Mr Johnson and Mr Cummings

Sir Edward Lister who has stepped aside from a governmental post after only 2 months, has told The Sunday Times that Cummings lives in fear of imprisonment over Brexit and the fraud and lies committed.

Time this was re-visited and some proper investigation carried out.

I suspect Cummings is not the only one.

I’m sure Dyson wasn’t the only contender for provision of ventilators. Boris wouldn’t have put all his eggs in one basket.

I think we’ve forgotten how scared we all felt this time last year. A new virus. No vaccine to hand (yet) and every country scrambling to contain it. Everyone was fearful.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

I think the main point to take away from the Dyson affair, is not that Johnson was trying his best. He wasn’t. He was doing a mate a favour at the tax payers expense.

But Johnson was intent on trying to carry out an illegal act with regard to tax law.

That is the big issue here.

MaizieD

^Boris = doing his best in hard times. We thought we needed more ventilators at that point, so he pulled strings behind the scenes to make it happen. I doubt that most normal folk will see much wrong with that.^

I think most normal people would say "If we need more ventilators why don't we get ventilator manufacturers to step up production and spend some money supporting them if necessary?"

At the risk of annoying Galaxy, I would say that anyone thinking that initiating a lengthy process of design and approval of complex medical equipment in an emergency when approved designs were already out there and available, was a good idea, has got to be not very bright...

We have structures in this country for example NHSE who within an hour could have identified all the ventilator manufacturers who had already supplied hospitals. Within the next hour these manufacturers could have been contacted as to availability of supplies and possibility of increasing production. There is evidence that in fact manufacturers did contact the DH and never received a call back. FGS Urm instead we set a ( Tory Brexiter ) vacuum manufacturer on designing from scratch what is well known as a complex piece of equipment?

Nothing wrong with that at all ???

I’ve got some sympathy with Urmstongran’s first sentence, most people aren’t that interested in politics. This is an important issue, and I don’t know if it’s just me that feels this, but (and I’m saying this as a Labour supporter myself) please can we not derail yet another thread about the government into Labour issues which are being repeated ad infinitum on other threads and criticising other people on Gransnet for not being as switched on, pc, aware, politically astute, intelligent or whatever you want to call it please, it just kills any discussion?

Despite Grany’s comment It’s actually worth looking at the newspaper headlines this morning, it’s clear that the thinking press are seeing that there are serious issues with sleaze in the government. Only the Mail on Sunday is outright blaming Cummings, the others are either avoiding it altogether (presumably because it’s too controversial for the headlines?), or saying that answers are needed.

I would also hope that most normal people would say that a time of national crisis is actually the time when we need integrity, lack of corruption, etc or people will die.

Hmmmmm. There's a Violet Elizabeth Cummings flavour to Cumming's outpourings.
The perfect PM with a lily white government has yet to be elected at any time or place. This is a lovely drama for the tabloids to feed on.
I do know that Boris has many shortcomings however when history is written he'll be remembered for 'getting Brexit done' and getting the vaccines commissioned, ordered and rolled out. Cummings will be remembered for his trip to Barnard Castle. Two silly men.

You arent annoying me, if I became annoyed every time I saw the word MSM and stupid in the same sentence I would never be finished, although I admit I can feel myself twitch when I see it .
You cant call the electorate stupid and expect them to vote for you, people just dont work like that. So Johnson or Gove will remain until someone (hopefully Starmer) recognises the futility of that approach.

@suziewoozie 08.33 ???

Sorry, Maybee, but she's right.

Boris = doing his best in hard times. We thought we needed more ventilators at that point, so he pulled strings behind the scenes to make it happen. I doubt that most normal folk will see much wrong with that.

I think most normal people would say "If we need more ventilators why don't we get ventilator manufacturers to step up production and spend some money supporting them if necessary?"

At the risk of annoying Galaxy, I would say that anyone thinking that initiating a lengthy process of design and approval of complex medical equipment in an emergency when approved designs were already out there and available, was a good idea, has got to be not very bright...

Yes I can see you dont think much of the people who were core of the labour vote grany.

Callistemon

I can see what Maybee means; Boris blunders through life, not being unpleasant and thinking himself charming, full of bonhomie, but leaving chaos in his wake.

