Now is the winter of Britain’s discontent

GrannyGravy13

One thing I do agree with is that the U.K. should not be reliant on a low wage often described as low skilled labour force from abroad.

It is high time that ALL employers paid their employees a decent living wage and took some responsibility to train and up-skill their staff in-house (with a clause in employment contracts that if your employer pays for training then the employee has to remain with that company for a certain amount of time or pay back a percentage of the training fees. This would give the employers some protection from constant training up and then the staff leaving. There would have to be safeguards so that this could not be abused by either the employer or the employee)

I agree that people should be paid a proper rate, but how do you deal with the resultant inflation that is already beginning to show its head?

Because he's a clever chap growstuff and can use words that we plebs don't know, that's what make him suitable to be World King.

Must be that because its certainly not his grasp of facts and ability to make the country a better place to live.

The only reason Marr 'talked over' Johnson, was to stop him what he always does, as in PM Question time in Commons- is to go off at a tangent and NOT answer the question.

The fact there are shortages of HGV drivers in the EU makes it even more unlikely any of them will come to the EU. Where conditions are worse, loads of red tape and delays, and on short-term contracts. If any of them do come- I'd like to know why they have not secured good, long-term contracts in the EU- nearer home and .... as said above!

I thought Tories are in favour of Free market!

Hécatombe - a good French word, that.

GrannyGravy13

One thing I do agree with is that the U.K. should not be reliant on a low wage often described as low skilled labour force from abroad.

It is high time that ALL employers paid their employees a decent living wage and took some responsibility to train and up-skill their staff in-house (with a clause in employment contracts that if your employer pays for training then the employee has to remain with that company for a certain amount of time or pay back a percentage of the training fees. This would give the employers some protection from constant training up and then the staff leaving. There would have to be safeguards so that this could not be abused by either the employer or the employee)

I agree with you. Vocational training and in-service upskilling are a shambles. What has been done in the past to improve it? It should have been high on the agenda over the last five years since the referendum, never mind the years before that. What is happening now was predictable, but was dismissed as part of Project Fear.

PS. Johnson needs to think this through. Driving an HGV and care work aren't low-skilled, but there are low-skilled jobs which need doing. If everybody in the country becomes high-skilled (and pigs might fly), who is going to do the necessary low-skilled work? How is he going to manage the economy, so there isn't rampant inflation caused by wage growth?

Whitewavemark2 there is no pleasing some people.

Would you rather salaries remain low, people reliant on UC and food banks?

Those who oppose this Government have been constantly bemoaning the fact that many people in the U.K. are living in poverty. The way out of poverty is to increase wages.

Interest rates have been at record lows, they will in all probability increase.

More money circulating in the economy provides more jobs and opportunities.

Of Greek origin - a massacre and sacrifice of 1000s of people and animals.

How apt!

Kali2

Hécatombe - a good French word, that.

Apparently, it's originally Greek (no surprises there).

GrannyGravy13

One thing I do agree with is that the U.K. should not be reliant on a low wage often described as low skilled labour force from abroad.

It is high time that ALL employers paid their employees a decent living wage and took some responsibility to train and up-skill their staff in-house (with a clause in employment contracts that if your employer pays for training then the employee has to remain with that company for a certain amount of time or pay back a percentage of the training fees. This would give the employers some protection from constant training up and then the staff leaving. There would have to be safeguards so that this could not be abused by either the employer or the employee)

You really have been voting for the wrong party, haven't you, GG13?

The tories would never do that because it interferes with The Market.

GrannyGravy13

Whitewavemark2 there is no pleasing some people.

Would you rather salaries remain low, people reliant on UC and food banks?

Those who oppose this Government have been constantly bemoaning the fact that many people in the U.K. are living in poverty. The way out of poverty is to increase wages.

Interest rates have been at record lows, they will in all probability increase.

More money circulating in the economy provides more jobs and opportunities.

Wow! You've been listening to Maizie :-)

growstuff you are probably not going to like my answer, but here goes.

Tony Blair started the push for more and more youngsters to go to University when the emphasis should have been split between vocational and academia. Since then there has been a growing trend in the U.K. towards what I call snob-jobs The hospitality industry, building, plumbing, electricians, nursing and care are all worthwhile vocations and have largely been ignored or sidelined for tech, trading and of course so many of our young folks want their five minutes of fame on any media platform.

Schools need to go back to being able to teach vocational subjects not just teaching to pass exams not all children know what they want to do in yr9 when they have to decide their exam options. They need to be treated as individuals not mass education statistics

GrannyGravy13

Whitewavemark2 there is no pleasing some people.

Would you rather salaries remain low, people reliant on UC and food banks?

Those who oppose this Government have been constantly bemoaning the fact that many people in the U.K. are living in poverty. The way out of poverty is to increase wages.

Interest rates have been at record lows, they will in all probability increase.

More money circulating in the economy provides more jobs and opportunities.

Blimey!

More money circulating in the economy provides more jobs and opportunities.

Someone 'gets' it!

But, to avoid inflation, increased wages have to be paid for by higher productivity and/or lower profits.

I don't think that micro managed workers, such as lorry drivers, can actually increase their productivity any further, neither can many other micromanaged employees. And I can't see companies willingly taking lower profits, especially if driven by the need to produce high dividends for shareholders.

