New EU Treaty - a good deal or not?

Sticking my neck out, it’s too soon to be critical, I for one am very pleased we have a deal, it will take time to find out all the detail, already tge stock market is going up and business more hopeful.
White wave, I find your condemnation of others views rude and juvenile, to comment on someone lack of intelligence says more about you, others can have a valid opinion even if it differs from your views, of which I certainly do not share. That’s democracy. It’s good manners to respect others viewpoint.

Mamie

David0205 If you read my post of 1703, you will see that the vast majority are not cancelling our accounts. We have lost Barclaycard after 50 years but the UK bank account is fine.

Many thousands have lost accounts, Lloyds alone over 13000, depending on the country you are resident others are saying wait and see, at present our standards are the same, if we diverge accounts will close

Sparkling

Sticking my neck out, it’s too soon to be critical, I for one am very pleased we have a deal, it will take time to find out all the detail, already tge stock market is going up and business more hopeful.
White wave, I find your condemnation of others views rude and juvenile, to comment on someone lack of intelligence says more about you, others can have a valid opinion even if it differs from your views, of which I certainly do not share. That’s democracy. It’s good manners to respect others viewpoint.

But I didn’t!! Did you actually read what I said?

I am beginning to think that people are much more prepared to bicker than to discuss the issue.

I expect most posters are happy with the deal, or reasonably so anyway.
I realise that some are unhappy it’s worked out well and would have preferred the Armageddon that they were predicting all this year.Now all they can do is to moan about Scottish seed potatoes and the Erasmus programme.?

It is not too early at all for experts in so many fields to analyse this deal and see it what it is. Better than No Deal- but only just. All the evidence is there, for all to see, all who are prepared to open their eyes.

1 in 14 are employed in the Financial sector- how many in fishing?

biba70

clearly identified in the quote.

Biba from your decades in the U.K. you will have become familiar with the convention in writing (and indeed tge common courtesy ) of referring to a person as he/she/they only after referring to them by name first.
You had not referred to Urmstongran by name therefore it was bad manners to wade in with she.

lemongrove Of course no-one would have preferred "Armageddon" - that would mean preferring to have the country go down the drain! There are good parts of this deal, and it is definitely better than having no deal at all with our nearest neighbours anbiggest market.

However, there are some people who will definitely be left out in the cold to pay for it (quite a lot of people, actually, and whole industries or areas of the country could be affected, making pockets of dereliction) Forgetting the cost in the euphoria of completing the negotiation would be to ignore them.

As said, totally irrelevant MawBe- as the person was clearly identified, I felt it was perfectly appropriate. However if it did cause offense to Urmstongran- I am happy to apologise.

I think it was Theresa May who said that no deal was better than a bad deal.

She was wrong. We seem to have a bad deal, indeed a very bad deal, but it is still better than no deal.

Damage limitation, but better than the ultimate damage of no-deal.

www.theparliamentmagazine.eu/news/article/the-no-deal-is-better-than-a-bad-deal-fallacy

Some studies estimate the increase in UK food prices alone could be as much as eight per cent, in addition to those already created by the devaluation of the pound following the referendum.

Yet the impacts are not just financial or trade-related. A report from the UK House of Commons' cross-party foreign affairs committee highlights the difficulties that UK citizens in other EU countries, and EU citizens in the UK, would face on issues such as residence rights, access to healthcare, employment rights, cross-border civil law disputes and pensions if we exit with no arrangements in place. It would also take our universities out of European research programmes, our police out of cross-border crime-fighting systems and our airlines out of EU skies.

Eurosceptics argue that the UK would be able to compensate for the economic shock of leaving the EU without a deal, by concluding FTAs with other countries. The sequencing makes this a complete fallacy. We may be able to start discussions, but our counterparts will want to know exactly what our future relationship with the EU is going to be before they can negotiate meaningfully.

In particular, they will want to know whether Britain hopes to retain its membership of any aspect of the single market and what customs arrangements are in place with the EU before they can develop their own position. The nature of our deal with the EU will materially change the calculations for any third country considering signing a bilateral deal with the UK. This is likely to take years.

We are discussing it lemongrove, and you appear to be moaning about people moaning as you describe it.

Of course no-one would have preferred Armageddon. As I have already said on this thread no deal would have increased my son’s risk of tonic clonic seizures by risking his medication supply. I’m sure you are aware that those come with a risk of death or brain damage & that messing with medication increases the risk of SUDEP.

So of course I am relieved it didn’t go to no deal.

They need to know what their constituents need. I have written to my MP numerous times in the last 20 years (of red and blue tinges

My MP always follows everything up, seeks answers and writes or emails back with a full answer.

He is, however, a staunch Brexiteer.

So from what I understand the U.K. has agreed to comply with EU level playing field rule in order to obtain tariff free trade as well as other benefits like haulier freedom etc.

Does anyone thing that the headbangers will be content with that.

Not thing it should be think

I am puzzled by the retention of that and most of all by the Partnership.

