Fox Hunting

For some yes, that is certainly true there is no denying that, but for some farmers the removal of a fox whether for commercial or humane reasons, the hunt is the only way to do it. Is there a kinder way? If so I haven't heard of it!
So it's ok to submit to a miserable life and a terrifying and sometimes torturous death an animal reared for food? regrettable of course, but ok?!! I suppose this double think can appease the conscience, but for me it's a cop out and just doesn't wash! I think Oscar Wilde was more incredulous at people hunting an animal that was inedible, than any anxiety about cruelty!!! He makes no such comment about stag hunting, which is truly extremely cruel and a complete NO NO, but of course the end product can be eaten!

Man will always kill for food, fact , unless the world turns vegan

Meat production is becoming unsustainable. Won't be long before we are all veggies, like it or not

We eat far less meat now we're older although we love it!!!! Too many issues particularly with pork! Pigs are extremely intelligent which makes me seriously uncomfortable! I would have made a lousy (animal) farmers wife!

When we kept chickens and ate meat, I decided I would have to be prepared to kill the cock and eat it. (we had more than one) After all, I am a farmer's daughter; so I borrowed a special implement called the humane dispatcher, and I dispatched the bird. I felt rather shocked afterwards and couldn't think of cooking it but one if my sons came home. He has worked on a highland estate so had fewer qualms and between us we plucked and prepared the cockeral for dinner. We sat down to eat quite late at night and gave thanks to the bird for its life. He was delicious. If we had to go to those lengths each time we ate meat, it would become a rare treat.

Jabberwock I think Oscar Wilde was more incredulous at people hunting an animal that was inedible, than any anxiety about cruelty
Wilde calls the hunters "unspeakable"-synonyms for that are dreadful, awful, appalling, horrific, horrifying, horrible, terrible, horrendous, atrocious, insufferable, abominable, abhorrent, repellent, repulsive, repugnant, revolting, sickening, frightful, fearful, shocking, hideous, ghastly, grim, dire, hateful, odious, loathsome, gruesome, monstrous, outrageous, heinous, deplorable, despicable, contemptible, execrable, vile, indescribable,
It's not an expression that means he was just concerned with the cruelty. He rejected the whole concept.

I wrote earlier about my cousin protecting his ewes and lambs.
Where we lived in France the Chasse was always busy, in restricted seasons. To protect their crops, and poultry. And they ate most of the wild boar and deer who were responsible for all the damage. They didn't eat the foxes as far as I know.
They used dogs to round up but not to kill. For that they used guns. and there were many terrible accidents involving humans every season. All farmers have guns.
There's a strong anti-Chasse movement in France too.
We lost some of our poultry to foxes.
It's difficult to decide - if the foxes need to be killed, should it be by dogs or guns? In theory guns, but not everyone is a good shot.

The reality is there is no point having a free vote because there is a massive majority against hunting in the general population, although some rural areas would certainly be pro hunting.

Many of the equine fraternity do enjoy the “chase” because it gives them the opportunity to ride where otherwise they could not. Wether a Fox is caught does not matter, they have had a good chase, of course at present they are not allowed to catch foxes

Slaughter Houses fit that description trisher! Do you feel strongly about those poor creatures too, or do you subscribe to the theory that as they are bred for human consumption somehow their terror, particularly the unfortunate ones who are "Halal ", are somehow unimportant,and cruelty here doesn't quite count and is therefore acceptable?! Such hypocrisy!!

I don't think its particulary hypocritical to wonder what on earth people get out of chasing an animal to its death.

Unless someone lives in some kind of vegan bubble then we're all guilty to some extent.

We all do what we can; what our conscience allows, but I'm glad that whilst I'm far from perfect, I would find no joy whatsoever from a day with the hunt, any more than I'd enjoy a day in the slaughterhouse.

No, neither would I, hunting is something I would never want to do, but I think concentrating on one cruelty to the point of hysterics while totally ignoring, excusing or third hand contributing the other is hypocritical! Treating animals as a commodity is just wrong! We condemn the people of the Far East for incredible cruelty, but if we're honest in some areas, behind closed doors and out of the way places, we're nearly as bad, but choose to keep quiet.

Jabberwok Wilde's actual saying is "The unspeakable in full pursuit of the uneatable"
I don't think there are many people chasing animals around slaughter houses.
I actually eat very little meat.

I do not eat meat and what hysterics Jabberwok ? W If you had witnessed
cubbing , seen cubs being fed live to hounds you would have said to those with you ‘no call for hysterics ?

I have no desire to chase an animal to its death, or shoot birds or go fishing for sport, but if wild animals are left unculled they become a pest, to themselves and others. What so many people object to in hunting is that it is perceived as an elitist social activity, which apparently doesn't apply to shooting or fishing.

There are extremes on the scale.
I know a vegan who is totally against what he calls "humans fetishising animals" (keeping them as pets) because he considers it cruel and unnecessary.
Castrating them to stop them displaying normal animal behaviours, and so on.. just to pander to our egos so we can treat them as companions, keeping them indoors for "their protection".
Is he right or wrong?

After commenting about cubbing earlier, I was very sorry to see a man in camouflage on a quad go past just now. No point phoning the farmer, he only leases the land from the Duke and has to allow the hunt free access. Makes me feel sick to my stomach.

Exactly easybee, but perhaps enough said!

I don't object to elitist people hunting down an animal; I would object to anyone doing it.
If it was a group of teens on bikes in a rough area chasing a wild animal I would find it just as objectionable.

I fully understand about some animals needing to be culled and if we are discussing the countryside and farmers perhaps we should consider the difference between how foxes are killed and how deer are killed. Both are problems for farmers with deer destroying and eating crops and foxes doing the same for animals, but deer are killed quickly and cleanly by licensed gun men, whereas foxes are terrified, chased and torn apart by dogs.

Elitism is not true, and what of those who follow hunt In trucks ? And farmers help with cubbing , are they elitist?
Those who take part in lamping ?

To me, the argument for hunting down animals is the equivalent of smashing a pet over the head with a hammer to put an end to its suffering instead of taking it to a trained vet.
Sorry, that was graphic!

MissAdventure smashing a pet over the head with a hammer, while 100% wrong, would be a lot quicker than what happens to cubs and foxes

Yes, I was just thinking that...

Anyway, this thread has me another step closer to becoming a reluctant vegetarian.

Not on Exmoor or The Quantox! Both these packs of Stag Hounds are very much in operation. We lived on Exmoor for 20 years and witnessed them on a regular basis. Stag hunting is horrid, much worse than fox,but that's only my opinion. The poor thing has no chance of escape and it should be banned, full stop.

I don’t agree with fox hunting ( or stag hunting).
The reason foxes kill as many chickens as possible ( instead of taking just one) is that they are hard wired to go for as many easy kills as possible, and return for them later.
In nature that would be a couple of rabbits, but in a henhouse of course there are loads.They don’t do it because they enjoy killing ( unlike some humans.)