Mr Johnson and Mr Cummings

'Brillig' if you're talking about 'slithy toads' surely.

Callistemon

^Nice point - but he is PM and no one should be excusing his behaviour as if he were a child ( although he is)^

I'm not excusing him.
PMs do need advisers but not to the extent that one seems to run the whole of government - that is why people do vote for a party and leader of choice. They hope for someone strong and competent.
It has been a worrying trend in recent years.

That's why so many voted against their principles because they felt they couldn't vote for Corbyn and whoever was advising him.
I doubt many lifelong Labour voters read the right wing press but yet they didn't vote for Corbyn. Thousands may have joined the Labour party as Grany says but that didn't matter when it came to the ballot box.
It won't matter next time either because, although the left wing of the LP despise Starmer, he may well get in.

Dyed in the wool voters of any party are not the ones who decide when it comes to the GE.
Last time it was amazing that even traditional Labour voters voted Tory and Johnson. It was a vote against Corbyn.

Anyway, that is old ground but entirely relevant because it led to where we are now.

Oh come on Callistemon I don't believe many people voted for Johnson because they thought he was "Strong and confident"! I suspect the Red Wall voted for him because they thought he was a bit different and would screw up the stuffed shirts in Westminster (and get Brexit done)
Don't know why you imagine lefties don't read the right wing press I know LP stalwarts who read the Telegraph.

Starmer as I've said before is classic Westminster and a Remainer to boot, why would those voters vote for him and not for someone like Rishi?

I was watching a programme on Ch5 last night about Edward VII which said that he saved the monarchy and the people loved him even though he was grossly overweight from a life of excess, had numerous mistresses who he happily flaunted (one of whom probably had a child by him but was incarcerated in a mental asylum for-the rest of her life to protect him); wasn’t particularly bright etc etc. Of course I couldn’t but help but notice the similarities with Johnson, especially as it appeared to be the poor people that seemed to think he cared about and represented them in some way. I thought about it for some time and eventually nodded off feeling totally confused about people.

Please don’t tar all Labour supporters with the same brush GrannyGravy13, as you’ve probably noticed Labour supporters aren’t a homogenous mass by any means!

Most of us want to see fair play, and where there are serious questions, for it to be properly investigated and brought out in the open. I think most Tory voters want the same thing, none of want corruption in our government if that’s what it turns out to be. Despite attempts to keep taking it back there by some people, on this occasion this isn’t about the Labour Party, the public voted for a Tory government, and they should be held to account, as should any government of whatever persuasion.

So why do people think that Rishi who is incredibly rich and is (allegedly) selling off British jobs to India to his wife’s connections represents them in any way?

That was not my intention Casdon we are all individuals and have our reasons however we vote.

GrannyGravy13

Grany

So people chose a sleaze bag and liar Johnson who would sell the NHS, but not attacked and smeared Corbyn couldn't wonder at it I suppose.

But thoses who chose a Liar and sleaze bag you've got what you have voted for.

In the Times Cummings is blaming Johnson for thousands of covid deaths not locking down sooner he has a written dossier which he will present.

How ironic the whole of last year Labour MPs and supporters were calling Dominic Cummings all sorts of unflattering names, he was liar, a Machiavellian puppet master etc.

Now Labour are hanging on his coattails and his every word...

Oh come on GG . It would be foolish in the extreme not to listen to DC when he’s dishing the dirt just because he’s an amoral piece of s***. I’ll be interested when his actual ‘evidence’ is produced at the Committee. I continue to despise him and the man who gave him such unfettered power.

Remember Alan B'Stard? My OH's recollection from the programme - " The voters? B...ger them. They'll vote for a hatstand if it's got a blue rosette on it."

The question is who is Cummings actually working for?What is his agenda?

Is Johnson really so stupid that he didn’t realise Cummings would be keeping a record of every last detail? If so he’s even more stupid than I gave him credit for, and that’s not saying much.

Dinahmo

Remember Alan B'Stard? My OH's recollection from the programme - " The voters? B...ger them. They'll vote for a hatstand if it's got a blue rosette on it."

...and there are many ( possibly even on GN) who would vote for a hatstand if it had a red rosette on it.? It works both ways Dinah for dyed in the wool voters.

Maybee I think the answer is ‘himself’.

James O'Brien summed the situation up very well on twitter ( apologies if anyone has mentioned this already)

Who do you believe? A scumbag who's spent his entire life lying to wives, mistresses, voters, employers & party leaders or a weirdo who won Brexit by sticking a massive lie on a bus & claims he drove 60 miles with his baby son in the back of the car in order to test his eyesight?