Sticking my neck out, it’s too soon to be critical,

Not too soon for the trade negotiation experts, the business people, the lawyers, journalists and other interested experts, who spent their Christmas and Boxing days examining the published deal (1500+ pages) and posting their conclusions on social media.

The consensus so far seems to be that the EU have got what they wanted and made some cosmetic concessions to the UK.

The UK has tariff and quota free access to the single market for goods (but not services) while it continues to comply with EU standards and regulations. An 'arbitration body' in the case of disputes that is not the ECJ, but is made up of 'judicially qualified (i.e judges) persons from the EU & UK. And this new Partnership Council of 19 committees and 4 working groups to meet regularly to monitor the implementation of the FTA.
So, a bit BRINO...

I for one am very pleased we have a deal, it will take time to find out all the detail, already tge stock market is going up and business more hopeful.

I'm quite surprised at how calmly Leavers are taking this, seeing that it binds us pretty closely to the EU.
I'm interested in what the ERG group will have to say to it...

As to business being more hopeful, only in so far as it is not 'no deal'. Anger at being given such a short time to prepare, and worry about the impact of non tariff barriers on SMEs which trade with the EU. As this thread demonstrates:

twitter.com/Flakmagnet1/status/1342817805180297219

Ostriches don't need to read it, of course...

maizie that’s why I am trying to get some comment from ardent leavers. I can’t see that they can possibly be prepared to accept this deal. It seems to go against everything they were arguing for.

I was fully expecting to be appalled by 1st January, but the wind has been totally taken out of my sails!

Of course there are problems but I am astounded tbh.

And what is the ERG going to say.? Not that it makes any odds to the deal as it will get through.

I am prepared for anyone to tell me that I have got it wrong and that in fact it’s def and not abc but at the moment I am amazed!

What we mustn’t forget is that lions share of the U.K. trade are services and that has yet to be negotiated.

Perhaps the truth is that leavers will be mollified because “Brexit is done” regardless of the deal?

Does anyone know if we have left the Galileo system? If so what are we going to rely on?

A spokesman for the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy said: “The government has set a clear ambition for a sovereign space programme which will bring long-term strategic and commercial benefits for the U.K. Work is ongoing across government to determine the U.K.’s positioning, navigation and timing requirements, and assessing options for meeting them.

“The U.K. will not participate in the EU’s Galileo programme. Current OneWeb satellites are used to deliver satellite communications services.
Definitely scrapping Theresa Mays hugely expensive plan.
Answers all over the internet WW if you really want to know instead of trying to look as though you have a superior intellect with your questions.

“ of trying to look as though you have a superior intellect with your questions.”

Bit rude if I may say

LauraNorder

A spokesman for the Department for Business, Energy and Industrial Strategy said: “The government has set a clear ambition for a sovereign space programme which will bring long-term strategic and commercial benefits for the U.K. Work is ongoing across government to determine the U.K.’s positioning, navigation and timing requirements, and assessing options for meeting them.

“The U.K. will not participate in the EU’s Galileo programme. Current OneWeb satellites are used to deliver satellite communications services.
Definitely scrapping Theresa Mays hugely expensive plan.
Answers all over the internet WW if you really want to know instead of trying to look as though you have a superior intellect with your questions.

Is asking a question now classed as showing superior intellect?

Bit weird.

I looked and looked, but couldn’t find the answer, only I thought that we had abandoned the planned replacement as late as this autumn?

Well I guess we will find out on Jan 1st. Anyone planning a flight that day????

However I am still open to an answer to my question???.

My sense tells me that we must still be using the Galileo system as how on earth are we to navigate if not?

It might be that as it is a civilian system, our military will have to stop using it? I know that doesn’t make sense, but how else are we leaving? Maybe in research?

The bottom line is, brexit supporters will think it’s marvellous whatever the details are - they admit it on here. Whereas it was all “we are taking back control of our waters” is shown to be a complete lie and conveniently forgotten, with 80% fishing still being owned by foreign corporations and a few wealthy individuals, and the EU getting the concessions it wanted. We had a taste of no deal chaos at Dover and the free trade of goods was essential. So we gave in rather than paid, but guess what people actually don’t care. They don’t care about academic, scientific or police cooperation either , happy to sit back and let those giant intellects of the tory party gaslight the apathetic majority. They admit it.

Whitewavemark2

However I am still open to an answer to my question???.

My sense tells me that we must still be using the Galileo system as how on earth are we to navigate if not?

It might be that as it is a civilian system, our military will have to stop using it? I know that doesn’t make sense, but how else are we leaving? Maybe in research?

There are 4 satnav systems GPS (USA) Galileo (EU) Glonass (Russia) Beidou(China). The vast majority use GPS which is open source for general use, the US has committed to maintain the system for public use without degradation, so navigation breakdown will not happen.
Galileo was developed as a civilian alternative to GPS and has a communication system added, modern navigation instruments are able to switch between different systems. As we are NATO members the military will be using GPS for sure.