AUKUS

I’m surprised that Johnson is able to make such important decisions without consulting parliament.

Does anyone know/have read whether Biden has locked in a future Trump or successor?

MaizieD

Very saddened by the infantile anti-France sentiment expressed by some in this thread. They never seem to have never left the school playground...

‘Twas ever thus

I think France was playing to the home audience with the comments about the UK. Mind you, there is some truth in them.

To be honest I feel for France. They’ve been negotiating in what they felt must have been good faith whilst behind their backs, a huge secretive negotiation was taking place. Oz was putting out feelers. On the Q.T. The whole operation was given a code name and only very limited players were involved.

Whilst I don’t blame Boris for being delighted to be approached and the enormous financial benefit to be gained by the UK it does all feel a bit shabby somehow.

We are obviously flattered to have been asked to form this triumvirate. It cements a more sure footing for Global Britain. But still. Poor France. Macron was SO looking forward to dealing with Biden too instead of Trump. He must be gutted. A double punch in the solar plexus.

But hey. Big business. What do I know? (nowt).

I'm not flattered.

I don't think I am either Alegrais. We are an Aukus family so it should feel good. It feels more like going backwards though.

Ooh, this sounds fancy.

Recognizing our deep defense ties, built over decades, today we also embark on further trilateral collaboration under AUKUS to enhance our joint capabilities and interoperability. These initial efforts will focus on cyber capabilities, artificial intelligence, quantum technologies, and additional undersea capabilities.

HMS Vigil, here we come.

Not fancy, Alegrais. Just that a third of us are Australian, a third British and the other third American. Some have duel nationality. It felt really nice that our wide flung family group now had a name Heaven knows where the GCs will end up.

Re HMS Vigil - worrying thought.

PippaZ

GrannyGravy13

Hopefully it might make China think twice about world domination.

The words snowball and hell come to mind, sadly.

I think you're right.

PippaZ

Not fancy, Alegrais. Just that a third of us are Australian, a third British and the other third American. Some have duel nationality. It felt really nice that our wide flung family group now had a name Heaven knows where the GCs will end up.

Re HMS Vigil - worrying thought.

Sorry, I wasn't getting at you PippaZ, sorry if it came over that way. It was the description of the technologies I was getting at.

Very interesting article in the Guardian entitled “The nuclear Option: why has Australia ditched the French” Australia seems to have been running with the hounds and the hares. They will have to pay substantial amounts to the French for breaking the contract. The French now say they could have supplied nuclear powered submarines which Australia says was the reason they ditched the French deal. It has gone on sometime with different politicians and policies in Australian Government. They also claim the French were late with producing letters let alone submarines.

Difficult to know what to think but I can understand the annoyance on the part of the French.

I can understand also why the Australians may have got very frustrated and fed up but should have been up-front about what their intentions were.

Alegrias1

PippaZ

Not fancy, Alegrais. Just that a third of us are Australian, a third British and the other third American. Some have duel nationality. It felt really nice that our wide flung family group now had a name Heaven knows where the GCs will end up.

Re HMS Vigil - worrying thought.

Sorry, I wasn't getting at you PippaZ, sorry if it came over that way. It was the description of the technologies I was getting at.

I didn't think you were getting at me Alegrais. We really do miss the body language on here don't we.

Apparently the French are as we know furious at what has taken place and have withdrawn diplomats from Australia and the USA.

Asked why they hadn’t withdrawn diplomats from the U.K. they replied that the U.K. “is a 5th wheel in this”

In other words - superfluous.

From my point of view why are we apparently ensuring greater security in the Far East whilst our security in Europe is under threat from our behaviour towards Europe and the knock-on effect towards NATO.

God will Johnson ever get anything right?

Maybe the French ambassador hasn’t been withdrawn because of our military support for France in Mali?

The operation would collapse without our Forces there so maybe they are trying to not upset Boris too much?

Callistemon

I can understand also why the Australians may have got very frustrated and fed up but should have been up-front about what their intentions were.

I’m hoping the next election might see this shower out on their ear. Not keen on the opposition,either, but anything is better than what we have. I feel embarrassed to be Australian just now.

Urmstongran

Maybe the French ambassador hasn’t been withdrawn because of our military support for France in Mali?

The operation would collapse without our Forces there so maybe they are trying to not upset Boris too much?

Yes maybe.

But I am inclined to accept the previous French Ambassador’s explanation tbh.

Urmstongran

Maybe the French ambassador hasn’t been withdrawn because of our military support for France in Mali?

The operation would collapse without our Forces there so maybe they are trying to not upset Boris too much?

The French are pulling out of Mali, announced it several weeks ago.

So on balance, I'm going with the idea that they think we are bit players in the new deal, not worth bothering about.

Macron has no love for the British and will say any old thing.
He will be seething that we are part of something like this, when he wanted us to do badly after we left the EU.
There will be a lot that we don’t know about the contract between France and Australia, and all the why’s and wherefore’s.
Macron was hoping for a wonderful bromance with Biden....how soon that ended.

Biden appears so doddery I'm surprised he can remember being president. When will we stop letting old white geezers from another century and a half ago decide the futures of the world's upcoming generations? Very few younger sharp minded women or men are likely to make it to be world leaders(unless they're of the Putin ilk who simply bumps opposition off!) Who cares if France is "upset" they don't care upsetting us by allowing all the knackered old boats full of refugees set sail from their rubbish strewn shores, do they? Who's breaking the maritime law there then!? We should snipe back at their nasty lies as quickly as they do , were far too soft ( "it's not cricket old boy"- belongs to another life) we need leaders who are prepared to be strong and sweep away these annoying little gnats. Australia needs to be able to have subs of extended dive capabilities to ensure China is not spreading its venom too far in Pacific, they're right on front line and we can do a deal with whoever we so choose now, maybe the French failed to grasp that?

Oh god, stop the planet I want to get off!!
As if the UK hasn't got enough flaming names - UK, GB, England, Britain - for it's tiny size!

The headlines in the U.K. press this weekend did make me laugh a little.
No fireworks , no food on the shelves, no xmas , no meat
but a big new order to build submarines, so hows that going to happen if the other things aren't?

Ali08

Oh god, stop the planet I want to get off!!
As if the UK hasn't got enough flaming names - UK, GB, England, Britain - for it's tiny size!

Just thought I'd point out.... England doesn't mean the same as any of those other things.

Carry on.

I'm not that well informed but wonder if these big powers are thinking ahead and may be preparing for a future made less certain by climate disintegration and the threat to huge swathes of land that is likely to bring. I'd think all-out war is less advantageous than the ability to resettle people from land that's no longer habitable due to flood, drought etc. After watching a BBC doc on drought in Nigeria it's clear that western countries are doing too little to reduce emissions and offer help those in places where the population have contributed very little to the disaster of climate change. I feel we are on the brink of disaster and the alliances only set people against each other when we should be working as a united world to keep this planet habiltable for all.

Perhaps someone can tell us what the Aussies will do if and when China "spreads its venom to far into the Pacific"?