New EU Treaty - a good deal or not?

We have accepted it , I am not chaining myself to the railings. It's too sleety here for a start. Talking about the deal is not the same as not accepting it. I didnt vote Tory I accept that they are in government but continue to discuss their policies and disagree with many of the decisions they make, this does not mean I dont accept they are in power.

If the President of the CBI, a vocal remainer, can see positivity in this deal then why can't we?

' This is a big step and a mighty relief for many firms. With a trade deal agreed, vaccine roll-outs starting and rapid mass testing, this can be a springboard to make 2021 a year of recovery. '

All I can see here is massive relief that we didn't end up with no deal, which would have been completely disastrous for most businesses. Some recovery is inevitable next year, if mass testing and vaccination are successful. But the given the constraints of non tariff barriers and no foreseeable new (not the current rolled over ones) large FTAs (and not a lot to offer in negotiating them) the prospect for future years is more one of slow decline than of increased prosperity.

' Importantly, a deal provides a platform on which to build and strengthen the UK-EU relationship in the years to come .'

It could do that, but only if our government wills and enables it. 8,000 lorries on a disused airfield just before Christmas may have forced Johnson into agreeing a deal but who's to say that he and his government have any intention to stick with it?

There's another agenda being pursued by the hard right which doesn't fit with a closer relationship with the EU. Low taxes (for the wealthy), low wages (for the rest), emasculating the judiciary, sidelining Parliament, repealing the HRA, and deregulation is their objective.

I was reading an interesting article a couple of days ago that argued that the current government should be seen as the rentier class and not as Tories were traditionally seen as the party of business.

I think that their is strong evidence for this argument.

I do wonder why Johnson is described as a one nation Tory when he clearly isn’t.

Yes. I suspect it is another spin put out, from a populist government.

Most of the front bench are wealthy, not as a result of running a successful business in the traditional sense of buying and selling or manufacturing.

Their wealth comes from the money markets and the rentier class.

This is an interesting analysis of Johnson’s claim to be a one nation Tory journals.openedition.org/rfcb/5693

The Republic of Ireland is to fund EHIC cards and Erasmus scheme for residents in Northern Ireland. Lucky old them.

Apparently the ERG ‘star chamber’ (what a bunch of saddos) are giving their verdict at 2pm

It can go in the bin Nezumi, along with the other saddos opinions, John McDonnell and groupies maligning Sir Keir for recommending passing it!

vegansrock

The Republic of Ireland is to fund EHIC cards and Erasmus scheme for residents in Northern Ireland. Lucky old them.

The BBC news last night were reporting that reciprocal health care would continue between UK and EU. and valid EHIC cards were to be accepted. (Some folks forget to renew them)

and valid EHIC cards were to be accepted

Only until they expire. Then it's the, as yet non-existent, Global medical card...

I renewed ours in November just as they were about to expire - instead of listening to the disaster merchants! The six Ps and all that!

Just get good travel insurance cover, the EHIC cards were never meant to cancel a need for it especially for older people who have a slew of health conditions.

Pantglas2

It can go in the bin Nezumi, along with the other saddos opinions, John McDonnell and groupies maligning Sir Keir for recommending passing it!

Saddos (Saddoes?) indeed Pantglas ??

There's absolutely no need at all for Labour to vote for the 'deal' It's a rotten deal but the bill will pass without their help. It would take a huge tory rebellion to defeat it, even if all other MPs voted against or abstained.

The ERG have approved the deal I see. What’s important for us all right now however, is to know how the deal affects us so could I recommend looking at an article on Martin Lewis’s money saving expert.com titled “22 Brexit Need-to- Knows” which has just pinged in to my in box and which will be updated as they plough through the paperwork. No political axes to grind just straightforward facts. Whether you like them or not is a different matter.

What Labour do is largely irrelevant. I don’t know why KS is whipping support for it but it doesn’t make any difference whether de does or doesn’t

Norn Parties - of both sides of the political divide- voting against is more interesting. I thought the DUP would but didn’t know which way the SDLP would go. Wonder what the Sinners think - it looks to me to be something that will push towards reunification - definitely brings norn closer to Dublin & everything I have heard so far will ensure the young in Northern Ireland see the benefits of Eu membership.

Just to say it is not just the left wing of the Labour party that is advising Keir Starmer not to support the Government. It is also some of Keir Starmer's supporters, such as Ben Bradshaw. It is not a left or right issue.

Is anyone else puzzled by the fact that the country has, supposedly, regained itself sovereignty but is being ruled by a party within a party within a party: the creepily names Star Chamber? And everyone seems quite ok about it.

MayBee70

Is anyone else puzzled by the fact that the country has, supposedly, regained itself sovereignty but is being ruled by a party within a party within a party: the creepily names Star Chamber? And everyone seems quite ok about it.

Absolutely! But been true for a few years now.

I think Star Chamber is a very apt name tbh. It was around during Elizabeth 1 period and beyond and was known for its abuse of power and oppression that resulted from the abuse.

And for what it’s worth I think it is no accident that they chose that name.

What Labour do is largely irrelevant. I don’t know why KS is whipping support for it but it doesn’t make any difference whether de does or doesn’t

It does for the future. It's a bad deal (and Labour knows it is) , but if Labour support it it will be thrown in their face any time they criticise any adverse consequences.

Look what happened to Starmer when he initially said he supported govt. action on covid. Any criticism he makes now of govt. covid strategy brings accusations of failing to support. It goes down well with the hard of thinking..

Re: Erasmus

Boris said it has been a difficult decision to pull out but that it was just too expensive to the UK to continue as more EU students than British benefitted by it.

Apparently Rishi Sunak confirmed funding for an alternative to Erasmus+ (Turing) in the one-year spending review in November. Under the British student-mobility programme, the U.K. government would fund British students to go abroad but would not be expected to support EU students taking up courses in British universities.

Yes that’s ones reasons why it’s not as good as Erasmus - people see benefit in people coming here. They also contribute to the economy (figures easily found via google) if we are going to judge the value of everything in terms of money.

I think he’ll be criticised whatever he does Mazie. I know he is (sensibly) trying to get the Tories to own it. Personally I would like to see him abstain, but in terms of the core passing it makes no difference.

Ireland is going to fund Erasmus for itself young people I believe.

So NI will be funded by Dublin to remain in EHIC and Erasmus - seems the U.K. government is doing with Brexit what the IRA failed to achieve.