The slippery slope - dictatorship anyone?

I’d be dispirited.
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I have extended family in the North East, all of whom voted to leave. I have theories about why they feel as they do. To be honest, they seem to hate southerners as much as they do the EU. I think you're right that life is tough and they've developed a strong sense of coping alone … and much else.

To be honest, they seem to hate southerners as much as they do the EU.

Which is strange because, as a southerner who relocated to the NE, I have found them to be most friendly and accepting of 'incomers'. Far more so than the people I encountered in Yorkshire, who really did have a chip on their shoulders about 'southerners'. (And not all of them 'hate the EU', I know plenty who voted Remain)

I’d be dispirited

Problem is, Ug, the vote was very close and no-one tried very hard to get Remainers onside when we were all dispirited.

I can see that MaizieD

The whole issue now is so utterly divisive isn’t it? I think most people are heartily sick to the back teeth of it. And yet, awful though it is, a decision has to be made. And either way MILLIONS of us are going to be upset.

I don’t honestly see how we can mend this division. We can’t put the genie back into the lamp.....

Time I suppose. It’s said to be a great healer.

I think it might be like the silence that developed after the Spanish civil war, where whole families fought (for real) and were split asunder. Subsequent generations didn’t speak of it.

Here it is in Wikipedia:
The Pact of Forgetting (Spanish: Pacto del olvido) is the Spanish political decision (by both the leftist and rightist parties) to avoid dealing with the legacy of Francoism after the 1975 death of Francisco Franco, who had remained in power since the Spanish Civil War in 1936–1939.

Millions who voted leave deserve to be upset because they believed the leave liars.

There’s no building bridges with you, is there varian?

My post was polite and conciliatory. Yours however. ...
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My post was a statement of fact. Millions of decent folk were deceived and sooner of later they will come to realise that.

varian
My post was a statement of fact. Millions of decent folk were deceived and sooner of later they will come to realise that

As WWM2 would say...oh dear!

Varian’s views on Brexit are extreme ones.Extreme views are usually better avoided.
I don’t know anyone in real life who is angry with friends/ relatives for daring to vote in a different way to themselves.
Social media has just become a shouting match, much the same as Parliament.

My view, like the majority of UK voters ( as evidenced by numerous polls over the last two years) is that the UK should Remain in the EU.

There is nothing extreme about that.

The issue isn't only that the advisory vote was close. At this point almost all MPs wanted to try and work something out. The didn't have to, it was advisory but they signed Article 50 in good faith.

Then we voted in a hung parliament. This is our democracy; a right to vote for our Representative. This sent a message to parliament which certainly wasn't no-deal, it was more like 'compromise'.

So BRINO then GGMk3?

I’d rather Revoke. I think that’s been the game plan all along.
I’m not sure we will be allowed to Brexit after all.

I am not angry with friends or relatives who voted for brexit.

Not one of my extended family voted for brexit. Only one close friend did but she haz now changed her mind and would vote Remain in a People's Vote.

I do know other folk who voted leave but I am not angry with them, only with the liars and charlatans who deceived them.

If that is how you think UG theirs not much point in replying.

there's. Sorry

I’m not sure we will be allowed to Brexit after all.

It's not a question of not being 'allowed', Ug, it really, really isn't. It's a question of May going completely the wrong way about it and refusing to listen to people with experience and expertise.

I've been following a very committed Leaver for quite some time now. He has been anti-EU for decades. He had a carefully worked out plan for detaching the UK from the EU by degrees, over a period of years. I have no reason to believe that it wouldn't have worked; a number of 'experts' have commented that it looked as though it would have been promising. I think that had a plan like his been implemented it would have reconciled Remainers better to the shock and would have allowed businesses to have refocused and adapt over a period of time.

P.S The Leaver I've followed is incandescent about the way everything has turned out; he's an angry Leaver who I have absolute sympathy for.

As it was, May leapt in seemingly determined to immediately expunge anything that smacked of the EU completely from our lives; treated EU citizens as negotiating chips and completely disregarded the views of Remainers. Just inviting vigorous opposition...

Oh dear, my paragraphs have got transposed. The PS should have come last...

I think the true colours of all MPs are shining through right now. I have always said I wouldn't trust any of them, and nothing I've seen recently has changed that opinion.

I don't know who it was that said (paraphrasing) the very fact that someone wants to be a politician should be enough to preclude them from ever becoming one.

Your Leaver chap sounds sensible MaizieD

Don’t know quite where to put this - it’s not worth ANOTHER Brexit thread but Cummings leaves at the end of October. He has surgery scheduled for early November and is not expected to return as an adviser afterwards.

I don’t know whether that will make things better or worse.

Just thought I’d share it as I wasn’t aware until just now.

It's been common knowledge for quite a while.

Johnson reminds me of King Charles 1 who tried to overrule Parliament.

Varian: Not one of my extended family voted for brexit. Only one close friend did but she haz now changed her mind and would vote Remain in a People's Vote.
Do you really think she'd tell you she hadn't changed her mind? Knowing your extreme views she would be endlessly nagged to death!

Varian: I do know other folk who voted leave but I am not angry with them, only with the liars and charlatans who deceived them
That just shows what utter disrespect you have for leave voters to think they were all so stupid as to have been deceived.

Your Leaver chap sounds sensible MaizieD

So it's okay for a Brexiteer to suggest a step by step detachment but when I suggest that May should have seen the need for compromise you harangue me with insulting comments.

Not me GGmk3.

I am on record, on one of these myriad threads of saying (must have been around March) that I was hoping TM’s WA got voted through as it was a COMPROMISE. I remember clearly saying that neither side was happy with it which, to my mind meant neither side had ‘won’.

Since then it turned out that the details of the deal showed it to be shabby in some areas and I did say later that no wonder the EU didn’t want to re-open it as they were delighted with it!

That said, whoever the Leaver is that MaizieD follows he sounds a sensible measured Leaver and I agree with him that now we have this messy dog’s dinner to sort out.

We are where we are.