Let it go! Let it go! Turn away and slam the door!

Whitewavemark2, there is much I can agree with in your post today @19:48. I too believe in a mixed economy for in that I own my a business.

However, the Labour Party belongs to its members and affiliate members. In 2015 that membership overwhelmingly demonstrated in the election of Jeremy Corbyn the political direction they wished the Parliamentary Labour Party to take.

However, by the release of the report under discussion, it has become obvious that there were employed members of staff working within the Labour Parties Central Office who took it upon themselves to totally disregard those democratic wishes and oppose Corbyn as leader even too the extent of taking action that would lose Labour the 2017 General Election.

What is now obvious is that such a "setup" as continues to prevail in the Labour Parties Central Office cannot be any longer allowed to exist. For while that setup is there the Labour movement as a whole will be unable to deliver politically for anyone who wishes to see a fairer society in Britain.

Therefore in the eyes of very many in the Labour movement, Starmer must now take up this whole issue as a first priority, or the whole matter will be most likely removed from his hands and the Parliamentary Labour Party will be most definitely finished for good.

grandad my last post of evening- off to read.

I believe what Starmer said this morning, - that he thought it to be an extremely serious matter, that in his opinion it was best dealt with by a totally independent body, and that it was going to be set up immediately.

I am therefore content to let matters take the proper course and am patient enough to wait the outcome.
In the meantime people are still dying. Tragedy is taking place in care homes and I weep for the elderly whose lives are being cut short for want of planning or awareness by the government.

Good night

It wasn't shoved down our throats Whitewave, why would you assume that?
Rather as you describe, solid Labour but not middle class.

Just discussed freely at the dinner table

EllanVannin Yes, I did read about it and it was talked about on Gransnet. That was one person - and to suggest that all Labour people would be celebrating if Johnson died is insulting and ridiculous.

The reports that certain sections of the Labour Party conspired to work against Corbyn throughout his tenure, doing everything possible to discredit him and sabotage Labour's chances in an election, comes as no surprise to me. It appears that some people in the party are outraged, in effect saying that the report is not to be trusted and is just a distraction. However, from what I have read, there are e mails to evidence the absolutely disgraceful behaviour of these people.

It's unlikely, understandably in the current crisis, that this will get the coverage it would normally deserve. Hopefully, though, these matters will be properly aired at a later date and action will be taken against these people who deserve to be kicked out of the party for their treacherous behaviour.

Eloethan Is there a link anywhere to the original report or, at least, an authoritative precis of it? All I seem to be able to fid is second and third hand stuff and opinions.

callistemon honestly people are so touchy on this forum! I didn’t mean to imply that it was.

Next time try something like “no it wasn’t shoved down ours either”

And I was trying to describe my family originally as a-typical labour voters. Not so much these days.

Life would be so much gentler if people could just be more thoughtful.

Dear oh dear.

callistemon actually I sound a bit touchy in that post. Please ignore it???

growstuff and me

Whitewave it's this isolation.
I wasn't being touchy at all, just thought you had misunderstood.
My parents were quite laissez-faire when I think about it.

Probably callistemon must admit I’m beginning to miss going out to eat, the theatre I’m missing all the bluebells in some woods we visit every year, I’m missing the glory that is spring, with all the new leaves and bird song.etc. I am lucky to have a garden and should be grateful for small measures. Must give myself a talking to.
Only another unspecified weeks to go.☹️ Hey ho.

To return to the main theme of the thread, Iain McNicol has now stepped down as the Labour Party leader in the House of Lords due to the release of the report on the actions of staff in the Labour party Central Office.

Apparently, McNicol is repeatedly referred to in the eight hundred and fifty-page document especially in regard to his position of General Secretary in the period from 2015 until 2018 when at that time he was relieved of the position.

Much in the report also refers to the continuation beyond the above date of the disgusting actions of members of staff at Central Office with staff in both Corbyn's and Jenny Formby's offices being referred to in highly derogatory personal terms.

By example, Corbyn's chief of staff, Karie Murphy is referred to as “Medusa”, “crazy”, and a “bitch face cow”. There is much more in equal to the above example in the report which without a doubt marks an all-time low in the history of the Parliamentary Labour Party.