And, if a government is determined to take money out of the economy by cutting government spending, as they are already doing, where is the increased earnings for companies supposed to come from?

Not to mention all the business lost as a result of Brexit.

GrannyGravy13

Whitewavemark2 there is no pleasing some people.

Would you rather salaries remain low, people reliant on UC and food banks?

Those who oppose this Government have been constantly bemoaning the fact that many people in the U.K. are living in poverty. The way out of poverty is to increase wages.

Interest rates have been at record lows, they will in all probability increase.

More money circulating in the economy provides more jobs and opportunities.

No of course not but Johnson’s actions of cutting off the supply of Labour at a stroke is causing unnecessary upward pressure on inflation. We already have a lot of pressure from world commodity price inflation, and to add wage inflation at this stage is ridiculous.

Yes of course people should be paid the proper rate for the job, but to suggest that Johnson’s economic illiteracy is the answer is wrong.

The only people who will gain from this are the wealthy who can invest their savings as interest rates rise. The poor will simply get poorer as the continue to struggle with a big rise in the cost of living. There is already an enormous rise as a result of price inflation, to compound it with big wage rises ( someone said this morning 30% in some cases ) is madness.

growstuff whilst I have learnt some very useful facts from MaizieD I have together with DH run a successful SME for 40 years. We have trained in-house and as company have evolved with the times and needs of both our customer base, suppliers and first and foremost our employees.

To follow on from maizie one way to control inflation and history shows it is a favourite of the Tories is to cut the money supply in order to control inflation by raising interest rates etc. The last time this was employed by Thatcher we ended. Up with 3 million unemployed and a stagnant economy .

Whitewavemark2

GrannyGravy13

Whitewavemark2 there is no pleasing some people.

Would you rather salaries remain low, people reliant on UC and food banks?

Those who oppose this Government have been constantly bemoaning the fact that many people in the U.K. are living in poverty. The way out of poverty is to increase wages.

Interest rates have been at record lows, they will in all probability increase.

More money circulating in the economy provides more jobs and opportunities.

No of course not but Johnson’s actions of cutting off the supply of Labour at a stroke is causing unnecessary upward pressure on inflation. We already have a lot of pressure from world commodity price inflation, and to add wage inflation at this stage is ridiculous.

Yes of course people should be paid the proper rate for the job, but to suggest that Johnson’s economic illiteracy is the answer is wrong.

The only people who will gain from this are the wealthy who can invest their savings as interest rates rise. The poor will simply get poorer as the continue to struggle with a big rise in the cost of living. There is already an enormous rise as a result of price inflation, to compound it with big wage rises ( someone said this morning 30% in some cases ) is madness.

So you are against salary increases?

Funny that as I can remember you posting that NHS workers deserved a significantly larger salary increase than the Government intended to award them.

In the meantime, the foreign Press, from Left to Right, and Charlie Hebdo and all political satyre magazines are having a field day. Social media and TV news too. It is not a good look!

www.facebook.com/groups/RemainInTheEuropeanUnion/permalink/3077262885881719/

Good grief of course not, but I am not in agreement of the sort of lunatic economics Johnson is now employing which has shocked the economy and driving some employers to offer as much as 30% extra. Yes perhaps they are worth the extra, but it should be done at a much more sedate pace than is currently the case.

Reply to gg13

Alegrias1

To look on the bright side, I learnt a new word.

Hecatomb

I spotted that too. He can't resist, can he. Man of the people of course

Whitewavemark2

Good grief of course not, but I am not in agreement of the sort of lunatic economics Johnson is now employing which has shocked the economy and driving some employers to offer as much as 30% extra. Yes perhaps they are worth the extra, but it should be done at a much more sedate pace than is currently the case.

Ask yourself. Could your business sustain a 30% or 20% wage increase without increasing your prices?

I just cannot see why anyone can think that paying migrant labour low wages and subjecting them in a lot of instances to living in sub-standard accommodation, with little or no job protection is preferable to paying a living wage to U.K. citizens.

(I am also vehemently against this practise in other countries, particularly the thousands and thousands of acres of poly tunnels in Spain, and it’s atrocious treatment of migrant workers)

Domed again are we ?Oh dear .Myself as did many other GN survived 39-45 is this present situation worse .?

I am absolutely with you on that, but Johnson’s illiterate economics is not the answer.

Whitewavemark2

Whitewavemark2

Good grief of course not, but I am not in agreement of the sort of lunatic economics Johnson is now employing which has shocked the economy and driving some employers to offer as much as 30% extra. Yes perhaps they are worth the extra, but it should be done at a much more sedate pace than is currently the case.

Ask yourself. Could your business sustain a 30% or 20% wage increase without increasing your prices?

I do not have to ask myself that question as all our employees are paid way above the living wage, always have been and always will.

We learned very early on that you get what you pay for, both in goods no workforce.

The hauliers have been paying immigrant drivers as little as possible for the most hours for a good few years, hence the massive drain of U.K. drivers which is wrong on all levels. It’s time for them to pay decent wages and yes it’s down to the U.K. public to realise that everything cannot be supplied as cheep as chips