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Mogg

(391 Posts)
grapefruitpip Tue 05-Nov-19 11:49:37

Odious person.

lemongrove Tue 05-Nov-19 20:09:33

mcem......did you really say ‘blame Johnson’ ?!
He wasn’t the PM at the time, and in any case, why blame any PM at all?

MissAdventure Tue 05-Nov-19 20:11:44

I doubt anyone could say with any certainty what they would do if they were in a 24 storey building which was aflame.

Never mind mystic Meg. Mystic Mogg.

lemongrove Tue 05-Nov-19 20:12:12

SirC.....it’s simply a lie to say that he said ‘ the Grenfell residents lacked common sense’ so, yes, everybody who is busy condemning him on here should hear the words he actually used.

jura2 Tue 05-Nov-19 20:15:01

lemon '' I suggest everybody listens to the whole transcript.''

I did, I am sure most commenting here have.

lemongrove Tue 05-Nov-19 20:15:27

He was ill advised to say anything at all on the subject, but lies about what he actually did say isn’t helpful.

trisher Tue 05-Nov-19 20:15:32

Here's the statement.
www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/nov/05/jacob-rees-mogg-claims-grenfell-victims-lacked-common-sense
If you say that you and the person interviewing you would have left the building and it is just common sense to do so you are inferring that anyone who did what the fire brigade said and stayed put hadn't the common sense to leave.
It isn't excusable.

SirChenjin Tue 05-Nov-19 20:15:45

I heard him several hours ago and I condemn him. His choice of words were offensive, crass and ill judged.

grapefruitpip Tue 05-Nov-19 20:16:29

" it seems the common sense thing to do".....I quote.

Anniebach Tue 05-Nov-19 20:18:26

SirChenjin. ‘Doing emotion ‘ is hugging survivors and saying loudly ‘I feel your pain’ .

The Windsors for example, the Queen has never done hugging, William and Kate never done hand holding in public,
they don’t ‘do emotion ‘

Anniebach Tue 05-Nov-19 20:20:42

‘It seems the common sense thing to do’ is not

The sensible thing to do was ‘

lemongrove Tue 05-Nov-19 20:20:59

trisher you must be able to see that it isn’t the same at all.
One is a bald statement as in....’the Grenfell residents lacked common sense in staying etc’ the other is saying what you would have done , and feeling that leaving a burning building is common sense.
I have already agreed that he shouldn’t have said anything, being a Minister being interviewed on radio isn’t the same as his private thoughts.

mcem Tue 05-Nov-19 20:24:15

lemon
1. I have listened to the transcript and stick to my opinion that he was well out out of order in saying what he said.
2. I am not blaming Johnson in his role of PM but for his role in instigating severe cutbacks in his role as mayor. Did you forget that has been an utter disaster in other roles before the present fiasco?

trisher Tue 05-Nov-19 20:25:52

lemon it's called inference. It's done all the time.

lemongrove Tue 05-Nov-19 20:26:37

How about not blaming Johnson or the Council or anyone else until the findings are out fully.Have we become a kangaroo court?

grapefruitpip Tue 05-Nov-19 20:27:42

I don't think we are discussing the Royals are we?

What a silly phrase " do emotion".

You don't have to weeping and wailing to show genuine human care.

lemongrove Tue 05-Nov-19 20:27:59

mcem I have already agreed with your first point.

SirChenjin Tue 05-Nov-19 20:30:21

Equally Annie the RF members you mention don’t tend to make such offensive comments - they ‘do emotion’ by showing care and compassion for people who have experienced trauma.

Anniebach Tue 05-Nov-19 20:44:42

Seems I am the only one this thread who questioned
‘What would I have done ‘

jura2 Tue 05-Nov-19 21:06:42

How on earth do you come to that conclusion FGS! sad

grapefruitpip Tue 05-Nov-19 21:11:01

Annie, no you are not. But it's not about you really is it?

A man lost 5 family members. 5.

Anniebach Tue 05-Nov-19 21:11:06

Because I asked if anyone else has, no one said they did

Grandma70s Tue 05-Nov-19 21:11:48

I think if the fire brigade told me to stay put I’d have stayed put. I’d have been afraid there might be fire on the stairs. I’d have believed they would rescue me.

That’s what I think I’d have done, but perhaps when faced with the reality the instinct to get away from the danger would be just too strong to resist.

Anniebach Tue 05-Nov-19 21:12:48

No grapefruit it isn’t about me but I think my question was fair,

Anniebach Tue 05-Nov-19 21:14:32

Grandma70 I thought the very same .

Eloethan Tue 05-Nov-19 21:18:48

JenniferEccles Please only speak for yourself. I did not think the residents lacked common sense. I expect they assumed that trained fire officers knew what was the best thing to do. For heaven's sake if a senior officer thought that "staying put" was the right decision, why would you expect frightened and panicking people - some elderly, disabled or parents with babies and young children - to defy the instructions given to them by those who are trained to deal with fires? (and I am not criticising the many very brave fire officers who had to deal with this dreadful incident. But I do question the ability of a senior fire officer who seemed unable to realise that this was not a text book occurrence that could be dealt with by text book procedures but a situation that urgently required evacuation.)

The fact that Rees Mogg apologised is totally irrelevant. He thought what he thought and he said what he thought. It shows the kind of shallow, unfeeling character he is. Don't try and switch it round by saying those who object to his remark do so because of "class envy". I am a Labour supporter and if any Labour politician had said what Mogg said, I would think it terrible.

What is pathetic JenniferEccles is that someone feels because a person is "unfailingly polite and well-mannered" it justifies him making the most outrageous comments about a tragedy such as this. I like politeness and good manners as much as the next person but to strongly imply that people who have had the most terrifying and life-changing experience lacked "common sense" is to my mind far beyond rude - it lacks humanity. It's particularly gutless that he, and his supporters, try to squirm out of it by saying he was just reporting what some other person or persons had said.

The next part of the inquiry, looking not at how the fire was dealt with but at all the reasons why it became uncontrollable so quickly, is the one which will hopefully prevent such a tragedy happening again.