Brexit dividing my family.

No nobody is suggesting If we leave there will be war in Europe, but regrettably trade and war often go together.

Look how Trump has unilaterally been applying tarriffs and custom duties, on friend and foe alike, as a way of establishing power over other countries and forcing them to do as he wishes. He has damaged wider relationships between the USA and other countries. He is already trying to cut in when we leave the EU, if we want an agreement with the USA, it is to be on his terms and do your really think we will have any choice in the matter?

This contrasts with the EU whcih has chosen to gather countries into the fold and to work in co-operative way between members for their greater good.

I'm sure there would be plenty of tory promoting threads if there were any reason to do so... Just one?

But we aren't going to join the Euro; isn't that project fear think....?

No, we will not join the Euro - now we are leaving, true.

We never were going to join it. But, may have to if and when we have to beg to rejoin….

I am entitled to an Irish passport and I am applying for one. My sister has already got hers.

Nought wrong with remainers applying for any passports they are entitled to - but I certainly do resent Leavers doing so, for sure. The highest form of hypocrisy- same for those who have moved to EU already and got the right to remain.

MOnica; will you adopt me, pretty please....[or won't that count...]?

Monica, do you honestly think the the EU is working for the greater good of Greece? It’s easy to find articles and information on the internet appertaining to the ‘dominant’ countries of the EU, namely Germany and France. Whose interests do you think they have in mind? The euro suits Germany, but not Greece. France is extremely protectionist of it’s own situation. The EU is neither all good, nor all bad. Remain voters and leave voters made their choice about how to vote in the referendum and neither side is absolutely correct, nor absolutely wrong because the EU is seen as good or bad, partly good or partly bad according to how the voter views the EU and from where they view the EU. Like everything, some will lose and some will gain if we stay, or if we leave the EU. But voters have the right to decide for themselves and everyone should, in my opinion, respect the choices others have made. Otherwise our democracy is dead and from that follows anarchy.

maddyone

That’s the most sensible and balanced post in the whole thread in my humble opinion

Maddyone the voice of reason, at last . And it is exactly because "one size does not fit all" in regard to the EU that I voted to leave. I absolutely respect the right of others to vote remain. What I don't respect is that, having voted, some of them will not accept the result.

What I don't respect is that, having voted, some of them will not accept the result.

Well, you'll have to respect that, Opal, because that is democracy. The right to oppose.

But if the EU isn't perfect [and nothing is] why are we giving up our right to influence what happens within the EU which ultimately affects the rest of Europe and the world?

Respect has to be earned MaizieD. And those who deliberately set out to thwart a democratic vote and refuse to uphold it are not worthy of respect.

I voted remain, have dual citizenship with Ireland and an Irish passport. I hope my remain voting family will follow suit. But I also resent leave voters applying for EU passports.

Opal; how have remainers thwarted the leave process?

And what is your solution to the Irish problem?

Another example of people blaming all remainers for us not Brexiting... I mean, it's not us! We don't have the power lol

What a sad indictment of today's politics. It's split families and the nation. My view? I'm expecting some ag from the rest of the grans netters, but I voted leave and still stand by that. I'm in a Labour stronghold so am voting Brexit Party this time round. I really believe that the UK needs to take it's independence back from the EU. I don't want us to join the planned EU army, I'm sick to death of the rules and regulations governing farming, the European Court of Human Rights telling us how to deal with our criminals and I'd really like it if our fisherman down here in the South West could fish our waters unimpeded instead of generations of fisherman becoming bankrupt. I'm in no way whatsoever a racist, I'm half German, so please don't accuse me of that. Awful isn't it? I'm already apologising for my views! How sad that I feel like that.

We have to vote against the brexitories.

Please look at the tactical voting websites and vote to stop the
tories in your constituency.

We must stop brexit.

I should add, I lived in Greece for a number of years and it was soul destroying to see what was happening. We left with very heavy hearts and returned to the UK.

I don't particularly want your respect, Opal.

I'm not interested in the 'respect' of people who support the result of a fraudulently obtained vote, or, who are (though it might not include you) about to vote for a lying, cheating charlatan just for the sake of forcing an invalid result on the country.

Leaving or remaining is not a choice being made on a personal basis. If we could have a choice of, say, a red or blue passport, to stay as we are or leave, I'd be happy with that. But the leavers are poised to drag us all off the cliff with them, so of course feelings run high.

