Sometimes I am ashamed

It should certainly not be a matter of opinion.

BlueBelle

I have told my grandkids (all grown) that if they feel they would be better off in another country to not look back
It has all gone beyond belief some hideous mind sets around full of hate and spite

My father said exactkt that to me in 1987.

So, here’s my semantics. Posters can call it “squabbling” or use any other dismissive description that they like.

A small group of prominent politicians who you do not recognise are accused of calling for women to be killed, which they have never done.

They are accused of being at a rally which they did not attend on the basis of a photograph taken at a whole different rally in a whole different city on a whole different day.

Whatever your thoughts on transgender people, calling a transgender woman a “man dressed as a woman” is despicable and the kind of attitude I thought we have left in the past.

So any evidence for anything you show us in the future Doodledog, will be subject to a bit of disbelief in my mind. And will definitely be thought by me to be a bit "unreal".

The transwoman I've met wouldn't dream of carrying on in the aggressive, deeply unpleasant way that these activists do. They are suffering much more as a result of it.
If only this bill could be more sensibly redrafted and quietly passed. I know. That's a forlorn hope.

If a person looks so very obviously male that it’s a reasonable assumption he still has male genitalia then to me that is a man dressed as a woman.

volver

So, here’s my semantics. Posters can call it “squabbling” or use any other dismissive description that they like.

A small group of prominent politicians who you do not recognise are accused of calling for women to be killed, which they have never done.

They are accused of being at a rally which they did not attend on the basis of a photograph taken at a whole different rally in a whole different city on a whole different day.

Whatever your thoughts on transgender people, calling a transgender woman a “man dressed as a woman” is despicable and the kind of attitude I thought we have left in the past.

So any evidence for anything you show us in the future Doodledog, will be subject to a bit of disbelief in my mind. And will definitely be thought by me to be a bit "unreal".

Ok

I agree. It's sometimes very difficult meeting a not very successful transwoman to take her seriously as one. Nevertheless I do try. It's obviously easier for some men than for others to look particularly female.

A small group of prominent politicians who you do not recognise are accused of calling for women to be killed, which they have never done

They are accused of being at a rally which they did not attend on the basis of a photograph taken at a whole different rally in a whole different city on a whole different day.

Are you telling us that the politicians whose photos are in the picture in the OP were not actually there at that protest, standing in front of those placards but have been photoshopped into the picture?

Did they or did they not attend the protest where decapitation of those who disagree with the aims of the protest they attended was called for?

This is interesting in a way the spread of misinformation...

Some MSPs were photographed in from of offensive signs. Women MSP's by the way.

In a whole different line of discussion, a poster with very strong views which she is entitled to hold, posts a picture of a group of men who she does not recognise, accuses them of calling for women to be murdered and says they were at a rally they never attended.

Try to keep up Callistemon.

Gosh, my spelling.

Anyway, you know what I meant.

Try to keep up Callistemon

Been very busy, I do apologise for not keeping up. You know how it is, Real Life will intrude on Gransnet. [sigh]

B+ Callistemon must try harder.

Some MSPs were photographed in from of offensive signs. Women MSP's by the way

So they were there.
Right in front of the signs urging decapitation of those who disagree with them, but they were not actually holding them.

The Clinton excuse.

They must have heard of Jo Cox, David Amiss, Andrew Pennington (Aide to Nigel Jones) and others.

However strongly held their views, which they are entitled to hold, standing in solidarity with those who advocate terrorist tactics is just plain wrong and they must know that.

Have they lost their senses?

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11664205/Police-investigate-decapitate-TERFs-sign-JK-Rowling-mocks-blindness-posing-politicians.html

Sorry, it's the Daily Mail. Try to get past the comments from the wizard woman and actually read the article.

My point was not that the men were who they were (obviously, as I didn't know who they were). It was that they are men. The fact that men are cheering on another male, and that men are telling women what it is to be female, still stands, whoever the people in the photo happen to be.

I agree that it's even worse if they are politicians, as that lends 'respectability' to the bullying, but that wasn't the point I was making.

Shifting the emphasis to point out that I don't know who the men are' doesn't alter anything I said. I am not a political commentator, and don't claim to know who all politicians are or what they stand for. I was commenting on the current state of gender politics, which I see as very worrying indeed.

Shifting the emphasis to point out that I don't know who the men are' doesn't alter anything I said.

No, it means that you will jump to conclusions about people you don't know anything about and base your claims on untruths.

So, we know where we are, don't we.

Both later condemned the sign and said they were not aware of it as they posed for the picture – which was shared by Harry Potter author JK Rowling to her almost 14 million Twitter followers
Daily Mail

Oh, please 😁

As I said, the Clinton excuse.

Volver I somehow think that if we were all pro trans activism you'd be agin us all!

Meanwhile MP Joanna Cherry, said: 'I'm sure my colleagues didn't realise they were standing in front of a hateful sign threatening violence against women and will distance themselves from it.

Mr McDonald tweeted: 'The violent sign at yesterday's rally is utterly heinous and condemned without question. I suspect it may even be unlawful.

'The moron who made it and is holding it has done those protesting for trans equality and democracy no favours – quite the opposite.'

We can all do selective quoting.

Granny23

The people I have most sympathy for are those who have been living quietly in their chosen gender for years, without causing any harm to anyone. The whole issue has become politicised (eg describing a free vote in the SG, which saw cross party support and dissent as only the SNP's 'Bill') and now embroiled in a cross border stand off. I ask people if they have ever known someone who has transitioned and the answer is usually 'NO' even though I know that there are trans people of their acquaintance - they just have not noticed because it has never caused a problem.

This is the most level headed post on this thread. I am a Scot, I am not ashamed of my country, but I am very alarmed by the lengths that Ms Sturgeon will go to push the only policy she has ie Independence, and how a group of vulnerable people are being used to do so.

Aveline

Volver I somehow think that if we were all pro trans activism you'd be agin us all!

I'm against people who jump on bandwagons or who try to make their cases without really knowing what's true and what's not.

I did wonder if some is argument for argument's sake!! 😁

Anyway, I've said what I think.
Am I allowed to go now?

Granny23

The people I have most sympathy for are those who have been living quietly in their chosen gender for years, without causing any harm to anyone. The whole issue has become politicised (eg describing a free vote in the SG, which saw cross party support and dissent as only the SNP's 'Bill') and now embroiled in a cross border stand off. I ask people if they have ever known someone who has transitioned and the answer is usually 'NO' even though I know that there are trans people of their acquaintance - they just have not noticed because it has never caused a problem.

Yes, I agree HousePlantQueen, it is a sensible post.

Well said, Granny23.

volver

^Shifting the emphasis to point out that I don't know who the men are' doesn't alter anything I said.^

No, it means that you will jump to conclusions about people you don't know anything about and base your claims on untruths.

So, we know where we are, don't we.

Ok

Nice tactic DoodleDog.

I see you.

Message withdrawn at poster's request.