Starmer has announced an "independent review" into the matter, but he seems more interested in how the report came to be released into the public domain rather than what is in its substance.

Len McCluskey, the general secretary of the Unite union, condemned the “rancid, and very cruel, political culture” exposed in the report, and called for officials implicated in the report to be suspended from the party.

McCluskey speaking out on the issue at this early stage demonstrates, I feel, the pressure he must be coming under from his senior activists by way of their disgust at the Central Office employee actions to which members of the Unite Union contribute to their salaries.

Therefore there will be no turning away and slamming of the door on the Jeremy Corbyn period as Leader of the Parliamentary Labour Party for a substantial period of time to come.

Indeed, this report may turn out to be the first epitaph written on this shambles of a political party.

Link to a Guardian report on the issue can be found here:-

www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/apr/15/labour-must-turn-its-back-on-factionalism-says-keir-starmer

John McDonnell has joined growing numbers of prominent figures in the Labour movement calling on Keir Starmer to "go further" in his response to a leaked internal report on the conduct Labour's Central Office employees and officials. McDonald is claiming large numbers of "angry" members are leaving the party as a result of its contents.

Going further than any other Senior Elected member of the party, McDonnell called for the immediate suspension of some current and former staff and others named in the document, pending the results of the independent investigation instigated by the new party leader.

The dossier, which was leaked at the weekend, claimed factional hostility towards Jeremy Corbyn contributed to Labour's ineffective handling of antisemitism complaints.

The former shadow chancellor further stated the document should be provided to the Equalities and Human Rights Commission investigation into the party "warts and all", adding: "I think the truth has got to come out.

Should the document be provided to the Equalities and Human Rights Commission then prosecutions could follow in regard to what is alleged to have been carried out.

I find it ironic that those who accused members on left of the party (such as those within Momentum) of destroying Labours electability are now to be seen as those who may have now completely destroyed the Parliamentary Labour Party.

Just Unelected Total Two Faced Bast*rds

Most of late DH's cousins were/are far left Corbynistas, and I was shocked to read some of the comments I saw on FB that one of two of them shared about Boris when he was in intensive care. Not original posts but sharing some of the most vitriolic comments I have ever read.
And I see no reason to mention Corbyn, he's gone. Neither have I seen any recent posts about him.

Blue Sapphire in regard to your above post, no one can now state or has ever been able to state that Momentum or any other section on the left of the Labour Party "broke the law" in anything they carried out while achieving their positions in the Labour party.

However, there now seems to be ever-growing evidence that right factions in the Labour Party who have consistently accused the left of any number of misdeeds have themselves acted in a way that is below contempt in regard to democracy within the party. They have also possibly acted illegally in regard to equality, financial fraud, workplace grievance and disciplinary legislation, and human rights.

Personally, I hope if what is alleged in the released document is correct then those referred too in that report finish up in the slammer.

For they are nothing short of utter slime.

Democracy within the party, democracy in the party vanish
when Corbyn became leader.

Granddad I agree with every word you have written. I am furious and heartbroken that these self-serving individuals’ only agenda was to destroy Jeremy Corbyn and the socialist element of the party and to that end they were actively working to prevent a labour victory at the 2017 election. If Keir Starmer does not speak out more strongly and suspend the individuals named pending his independent enquiry then he will lose all credibility in my eyes. I am particularly disgusted that two of these individuals; Emilie Oldknow and John Stolliday, now occupy senior positions in my old union, Unison. Not only that but Unison’s general secretary Dave Prentis has said they have his full backing. Disgraceful. I have read some of the comments in Emilie Oldknow’s emails and they are vile.

night owl, many thanks for your post @10:28 today, at last someone on the forum has called this situation exactly as it is.

As John John McDonald has pointed out there are claimed wrongdoings on all sides in regard to the antisemitism allegations.

However, as the Jeremy Corbyn and Jennie Formby offices were attempting to resolve those issues there were employees and others at Labours Central Office deliberately holding back documentation that both the above offices urgently required.