More than a quarter of the United Kingdom’s fishing quota is in the hands of a tiny group of the country’s wealthiest families, an Unearthed investigation has found.
Just five families on the Sunday Times Rich List hold or control 29% of the UK’s fishing quota.
The finding comes from a new Unearthed investigation that traced the owners of more than 95% of UK quota holdings – including, for the first time, those of Scotland, the UK’s biggest fishing nation.
It reveals that more than two-thirds of the UK’s fishing quota is controlled by just 25 businesses – and more than half of those are linked to one of the biggest criminal overfishing scams ever to reach the British courts.
Meanwhile, in England nearly 80% of fishing quota is held by foreign owners or domestic Rich List families, and more than half of Northern Ireland’s quota is hoarded onto a single trawler.
The news comes as the government is preparing to publish a new fisheries bill, which will set the legal foundations for the UK’s fishing industry after Brexit. But while the government is hoping it can net access to more fishing rights in the Brexit negotiations, it has said the new bill will not see any redistribution of the UK’s existing quota rights.
As Unearthed’s investigation reveals, this would leave the bulk of UK fishing rights in the hands of a small domestic elite and a handful of foreign multinationals.
Responding to Unearthed’s findings, shadow environment secretary Sue Hayman said ministers needed to take “urgent action to use the powers that they have domestically to redistribute fishing quota to deliver a fairer deal for smaller boats”.
“Fishing was the poster child of the Leave campaign and [environment secretary Michael] Gove has already broken promises he made to the industry to secure full control of our waters during the transition,” she continued. “With all the talk of ‘take back control’, ministers have the power to distribute UK quota now and put the smaller-scale fleet first. So why wasn’t it mentioned in their white paper?
“This [Unearthed story] shows that, while it points the fingers at others, this government is to blame for a sector rigged in the interests of the super-rich. Any future fishing policy must consider how new and existing quota can be more fairly distributed and we will treat this as a priority in the upcoming fisheries bill.”
The investigation found:
The five largest quota-holders control more than a third of UK fishing quota
Four of the top five belong to families on the Sunday Times Rich List
The fifth is a Dutch multinational whose UK subsidiary – North Atlantic Fishing Company – controls around a quarter of England’s fishing quota
Around half of England’s quota is ultimately owned by Dutch, Icelandic, or Spanish interests
More than half (13) of the top 25 quota holders have directors, shareholders, or vessel partners who were convicted of offences in Scotland’s £63m “black fish” scam – a huge, sophisticated fraud that saw trawlermen and fish processors working together to evade quota limits and land 170,000 tonnes of undeclared herring and mackerel
One of the flagships of the “Brexit flotilla” – which sailed up the Thames in 2016 to demand the UK’s exit from the EU – is among the UK’s 10 biggest quota-holders
Around 29% of UK fishing quota is directly controlled by Rich List families. Some of these families have investments in dozens of other fishing companies, meaning companies holding 37% of UK quota are wholly or partly owned by these Rich List families.
More on this story
Big Fish quota barons squeeze out small scale fishermen
Michael Gove criticised over ‘gross inequality’ of fishing quota system


What is a fixed quota allocation?
Most fishing rights in the UK are distributed by fixed quota allocations (FQAs). An FQA gives the holder the right to land a certain share of the UK’s “total allowable catch” (TAC) of a particular stock. The TAC for each stock varies from year to year, based on scientific advice and negotiations in Brussels. There is an active market in the trading and leasing of FQAs.

The latest revelations follow Unearthed’s 2016 investigation into English quota holdings which revealed that a tiny fiberglass dinghy apparently “held” more than a fifth of the fishing quota for the entire South-West.
Now, Unearthed’s first UK-wide dive into the opaque world of fishing rights has uncovered further striking statistics.
Those with the biggest hoards of quota can earn millions leasing it to others without casting a net. In one recent case a company got rid of its boat and – while waiting for a new one – carried on earning millions from its quota alone.
That boat, the Voyager, holds more than half (55%) of Northern Ireland’s fishing quota. In late 2015 the owners disposed of their old, 76m trawler and ordered a replacement . Company accounts show that the new Voyager was not delivered until September 2017, and in the meantime, the company made money by leasing out the quota.
In 2016-17 the company made an income of nearly £7m from its quota – reporting an operating profit of £2.5m – despite having no vessel for the full financial year.
Despite holding more than half of the country’s quota, the new 86m-long Voyager has not landed its catches in Northern Ireland, because it is too big for Kilkeel Harbour. Instead the vessel operates out of the Republic of Ireland port of Killybegs.
Unearthed approached Voyager Fishing Company and its owners, but they were unavailable for comment.
The black fish millionaires
In Scotland – the biggest fishing nation in the UK, with two-thirds of the quota – the domination of the fishing industry by Rich List families is most pronounced.
Five Rich List families control a third of Scottish quota and have minority investments in companies that hold a further 11%. This means, in total, companies holding close to half (45%) of all Scottish fishing quotas are wholly or partly owned by five wealthy families.
But the investigation also reveals how many of those at the centre of one of Scottish fishing’s most infamous episodes – the black fish scandal – continue to dominate the industry.
...apologies if not all of this was copied; there was rather a lot of it and my finger stared to ache.

OMG Labaik Go get a glass of wine and a mince pie, it's not too late, it will help you sleep!!

Hi all - this is my first post and unlike many posters on this thread, I am not a political activist.

I have dipped into reading this thread during today as I had a lovely day free and started putting up some Christmas decorations. I was interested by the twists and turns the discussion took as it quickly became apparent that there is an obvious, almost professional interest from some participants, For example, the instigator of this post, Iluvsylvanianfamilies51 starts off with a family orientated story about the effects of voting leave/remain on their family. However the second part of their story becomes overtly political, directing us to various Labour/Momentum links and then the statement ‘I despise Johnson for his comments etc’ Oh dear.just when I was beginning to think this was a genuine comment and not some Momentum activist slogging away, to prop up the prospects of a Labour victory, Fair play, I admire tenacity and perseverance but not when it’s heavily disguised as some innocent bystander. How many activists do we really have on this thread? Quite a lot I would guess!!. No minds changed here but great stats to show advertisers. Maybe we are all being played???