Cummings seems intense, underhand and vengeful. It was surprising that he got caught out lying so easily - he seems more devious than that.

You’re just infantilising him - a pleasant blunder to have a 4 year affair , sometimes using the marital bed, taking her on trade missions and giving her tax payers money? A pleasant blunder to lie so egregiously in your national newspaper column that you were sacked for i? A pleasant blunder whilst on the opposition front bench to lie about another yet another affair and be sacked for it? A pleasant blunder whilst Foreign Secretary to not bother to read your brief and thereby contribute to keeping a woman for years in a foreign jail? A pleasant blunder to go for popularity over leadership and help bring about the death of thousands of your fellow citizens?

God give me strength - Cummings at least is a WYSIWYG and having him as his chief adviser was yet another of Johnson’s charming blunders?

We’re talking about the PM here, not someone down the local pub

When I have asked on this forum all I have heard was a repetition of the MSM anti Corbyn propaganda. Which was always as emotive and fact free as the anti EU propaganda

That's true MaisieD

And Galaxy Lots of people don't use critical thinking just take what the newspapers sell them, propaganda as fact. in my opinion.

Johnson broke covid guidelines consistently as well. If that was doing his best then he really isnt up to the job.

I think this whole affair is being blown up by folk with more interest in politics than your average member of the public has.

Cummings = Barnard Castle. Privileged rule breaker when the rest of us were shut up at home under pain of arrest, hence little public sympathy.

Boris = doing his best in hard times. We thought we needed more ventilators at that point, so he pulled strings behind the scenes to make it happen. I doubt that most normal folk will see much wrong with that.

Worthy rather worty.

I have voted labour all my life however I think part of the reason we are sitting here with a Tory government, is the constant implication that those who read MSM are somehow stupid and that their concerns are not worty of recognition.

...

So vote for the sleaze bag liar Johnson
He is selling off the NHS
You were warned.

You got what you voted for

Just for once I absolutely agree with you, Grany. I have struggled ever since the 2019 GE to understand what, precisely, would have been wrong with a Labour government.

When I have asked on this forum all I have heard was a repetition of the MSM anti Corbyn propaganda. Which was always as emotive and fact free as the anti EU propaganda.

Yes that's true anyone but Corbyn. Blair the war monger, Mandelson, government, different groups Newspapers 5 years of attacks and smears everything was thrown at Corbyn People in his own party writing disgusting WhatsApp messages.

Thousands went to his rallies membership up by hundreds of thousands.

Millions of people don't follow politics but do read the billionaire press which said don't vote for Corbyn we don't want a socialist government

So vote for the sleaze bag liar Johnson
He is selling off the NHS
You were warned.

You got what you voted for

And the cynic in me says while we are distracted by this, what are we missing?

Johnson has I feel has handled the pandemic well, apart from a shaky start, he has proved himself loyal to uk. Fear he is doomed with Carrie, he has a history with women, she is no exception, she is too interfering, also you know what happens when you marry the mistress,mattered neen quite a few before her and no doubt a few to come. Cummings, well he showed his loyalty at the height of the pandemic when the rest of us were obeying the rules he showed himself for what he is, his face is frequently contorted with anguished bitterness. . Unfortunately we can't expect anyone in government to be all things to all men, just have to look at the intentions and aims and if they are loyal to uk. . Labour had fast become a joke,with Corbyn, that why we voted in Boris. Boris will move on and another flawed hero will take centre stage. I cannot think of anyone I would want in top position from any party. Look at the scandal with Cameron, with Blair and Iraq, I've come to think politicians have a mind set unique to the lot of them, but we need them unfortunately. Yes we do want ethical government but sone times you gave yo look at the greater good. I suppose there us always Trump he's looking for a puts to fill, it puts our problems in the shade.

Did Johnson suck up to Dyson because he is in a moral vacuum?

"Revenge is a dish best served cold" - and Cummings has had the perfect opportunity to put the boot in.

I think both Cummings and Johnson are disreputable, manipulative characters. "What an absolute shower", as Terry Thomas used to say.

I can see what Maybee means; Boris blunders through life, not being unpleasant and thinking himself charming, full of bonhomie, but leaving chaos in his wake.

Cummings seems intense, underhand and vengeful. It was surprising that he got caught out lying so easily - he seems more devious than that.