Extract from an article on Marie Antoinette - amazing parallels

‘Cartoons depicted her as a harpy trampling the constitution. She was blamed for bankrupting the country, when others in the high-spending, lavish court bore equal responsibility. Ultimately, she was condemned simply for being Louis' wife and a symbol of tyranny. Thomas Jefferson, minister to France under Louis XVI, famously asserted that if Marie Antoinette had been cloistered in a convent, the French Revolution would never have taken place. Perhaps Jefferson goes too far. Certainly she became a scapegoat for nearly everything that was wrong with France's absolutist, dynastic system.

MayBee70

So why do people think that Rishi who is incredibly rich and is (allegedly) selling off British jobs to India to his wife’s connections represents them in any way?

No idea but people do seem to like him and for some reason he seems to appeal more than others.
Now if it was Starmer against Gove I think he'd have an equal chance.

GillT57

James O'Brien summed the situation up very well on twitter ( apologies if anyone has mentioned this already)

^Who do you believe? A scumbag who's spent his entire life lying to wives, mistresses, voters, employers & party leaders or a weirdo who won Brexit by sticking a massive lie on a bus & claims he drove 60 miles with his baby son in the back of the car in order to test his eyesight?^

The crazy thing is the bus lie wouldn’t have worked without Johnson fronting it.imo if Johnson had tossed that coin and it had told him to support remain brexit would never have happened. Cumming and Johnson had this strange symbiotic (is that the right word) and they’re like two drowning people struggling and dragging each other down into the depths.

Are they not a dreadful duo? Perhaps now we know why Boris was so blindly loyal to Mr C over the Barnard Castle debacle.
They deserve each other, but we don't deserve them, and before anyone asks I didn't vote for Boris because he was already known to be untrustworthy and disloyal. We got Mr C foisted on us.
Have loved the cartoons though - Dom Corleone and Nightmare on Downing St showing slasher Dom. Now I love Demonic and Carrie Antoinette. Thankyou SUZIEWOOZIE.
Carrie Antoinette sounds very scary. I think Boris is afraid of her. How did she get away with spending all that money on the flat in the first place and having someone like her with such poor judgement pulling the Boris strings in the background is alarming.

Lupin tbf Demonic was Iam64 but I am proud of Carrie Antoinette ( although I’m sure others thought of it as well) ?

Well I'm not getting into nicknames again, look where that got me

But reading your post about Marie Antoinette suzie, does that mean that Carrie is also a misunderstood scapegoat?

Symonds is another one who has, in the past, been sacked for wrongdoings. What a parcel of rogues they are.

MayBee70

Symonds is another one who has, in the past, been sacked for wrongdoings. What a parcel of rogues they are.

Birds of a feather - they all deserve each other but we don’t deserve them.

Cummings felt he was above the law during the pandemic, and now he has no role it was not going to take long before he started shouting and pointing to give himself some kind of profile. A figure in the public eye who suddenly becomes powerless invariably has their diary published, telling 'The Truth' (hahaha) as they see it about those who have caused their downfall. An MP's wife has recently printed her scurrilous memoirs and a few weeks ago an MP whose name escapes me also got his diary printed, insulting everyone he had previously worked with. What an attractive bunch - hell hath no fury ...

Alegrias1

Well I'm not getting into nicknames again, look where that got me

But reading your post about Marie Antoinette suzie, does that mean that Carrie is also a misunderstood scapegoat?

Well I think Urm was trying to heap all the blame on her to excuse Johnson . Imo she knew exactly what she was doing but it’s Johnson who is absolutely to blame for anything she ‘talked’ him into. Just like Louis was the King.

Rosina

Cummings felt he was above the law during the pandemic, and now he has no role it was not going to take long before he started shouting and pointing to give himself some kind of profile. A figure in the public eye who suddenly becomes powerless invariably has their diary published, telling 'The Truth' (hahaha) as they see it about those who have caused their downfall. An MP's wife has recently printed her scurrilous memoirs and a few weeks ago an MP whose name escapes me also got his diary printed, insulting everyone he had previously worked with. What an attractive bunch - hell hath no fury ...

Cummings was above the law and it was Johnson who put him there. As for the revelations of others, what about Johnny Mercer last week and his ‘cesspit’ comment ? Couldn’t possibly be the truth could it? The Johnson Supporters Group really do exhibit imo the characteristics of a sect

Don't know why you imagine lefties don't read the right wing press I know LP stalwarts who read the Telegraph.

Perhaps it's just the lefties in my family, then, who might only buy the Mail or Telegraph if they ran out of toilet paper!!

MayBee70

Is Johnson really so stupid that he didn’t realise Cummings would be keeping a record of every last detail? If so he’s even more stupid than I gave him credit for, and that’s not saying much.

Probably

Ps my previous post was for trisher
Don't know why you imagine lefties don't read the right wing press I know LP stalwarts who read the Telegraph.

I'm surprised they mention it - they can't be posting on Gransnet.