To add to the above, it is alleged that money was fraudulently moved to prominent anti Corbyn MPs at election time to aid their campaigns so as to create an impression that those right-wing candidates received better support than those on the left.

However, to then think that those same persons at Central office then actively campaigned against a labour victory in the 2017 election campaign is just simply unbelievable.

There are rumours within the Unite Union that Jennie Formby is on the verge of resigning as General Secretary over all that has happened and returning to a position within the Unite Union.

The above would be understandable following her having just beaten cancer and now to have all the above on land in her office. As a very large Unite Union branch we have sent to her asking her to remain in position as that could help ensure the future of the Parliamentary Labour Party which I feel is now in great doubt at this present time.

Starmer needs to get a grip and to come out actively in full support of Formby rather than preaching on the lockdown to which he can have no effect on due to the actions of those in his own Central Office.

No-one has a link to the actual report?

MaizieD the report is eight hundred and sixty pages in length. All there are available at the present time are leaked sections that have been given to the press.

However, Jonh McDonald and others are calling for the document to be handed over in full to the Equality and Human Rights Commission along with simultaneous full release to the public.

I believe it could only be Jennie Formby's office who could authorise such an action as the report encompasses activities across all the Labour movement and not just the Parliamentary Labour Party.

Gagajo It is PTSD. caused by having such an inadequte person leading a major party for so long. On a par with Anne Widdicombe being leader of the Consevatives. Yes, I know, you shudder at the thought and think nobody ever would elect her as a leader of anything. Except that Labour did the equivalent and Corbyn still has many supporters left.

People keep harping about it because it keeps playing through their minds, again and again and again and......... What has been done to a previous great and proud party and how on earth did it happen and how can they make sure it never happens again.

I would also add that the comments made about Diane Abbott in particular, and the harassment she experienced which is evident from emails and messages shared between these disgusting individuals were beyond vile. They showed themselves to be racist, misogynistic and thoroughly without morals. As the leader of a party supposedly committed to fighting discrimination and injustice wherever it occurs Keir Starmer surely has to condemn these words and actions without reservation.

MOnica, I can appreciate how Labour supporters may feel that way. I don't agree, but that is irrelevant.

I don't get why Tory voters keep banging on that's all.

Given the racism (towards Abbot - I don't believe there is any anti-semitism, it was a straw man to weaken the party), the infighting and the lies told within the Labour party I am very disinclined to support them at the moment. I WILL vote for them, because I know the Tories are worse (only appeal to their own interests and the interests of the 'haves' in society, strip the country of its assets to line wealthy pockets even further).

Corbyn wasn't corrupt. He is a good, dedicated politician. BUT he's gone. Onwards, if not upwards. I don't envy Kier the work he has ahead of him. No doubt he'll be attacked as JC was from inside and have his integrity trashed by the corrupt opposition.

I have never been abl to bring myself to vote for either of the main parties, althugh I have come closer to voting Labour than Conservative.

M0nica, whatever anyone thinks in regard to Jerremy Corbyn he was elected with the largest majority ever obtained in a Labour Party leadership election.

There were then employees and others at Labours Central Office who decided they would not accept the result of that election and therefore took it upon themselves to work against Corbyn even to the extent of functioning to bring about the loss of the 2017 General Election to the Party.

As to what happens now with the Parliamentary Labour Party, in the short term that may well depend on key figures such as Jennie Formby the General Secretary of the entire Labour movement.

In the long term, the organisation and functioning of the Parliamentary Party was already under discussion by the broader Labour movement and that discussion will now obviously be stepped up by that body and within that, there are several scenarios which may come about.

However, I feel their is far worse to come out of this report, but that information cannot be released at this time as illegal acts may be involved with prosecutions yet to come.

i quite agree he was legally elected with much support. the only explanation is that the collective mind of the Labour party went AWOl or they all ate magic mushrooms, but that he was other than an unmitigated disaster for the party is incontestable. Never before have so many core voters (the people who really matter) voted against the party they have given their lifetimes to supporting.

Even then the Great Leader was talking about 'an election lost but an argument won' ??????????????????????????????????????