majority will form to accept Mays deal in the absence of anything else.

So, no stopping of Brexit, and no leaving on WTO terms is the situation the country will find itself in this time next week I believe.

I understand full well why you worry about your grandchildren's future, but yesterday I was discussing things with a dear friend and got to talking of what we hav lived through.

Too long a list to post here, but we started with Nasser nationalising the Suez Canal and worked our way through the Middle East, Ireland, India versus Pakistan, Vietnam etc.

You can all add to the list, as we have lived about the same amount of time. Even although the list is dire, I have enjoyed life and still do. I'm sure you all have too.

I'm looking at it differently.
If you spend a couple of years trying to coax a fractious toddler through the "terrible twos" you don't then run out of patience, stamp your feet and stomp off when things are seriously difficult.

A ridiculous analogy, I know, when we're watching the chaos caused by our so-called leaders.

Ken Clarke has said that this is such a momentous decision that we have to ride the storm and, instead of demanding an immediate solution, right now, we should be demanding a solution that will sustain our children and grandchildren.

We could hope that a change in leadership, a general election, a second referendum might give us that but at the moment we are justifiably losing hope.

Who would have predicted the present scenario?
Who can say what might happen now the pressure is really on?

I believe a second referendum with very clearly defined criteria might do it. There were so many flaws in the last one that it just can't be trusted.
If seen as honest, truthful and correctly conducted a second one would be far more acceptable, whatever the result.

As a sideline question to the dreaded B word.....what say do the constituents have in the politicians who leave their Party to set up a separate one? Did they get a vote in the decision and if they are not serving their constituency for the Party to which they were elected, surely there should be a bye-election?

perhaps we can just keep having referendums until Remain win?

If ever?

Is that democracy?

The majority voted Leave, so No deal and onto WTO

the legal default

Correct Andy.

I am still totally confused by the whole Brexit issue! I don't really trust any politician to tell us the truth and should there be another referendum, I think we will still be sold lies and misinformation.

I feel like going into Westminster and telling the politicians to grow up and stop acting like children fighting in the playground - each one not listening to anyone else but just repeating themselves louder and louder with hands over their ears! Nah, nah, nah!

I really don't know what will happen, according to what I have read or heard, our economy will suffer whatever is decided. I voted remain but have to accept the slight majority decision to leave so I just want the politicians to get on with it. I don't think that another referendum is appropriate nor a GE - too many lies will still be told!

I don't see how so many people are afraid of just exiting??

Europe is not what it was, it is falling apart. For decades, the world has known a liberal and united Europe, but the Old Continent is in a deepening crisis which has disturbing implications for democracies across the world.

We are now seeing the greatest refugee crisis since World War II which is overwhelming the continent, while Jews flee by their thousands. Populist parties are increasing significantly.

In Germany, Angela Merkel is set to depart. Macron - with a 23%of approval is facing a state of national emergency. Italy and a lot of Eastern Europe are looking to assert more national sovereignty and claw back more power from Brussels.
Who knows what will happen in the European May elections...........

I am beginning to think a second referendum is a good idea. In the last two years the people able to vote will have changed. Voters slightly too young before can now have their say.

Sadly we now know that the House of Commons is mainly filled by idiots who cannot run the country or who even have an interest in running the country.
They are only in it for themselves and we are at their mercy,
I wanted to leave before as I am afraid of a federal EU dictating to so many countries how to live but now I can see that we are governed by people who are unable to do their job.
So maybe it is better to stay in the EU and sack half of the MP's saving money that way.
What do most of them actually do? My MP is well known but is utterly ineffective.

Does blatant lying and deception deliver democracy?
I'd accept the result of a clear and valid vote, albeit unhappily.
This whole fiasco has come about because of a series of knee-jerk reaction - Cameron's devious ploy, May's miscalculated GE, reactions within parties etc!
We'll compound the chaos if we go for yet another.

That's yet another knee-jerk reaction. Not another vote!